Richard Bruton (Dublin North Central, Fine Gael)
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Question 65: To ask the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the number of working and non-working women respectively who have personal or occupational pensions; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [26169/07]

Phil Hogan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael)
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Question 66: To ask the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the steps he will take to facilitate women forced out of employment due to the marriage rule to avail of contributory pensions; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [26174/07]

Bernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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Question 83: To ask the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the steps he will take to fulfil the commitment in An Agreed Programme for Government to ensure women are treated fairly in terms of pension provision; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [26172/07]

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Question 98: To ask the Minister for Social and Family Affairs if he will award credited contributions for old age pension purposes to persons who have been carers for a protracted period; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [26240/07]

Emmet Stagg (Kildare North, Labour)
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Question 104: To ask the Minister for Social and Family Affairs his intentions on the awarding of credits to home-makers and other carers for years spent on caring duties in circumstances that are not covered by legislation; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [26290/07]

Martin Cullen (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 65, 66, 83, 98 and 104 together.

The most recent figures published by the Central Statistics Office for supplementary pensions coverage relate to the fourth quarter of 2005 and showed that 50.6% of women in employment had private or occupational pensions, a significant improvement on 2002 when 44.6% of women had such coverage. Based on these figures, we can estimate that there are approximately 475,000 women in employment with private or occupational pensions and 464,000 without such coverage. No statistics are available regarding pensions coverage for those outside the workforce.

The results of the Quarterly National Household Survey are useful in tracking the overall pension coverage rate, but there is a lack of qualitative data on people's attitudes to pensions and on the differences between male and female uptake levels. This was recognised in the national pensions review published by the Pensions Board in 2006 and a commitment was given by the board to do follow-up research.

The board is finalising its research on this matter and hopes to publish its findings by the end of the year, which will form the basis of the information sought in the questions. The research involves a comprehensive survey on pension uptake and the behaviours behind it. The survey is, to the knowledge of the board, the largest of its kind undertaken and will provide fresh data on pensions coverage and information to draw out the reasons contributing to below-average coverage rates among women.

Many women in the private and the public sectors left employment upon marrying because they were required to or it was the societal norm at the time. Women who left the workforce through the operation of the marriage bar were primarily public servants who were not insured for social welfare pension purposes. Their loss of pension rights relates more to their occupational positions rather than social welfare pension entitlements.

The Government is anxious to ensure that as many people as possible can be accommodated within the social welfare pensions system with due regard being paid to the contributory principle underlying entitlement to contributory payments and the need to ensure that resources are directed to those most in need. In the past ten years, means tests have been improved and qualifying conditions for contributory payments made easier.

I published the Green Paper on Pensions on 17 October. It includes a full discussion on the issues raised by the Deputies. To address these issues, the Green Paper covers a range of reforms, including the use of universal entitlements and backdating the home-makers scheme.

My Department is carrying out a technical review of the entire social welfare code to examine its compatibility with the Equal Status Act 2000, as amended. This will identify any instances of direct or indirect discrimination on any of the nine grounds under the Act, including gender, sexual orientation, marital status and family status, that are not justified by a legitimate social policy objective or where the means of achieving that objective are either unnecessary or inappropriate.

Olwyn Enright (Laois-Offaly, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister for his reply. I appreciate that the report will contain some of the statistics I seek, but will it detail the age categories of women who take up pensions? It would help to inform the House as we proceed with the Green Paper's provisions.

I will probably be referred to the Green Paper, but does the Minister intend to take steps to incentivise the uptake of personal pensions among women, particularly younger women? The Minister shares my concern regarding the large number of female employees in low-paid employment, such as in hotels and restaurants. They comprise a vulnerable category. Are there plans to target such employees through advertisements or promotions? May I ask another question?

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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I will revert to the Deputy.

Martin Cullen (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
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The Pensions Board has been doing what the Deputy has suggested. She identified a key sector in which pension penetration is poor, namely, general hospitality. Many women are employed in that sector and the awareness and uptake of pensions therein is among the poorest by a long way.

The report of the Pensions Board will be the largest and most fundamental of its kind and is due by the end of the year. It will consider all pension issues, including specific issues relating to women. These matters are also addressed in the Green Paper, which must form part of the debate during the coming months.

Róisín Shortall (Dublin North West, Labour)
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I compliment those involved in drafting the Green Paper because it is an excellent document, but some of the pressing pension issues will be deferred for a minimum of one year or, in all likelihood, longer. We cannot afford that.

