Dáil debates

Wednesday, 16 December 2009

Priority Questions

Community Employment Schemes.

8:00 pm

Photo of Catherine ByrneCatherine Byrne (Dublin South Central, Fine Gael)
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Question 23: To ask the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs his views on drug users participating in community employment schemes as part of the rehabilitation process; his views on the value of such schemes for recovering addicts and the need for even more incentives to help rehabilitate them; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [47013/09]

Photo of John CurranJohn Curran (Dublin Mid West, Fianna Fail)
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I strongly support the participation of recovering drug users on community employment schemes as part of the rehabilitation process. I am aware of the importance of such schemes in the recovery paths of many and I wish to acknowledge the role played by FÁS in that regard. Recovering drug users participate, for the most part, in special drugs-related CE projects, though some participate in mainstream CE schemes. The adjustments made for special drugs-related CE projects aim to facilitate the rehabilitation process.

The report of the working group on drugs rehabilitation, which was chaired by my Department and which reported in 2007, recognised the contribution made by CE and made a number of recommendations for improvement. These included a greater focus on the health and education requirements of participants, the expansion of the number of available places from 1,000 to 1,300 and greater inter-agency co-ordination to meet the overall needs of the participants.

Progress on these areas is being addressed through the national drugs rehabilitation implementation committee, NDRIC, chaired by the HSE and on which FÁS is represented. At the same time, FÁS has re-convened a CE working group on drugs-related projects, involving representatives of the various sectors who are working towards improving the overall outcomes for participants by having a sharper focus on inter-agency working, access to schemes, training and development opportunities, supervision ratios and opportunities for onward progression.

Special drugs-related CE projects are, of course, only one part of the rehabilitation effort. Effective delivery of rehabilitation requires an overall inter-agency approach based on a continuum of care that operates within the context of enhanced case management and a quality standards framework. It also involves addressing the broad needs of individuals, across medical support, training and employment, education, housing, prison-related issues and family-related issues. This broad approach is being encouraged through the work of the NDRIC, which has representatives of all relevant Departments and agencies, as well as the voluntary and community sectors. I have also established a residential rehabilitation group, chaired by my Department, to better co-ordinate the integration of the provision of residential rehabilitation services across the sectors.

Under the national drugs strategy 2009-2016, I will meet twice a year with a number of Ministers and various senior officials who are involved in implementing various key actions in the strategy. As part of my emphasis on rehabilitation, I will meet with both FÁS and the senior rehabilitation co-ordinator, who is based in the HSE, in this process. Last week I met with the director general of FÁS and had a very worthwhile exchange, with agreement on the need to focus on outcomes. I also met with the senior rehabilitation co-ordinator in the last few days and we discussed developments to date and approaches to expediting progress in the months ahead. Progress on rehabilitation will also figure prominently at the quarterly meetings of the oversight forum on drugs, which I chair. This forum will review progress across the strategy and will address any operational difficulties and blockages that arise. I believe that the structures we now have in place will facilitate significant progress on rehabilitation over the period of the strategy.

Photo of Catherine ByrneCatherine Byrne (Dublin South Central, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State for his reply. I am pleased that his heart is in the right place on this issue.

I bring the Minister of State back some months to when he visited the Liberty recycling place in Bluebell, Ballyfermot. He gave a speech and commented on how important the service was, especially for people going through addiction who were trying to get their lives back onto some kind of path. There is hope for them.

Last Monday after the "Would You Believe" programme which feature Liberty Recyling, I visited the place again. The President of Ireland came to see the operation and the 50 people working there, all of them on CE schemes. What came across from the President's speech was how important it is for all of us as a community to ensure that people who really want to get their lives back together are supported as much as possible. I know the Minister of State is fully supportive of this.

The difficulty about these projects is that they are very short-term. For the number of years Liberty Recycling has been going, since 1999, everybody who has come in on a CE scheme has been short-term only, working for three years. There might be the odd 55 year old who is able to stay for four years. What happens then is that the person is thrown back into the wilderness where it is very difficult for him or her to find a job, especially at this time. At the time of the "Would You Believe" programme a girl worked in the office who had to leave because her time was up. The Minister of State probably saw her. I felt very angry because she had a real opportunity to stay there for another while, participating in that project, perhaps coming out in two years' time, in better condition than the way she is leaving now, and with more hope. She is going out now into a workforce where very many people are seeking work.

