Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister for coming to the House. This matter on the Commencement is something I hope we can all work towards. I ask the Minister to sign a statutory instrument that would allow the sharing of information with the Health Service Executive, HSE, of people's intention to be organ donors. As the Minister is aware, code 115 on the driver licence indicates the person owning the licence has indicated the wish to become an organ donor. At this time, unfortunately, the information is not available to the medical profession. There are currently 2.6 million driving licences held by people in the country issued by the Department. Since the code was introduced through a European directive, over 400,000 licences were issued between 2013 and 2015, and 40% of those, including learner and full licences, indicated a wish to become organ donors.

I was nominated by the Irish Kidney Association and I am well aware of the trauma that families go through when asked in a hospital setting if they would consider donating the organs of loved ones. In most cases they never had the conversation because nobody believes the awful day might arrive when they would be asked that question. It is through huge generosity on the part of a family that so many lives are transformed and saved by those willing to donate their loved one's organs. Information is very important. If families could be informed by organ donor co-ordinators or a surgeon that their loved ones indicated they would like to be organ donors when they filled out the driver licence application, it would make a huge difference to the outcome. It would make the job of the organ donor co-ordinator easier if such information could be given.

It would be quite simple for the Minister to do this and it is a two-step process. I have asked the Oireachtas Library and Research Service to look into what is required and there is no requirement for further legislation. Under the Finance Act 1993, the Minister responsible for transport has the power to make regulations relating to licensing, and the Minister could make regulations stating that the donor information on driving licences relating to organ donations could be recorded on the national vehicle and driver file. That is the first step. The second step would come when the national vehicle and driver file would allow the HSE hospitals or doctors - whoever the Minister feels would be appropriate - to access the information. Currently, the National Transport Authority, the Road Safety Authority, the Courts Service, the Health and Safety Authority and, most recently, eFlow and Applus, which operates the national car testing service, have been given access to that information. Unfortunately, the HSE and its doctors would not have access to the information held by the national vehicle and driver file.

In 2015 the Department assigned a statutory instrument that allowed for those bodies, including those operating road tolls, to access the information. I ask the Minister to simply sign a statutory instrument to allow the health service to access the information currently held by the national vehicle and driver file so as to make it easier for families to come to a decision if asked to donate the organs of loved ones.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I thank Senator Daly for raising the subject. It is a constructive suggestion and like all suggestions it has obstacles that sometimes may not be anticipated but it has merit. I will outline the difficulties but this has enough merit to justify me looking at those obstacles and seeing if they could and should be removed.

Driving licences in Ireland are in a format set at European Union level. They include information marked in the form of numerical codes. Some codes are standard across the EU, but some may be created by member states. Ireland has taken advantage of this facility to allow applicants for a driving licence to opt to have a code 115, which indicates they are willing to be considered as organ donors. I have not heard the suggestion before that the information in question might be shared with the HSE. That does not mean it is a bad suggestion and the definition of a conservative is someone who will not do something for the first time. It is not a reason this should not be done.

It would raise a number of important questions. First, and as the Senator mentioned, there is the matter of data sharing. The Senator is aware that new EU rules on data protection are due to come into effect from 25 May. Among other protections, we would need the permission of the data subjects to share their data. In this case, the difficulty is that people have been asked to indicate, as part of their driver licence application, if they wish to be organ donors. If they do, a code 115 is marked on their licence. However, they have not been asked if they are willing to have this data shared with a third party such as the HSE, and it would not be possible to share it without their consent. It may be possible to add a question to the application form as to whether people consent to the sharing of the information. As a licence is valid for ten years, it would take a decade to work through the system until everyone willing to share their data was covered.

There is also a risk to be considered, which is that people might be more reluctant to volunteer to have a code 115 if they had concerns about their data being shared. I do not know if it is true but it must be considered. What data would be shared? Are we talking about the names and home addresses of people who chosen to have a code 115? Would it include their licence details? We need to think this through. Given the general sensitivity to data security and data sharing, there must be a real concern that the number of people opting for a code 115 might drop. We also need to consider what the societal gain might be in this case. Consequently, there is a significant body of work to be done before this can be answered. Is it intended that the HSE could look up lists of potential organ donors, for example, where a patient died and the HSE wanted to know quickly if the patient had signed on to be a donor? If this is what is intended, there may well be benefits, but I certainly want to hear the HSE’s views on this, as well as those of the Road Safety Authority, RSA, before taking any action.

Taking all of this together, there may be a case for examining whether this should be done but before getting to the stage of asking the RSA to devote any resources to it I would need to be convinced that there was at least some chance of this proposal having advantages for the public. On that matter I would particularly require the initial views of the HSE. I will ask the HSE to give me those views and see if I can progress this proposal in a constructive way. It makes much initial sense and if we can get over the data protection issues, I am prepared to pursue it in response to the Senator's comments.

Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister for his reply and I welcome his positive response. Data protection is clearly a concern for everybody but I am not sure of the small print when one applies for a licence. There is an element of data sharing being signed off as the M50 toll company can now access data, as well as the Courts Service. It is clearly within the gift of the Minister to ensure others have access to data. If we can do it for the Courts Service, the Health and Safety Authority and others, I am sure it could be extended to the HSE.

There is the question of who would access the data. It would not be something general but it would happen when people at the coal face believe somebody is a potential donor. They should be able to find out whether the person had indicated a wish to be a donor.That information could then be used with the consultant informing the family. These are the parameters of what we are seeking. The idea is to assist families in coming to a decision. It would be helpful to have that information available to assist them in ascertaining the intentions of their loves ones.

The Minster has made some valid points but the issues of data protection and sharing of data are already covered in the existing legislation. The issue at this stage relates to the HSE. Ultimately, the public good arising from this comes from lives being saved and transformed. Let us suppose the measure brings about even one extra organ donor per annum. That change alone can transform up to five lives and it would be because of the Minister's action. I recall a line from the Bible, although I have not read the Bible too often. The Book of Genesis says that if a man saves one life, he saves the world entire.

By introducing this statutory instrument, the Minister's influence will be felt for years after he has left office. Lives could be transformed as a result of this important information being shared and that could make a major difference for families and people in the country.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I believe we are talking the same language. Earlier I made reference to whether this measure has advantages to the public. The Senator is right - that reference was undisguised code for the question of whether it saves lives.

I believe this is a potentially life-saving measure and I do not believe it would be right to stand in its way, at least not for any bureaucratic reasons. If there are practical reasons, although I do not see any at the moment, then so be it. However, I believe it would be absolutely wrong, in view of what the Senator has said, if I did not ask my official to open a conversation with the HSE to see if it would be in the interests of the HSE. Moreover, if the HSE agrees with it, then we could proceed, hopefully, to save some lives as a result of this measure.