The Minister accepts that there is a specific problem in respect of women, as nearly 90% of women working in catering have no supplementary pensions. Does the Minister accept that, from a policy perspective, the reliance on tax-based pension schemes will not do much to help people in these categories of employment? Does he accept that the current system of tax relief given at the top rate up to a substantial limit militates against the women in question and other people on low incomes or who have taken time away from the workforce to perform caring duties? From a policy perspective, there has been no equity to date in the approach to tax relief.

Martin Cullen (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
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The situation is more complex than that and I would not accept that we are putting everything on the long finger. In recent years, investment in the National Pensions Reserve Fund has been significant and innovative. Many European countries would like to do the same. The investment in the social welfare system and the increase in the non-contributory pension in recent years have been significant.

The Deputy addressed precisely the complexity of the points raised in the Green Paper, namely, how to deal with the issues in the long term. I do not have the answers with me. I have a number of ideas, but I must interact with the social partners and all of the stakeholders in the system. I worry that everyone will approach the debate with vested interests, namely, to pay as little as possible and leave the problem for someone else. If that is the approach, we will get nowhere. The debate must be comprehensive and get buy-in from trade unions, employers, the financial markets and the State. Only in that context can we address specific issues. For example, not only is there a poor take-up of pensions in the hospitality and tourism sectors in which many women are employed, but the level of pensions awareness therein is one of the lowest.

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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I wish to allow a number of Deputies to contribute.

Martin Cullen (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
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The Pensions Board has embarked on this campaign. The awareness of pensions has risen dramatically in the past number of years and will continue to do so.

Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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I am mindful of the Minister's previous response in respect of targeting those most in need. In this context, does he not agree that the current tax incentives surrounding pension provision are skewed in the interests of those who are able to afford pensions or are the most well off, with a resultant significant cost to the Exchequer, and that they are ineffective policy instruments in terms of addressing the needs of the lowest paid workers, many of whom are women?

Is the Minister mindful of the average earnings of women? They are some 15% less than their male counterparts across the board. In terms of pension provision for those most in need and for the greatest swathe of women workers, does the Minister agree the current policy of open-ended tax incentives, which is certainly the case for those in the most well off sector, has not served us well?

Martin Cullen (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
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Incentives through the tax system are a legitimate part of a package of measures to encourage people to take up pensions. We need to get many more people to take up pensions, particularly young people joining the jobs market. I have said this publicly and clearly. People must see a pension as an asset and as desirable as owning one's own home. The SSIA scheme was a specific type of programme and would not solve a person's pension requirements for 25 or 30 years, so it is not the answer. However, the SSIA scheme demonstrated that if one makes something clear and tangible to people and allows them to see their asset, they are more likely to participate in a scheme. The question is how we can bridge the gap in people's understanding of their pension needs, get them to invest and help them view a pension as a mobile asset. If people change jobs, that pension must be a mobile asset belonging to them. That is one of the issues we must address in the debate surrounding the Green Paper.

Seymour Crawford (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
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As the Minister said, this is a complex issue and there are many problems, especially concerning women. I refer to farming——

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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A questions please, Deputy.

Seymour Crawford (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
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Yes. Is the Minister examining the situation whereby farmers' wives have been carrying on the business of farming, while in many cases the farm is taxed only in the name of the husband? This must be addressed. Does the Minister have a figure regarding the number of women dependants involved in the pension scheme who were forced to give up their jobs in earlier years? The Minister recently said 47,000 people were on non-contributory social welfare pensions but 30,000 of those were women. How many of those were forced out of jobs? Self-employed people need to be dealt with and properly advised. Is the Department making any effort to do that?

Martin Cullen (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
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There are no statistics available on those affected by the public service marriage bar. However, the requirement to leave work on marriage also applied in many private sector areas, where it was customary. The Department estimates that approximately 30,000 women do not receive support through the social welfare system in their own right or as qualified adults.

Regarding farming, at the launch of this Green Paper I made it clear that we cannot begin this debate on an exclusive basis. It must be inclusive so that all elements in society must be included in the debate.

Seymour Crawford (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
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What about the self-employed?

Martin Cullen (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
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All workers, self-employed and PAYE, who join the jobs market at 18, 19 or 22 years of age must participate and be accounted for in the overall context of how we will deal with pensions as a society over the next 30 or 40 years. As we know, the starting age is increasing while the retirement age is decreasing, which means we are being squeezed at both ends of the scale.

We are fortunate that this window, albeit short, to deal with this is available to us, unlike the UK, Germany and other countries where the demographics have changed significantly to the rates we have. We have six people working to support each pensioner, but within 40 years that will change to almost one to one. Those entering the jobs market now will be in that position in 40 years' time.