The Minister of State said he supports these schemes. Will he and his Government support them by trying to put in place a longer term for community employment schemes, especially for people in projects like this one? It is very important for them. As the Minister of State said, it is about education and health but is also about companionship and being part of a small community, namely, the CE workforce. It is when they are sent out into the bigger, wilder world that such people can fall down.

I ask the Minister of State, through his Government, to consider giving these people a longer work time and help them stay within these projects, fulfilling what they want to do, going out into the world eventually to take on their role again and be part of society.

Photo of John CurranJohn Curran (Dublin Mid West, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy for her contribution. I believe these particular CE schemes are crucially important, both for the individuals and their families but also for people who have a drug addiction because they are given hope for the future. I recently met Mr. Paul O'Toole, the director general of FÁS, to discuss this. A point the Deputy might not realise is that there are 1,000 ring-fenced places but until recently only 700 to 800 people were taking them up. We were not able to get the 1,000 people. That is a piece of work but we have improved. Since I became aware of these factors we have worked hard. Those who go onto these types of courses, who come from a background of addiction, need a degree of pre-preparation before they can go onto the CE schemes. I asked FÁS specifically to start looking at and monitoring the individuals who come in. Some drop out at early stages so there are a number of issues.

The schemes have huge potential. Deputy Byrne asked specifically whether those who had completed three years could be retained longer. From an ideological point of view I do not have a hang-up about that but have one concern. In itself, community employment is not the answer. It is a stepping stone and I do not want the focus to be taken away from that.

In my reply I mentioned the continuum of care. It is greatly important that a person should have a degree of preparation before going onto a CE scheme. The time spent in CE does not mean only doing that particular job but is a preparation for progression. One of the problems I constantly encounter dealing with drug-related issues is that sometimes we do not look at progression. We think providing more of the same is sufficient but it is not. We need to have higher expectations and goals by which we can move people along successfully and incrementally. The steps may be small but step by step they will move along.

In that regard, I view the weakness not as the three-year period but that we need to have clearer paths so that when a person completes the three years on CE there will be somewhere to go. I also emphasised that the period prior to going on to a scheme is equally crucial because I am aware some people enter CE schemes and do not last long on them. That is due to being ill-prepared and so forth. At both ends of the three-year period there is a piece of work to be done which falls into the category of continuum of care. I view CE schemes as being crucial for real rehabilitation for former drug users.

Photo of Séamus KirkSéamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
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Before we move to Ceist 24, I wish to discourage Members, and indeed an t-Aire Stáit, An Teachta Ó Cuív, from making long contributions. I ask them to make their answers short and succinct as possible.

Photo of Catherine ByrneCatherine Byrne (Dublin South Central, Fine Gael)
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With all due respect, it is 9.50 p.m.

Photo of Séamus KirkSéamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
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That is the point.

Photo of Catherine ByrneCatherine Byrne (Dublin South Central, Fine Gael)
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We have waited all day, if the Ceann Comhairle understands me. May I respond to the Minister of State's reply?

Photo of Séamus KirkSéamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
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Very briefly.

Photo of Catherine ByrneCatherine Byrne (Dublin South Central, Fine Gael)
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I agree entirely with the Minister of State. We do not want to see people's work being prolonged on a CE scheme. However, these are very different people. They have a real need and hunger to be part of a community and sending them back in to communities where there is no work is not good. Even if it were only a matter of extending those schemes for a further five years we could give people a proper chance to get back where they should be. We send them out into a workforce where thousands of people are unemployed, including people leaving college with degrees. What hope have these people got if they are sent away from a three-year scheme?

Photo of John CurranJohn Curran (Dublin Mid West, Fianna Fail)
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As I said, I met with FÁS to ask the organisation to review the workings of this scheme and in that context I shall keep this matter under review for Deputy Byrne.