Dáil debates

Tuesday, 16 October 2007

Ceisteanna — Questions.

Freedom of Information.

2:30 pm

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Question 4: To ask the Taoiseach the number of freedom of information requests received by his Department since January 2007; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [16817/07]

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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Question 5: To ask the Taoiseach the number of freedom of information requests received by his Department since June 2006; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [18788/07]

Photo of Eamon GilmoreEamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Question 6: To ask the Taoiseach the number of requests received by his Department under the Freedom of Information Act 1997 in the first eight months of 2007; if he will provide comparable figures for the same period in respect of each year since 2002; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19882/07]

Photo of Bertie AhernBertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 4 to 6, inclusive, together.

I propose to circulate in the Official Report the information requested by the Deputies on the statistics regarding freedom of information requests received in my Department.

All FOI applications received in my Department are processed by statutorily designated officials in accordance with the 1997 and 2003 Acts and, in accordance with those statutes, I have no role in relation to processing individual applications.

Freedom of Information Applications Received in the Department of the Taoiseach
YearJanFebMarAprMayJunJulAugSeptOctNovDecTotal
2002201214101091087131518146
2003212930101171364263142
2004182415330121545
2005231227655165761
200691476445533354
200714184269101

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I note that the Standards in Public Office Commission made a request for the power to appoint an inquiries officer into allegations of wrongdoing without a prior public complaint and that the request was shot down.

A report from the Office of the Ombudsman, Ms Emily O'Reilly, described the consequence of the increase in fees for freedom of information requests as breeding a culture of secrecy. Why has there been a refusal to accept the Ombudsman's comments? The fees for requests under the freedom of information legislation is the highest in the developed world. In view of the general fall in the number of requests for freedom of information, will the Taoiseach reconsider the level of fees charged? In view of the Ombudsman's comment on the culture of secrecy, does the Taoiseach intend to relax those regulations somewhat?

How many Departments accept electronic payment for requests under the Freedom of Information Act? That is something that should surely be technically achievable today. When an appeal is successful, why does the successful applicant not get his or her fee refunded? If someone pays money to make a request that is turned down, but appeals the decision and the appeal is then granted, that person is deemed eligible to receive the information yet he or she must still pay. Is there any chance of having a refund of fees for those whose appeals are successful?

Photo of Bertie AhernBertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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It is done by different countries in different ways. It is not correct to say that we are expensive when compared with other jurisdictions. It is not done in exactly the same way by other jurisdictions, but on examination of the totality of what is done, there are very high fees in some countries.

The extension of the Act to public bodies is an ongoing process that has been undertaken by the Department of Finance. Last year the Act was extended to cover another 137 bodies, which means it now covers 520 bodies in total. Arrangements are currently under way in the Department of Finance to prepare an extension of the Act. It covers a broad section of the public service and bodies practically everywhere are covered.

While the issue of fees is a matter for the Minister for Finance, there has been no change in fees since the 2003 Act. The Minister has made it clear that he has no plans to review the fees. The current system of fees introduced more than four years ago followed a review of the Act introduced almost ten years ago. The fee is €15 and the estimated average administrative cost at that time for processing each application was €425. The estimate will have changed in the interim four years due to salary costs. Nobody can argue that this fee is unreasonable or that it discourages FOI requests. There is no charge for the time undertaking in making a decision on the FOI request, even though this is quite expensive. Most other jurisdictions have a charge for the time that goes into the processing of a decision. It is not in the up front cost, but is added in later and that makes the cost much higher than ours. After we brought in the original Freedom of Information Act, there was a huge demand for information. The number of requests declined in 2002 and 2003, but there was a 30% increase in 2005 from the previous year. That upward trend has continued.

An internal appeal costs €75 while an appeal to the Information Commissioner costs €150. There are €25 and €50 reductions for medical card holders. Appeals concerning personal information are entirely exempt from fees, so if the issue is related to someone's own circumstances then that person pays nothing at all. A person who appeals to the Information Commissioner receives a preliminary decision, which is a fairly good indication of the final decision. Even at that late stage of the process the person seeking information can withdraw the appeal and obtain a full refund of fees. About 30% of appeals made to the Information Commissioner are withdrawn. People see what way things are going and they pull back. The whole thing is sympathetically dealt with and there has been no decision to look at costs at this stage. If there was such a decision, the Department of Finance would probably go the other way.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I refer to the requests received since January 2007. What is the nature of the cases that have been refused by the Department of the Taoiseach? Are they commercially sensitive or do they pertain to aspects of national security in which that Department might be involved? Under what circumstances would an applicant for a freedom of information request be turned down by the Department? Although I had thought I would get him out this year, the Taoiseach has been in office for a good few years. He has been in office for a while. According to his analysis, do such refusals fall into certain categories that are apt to be, or appropriately, refused? The Taoiseach should comment in this regard.

Photo of Bertie AhernBertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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The significant majority of requests to my Department, that is, approximately two thirds, or more than 60%, are from journalists. Approximately 25% are from business interests, while Oireachtas Members have submitted 5% of applications. Normally, there are refusals in respect of requests that are not appropriate or for which there is no information. Very few are security sensitive or pertain to that issue. Sometimes the list contains a partially reported request. This is because of the information that was available.

I refer to the extensions made under the 2003 Act. Although it was thought it would make a big difference at the time, there has been very little. I refer to certificates issued under section 25 which are made mainly by the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform and which do not apply to my Department. Very few are made. I understand approximately three section 25 certificates have been issued across the entire system, none of which has been issued in my Department, and they were security related. However, this tends not to be the case in my Department.

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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Does the Taoiseach agree that more must be done to inform citizens of their right of access to information from his and other Departments? For example, the Information Commissioner confirmed recently that next of kin had a right of access to the medical records of their deceased loved ones. Does the Taoiseach agree this constitutes an essential right for there to be a degree of public confidence in the health service?

In her report earlier this year the Information Commissioner also stated every public body should draw up and implement a comprehensive records management policy and urged that this should be seen as a priority. She also stated there should be consistency in searches for records by public bodies and that a checklist should be used for this purpose. In respect of the Taoiseach's Department, her report stated decision letters, when issuing, should always set out the requestor's right of review and appeal and include detailed information relating to the nature and locations of the searches carried out. Will the Taoiseach inform Members whether the Information Commissioner's recommendations made earlier this year have been implemented in his Department and whether there has been similar application in other Departments?

Photo of Bertie AhernBertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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While I cannot speak for other Departments, the reports of the Information Commissioner are followed up in my Department. To the best of my knowledge, they are implemented in all cases but certainly the advice is followed. The charter for dealing with the public that was discussed in the House last week sets out the regulations and the procedures to be followed in making every effort to give information in a fully comprehensive way. The Deputy inquired whether a checklist was used. While I am unsure whether a checklist is used, the charter is followed. The designated civil servants deal fully with freedom of information matters in each Department. In my Department any issues raised have been followed up comprehensively.

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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I will respond briefly. I know the Taoiseach answered only with reference to his Department as it is the Taoiseach's Question Time, but he mentioned that he cannot speak for any other Department. Is that because of the restriction of Question Time to matters pertaining to his own Department, or is it the case that, although he is the Prime Minister, he actually does not know whether any other Department has followed up on the recommendations of the Information Commissioner?

In relation to the issue of decision letters, can the Taoiseach confirm to the House that it is the practice in his Department to include the information recommended by the Information Commissioner? In other words, do the letters clearly outline the searches undertaken and specify the locations in which these searches have been carried out?

Photo of Bertie AhernBertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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The reason I do not have information on other Departments is that I am not the member of the Government designated to deal with FOI. The entire system is regulated by the Department of Finance. However, every Department, including the Department of the Taoiseach, must follow the guidelines set down in this area. In my Department, each section has designated officials, separate from the political system, who follow the recommendations of the Information Commissioner.

Photo of Eamon GilmoreEamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Can the Taoiseach tell us how many FOI applications were made to his Department to date this year?

In her commentary on the Freedom of Information Act and how it is operating, the Information Commissioner drew attention to seven other countries which have similar FOI legislation to that of Ireland. She pointed out that in none of these countries is a fee charged for an internal review of a decision, which corresponds to an appeal in our system, and that in only one jurisdiction is a fee charged for an appeal to the Information Commissioner. Is it not the case that the fees payable in Ireland — €15 for an application, €75 for an appeal and €150 for an appeal to the commissioner — are designed to discourage people from applying for information under the Act?

Photo of Bertie AhernBertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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Over the past few years the Department has averaged around 50 cases per year and this year the number will rise again. In 2004, 2005 and 2006 there were 45, 61 and 54 cases, respectively, and this year so far there have been 55, so there are already more cases than there were last year. The final figure probably will be around 70.

When the FOI system was first introduced, the Department dealt with around 140 cases per year, but at that time the system was being used by companies to obtain information for business reasons. That is partly the reason for the introduction of fees. Other countries have different systems. When considered in terms of the amount of effort, commitment and time allocated to FOI requests, I do not believe the fees are excessive. It should be noted that if a request is about one's self, for example, personal information or family records, there is no charge. It is only when the request is in a different area that the fee is applied. It is a fair system and I do not believe it is expensive.

Photo of Eamon GilmoreEamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Is the Taoiseach telling us that €15 a throw will dissuade companies from making FOI applications?

Photo of Bertie AhernBertie Ahern (Dublin Central, Fianna Fail)
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It does stop people from making "trawling" requests across several Departments, which was common at the start. Rather than making targeted requests, they submitted large numbers of requests in order to dig up information that could be used commercially. When the fee of €15 per request was introduced, they were persuaded not to do this.