Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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The third issue in the name of Deputies Naughten and Stanley is very close to my own heart. I welcome the Minister for Communications, Climate Action and Environment, Deputy Richard Bruton.

Denis Naughten (Roscommon-Galway, Independent)
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Local Deputies, including Deputies Eugene Murphy and Stanley, met representatives of the Bord na Móna group of unions yesterday. They informed us that the company is currently borrowing money from day to day to pay its staff. The public service obligation finishes for Lough Ree power station on 9 December and for West Offaly power station on 31 December. The situation is completely unsustainable. We are facing an economic catastrophe across the middle of Ireland in just 68 days, with the loss of 2,000 direct jobs and another 2,000 jobs that are dependent on the wage packets of these employees. We need the Minister to take three urgent and immediate steps. The Government must make a clear and unambiguous statement reiterating its support for the co-firing of the two plants with both peat and biomass as per the unanimous request to the Minister made by all Deputies for the area in Tullamore last July. The Minister must immediately call in the chief executives of Bord na Móna and the ESB to get absolute clarity on the intention to submit a new planning application for West Offaly power station and to deal with the 3 million tonnes of milled peat that are currently on the bogs and have the potential to cause serious environmental harm if not removed from the bogs. The Government must immediately release funds from the climate action fund to start the rehabilitation of the decommissioned bogs across the midlands. I have written to the Minister directly on foot of correspondence I have received from the Taoiseach, who is supportive of the release of funding from the climate action fund to start the rehabilitation and allow for immediate employment of staff in Bord na Móna across the midlands.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Deputy Naughten. He is always spot on with his speaking time, which I appreciate.

Brian Stanley (Laois, Sinn Fein)
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I thank the Acting Chairman. I acknowledge that he was also present at yesterday's meeting. The unions asked me to call that meeting last week. I believe it was very fruitful. We are facing a dire situation in respect of Bord na Móna. There are huge problems and it is facing a perfect storm. Workers are uncertain. They are not sure whether they will have jobs in two or three weeks' time, let alone in two or three months. Senior management has said that seismic changes will take place. This will have a very significant effect right across the midlands, particularly in Laois and Offaly. As the previous speaker said, the public service obligation, PSO, for the two peat-burning stations at Shannonbridge and Lough Ree will end in December. There are 3 million tonnes of fuel on the bog. I am advised that no price per tonne has been agreed with the ESB for that fuel. An Bord Pleanála has refused permission for co-fuelling at Shannonbridge. The licence for that ends in December 2020. No judicial review of that decision has been sought. We raised this issue with the Minister on 30 July, when we met him in Tullamore. The future of the briquette factory in Derrinlough is also threatened because it needs modernisation and also faces threats arising from carbon tax increases and smokeless fuel bans. With regard to the horticulture sector, Coolnamona and Kilberry are hanging by a thread. Peat is stockpiled on the bogs; I saw it again last Sunday. The decision by the British retailer, B&Q, to refuse compost partially composed of peat also poses a threat. Workers in Laois and south Kildare cannot be thrown on the scrapheap either.

What is needed is €30 million from the climate action fund to secure jobs and to commence the rehabilitation of bogs. This needs to be done and we need a proper plan for each bog. As part of a just transition, we need to finance the voluntary severance fund because we have workers who have no work. We need investment in alternative employment and training and upskilling in new industries. We also need to protect reasonable conditions of employment and to underpin the company's pension scheme. This is very important because there are almost more pensioners than workers with Bord na Móna because of the historical context in which Bord na Móna employed multiples - many thousands more - of what it does now. Time is of the essence in this regard.

Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)
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I thank both Deputies for raising this issue. I am aware of their intensity of feeling in this regard. I will just say a few things. Just transition is at the very heart of the climate action plan and Government has recognised that those who are most exposed to the impact of the climate transition that is under way have to be protected and that we have to support people. The co-firing plan was Government policy and was supported. It would have allowed for a phased withdrawal from peat. The result of the decision of An Bord Pleanála is being intensely reviewed. I point out to Deputy Stanley that judicial review is a very particular type of challenge to a decision. It relates to a failure in procedures. Clearly, that is different from what is now being assessed, which is whether a planning application can be made which would meet the requirements of the board. That is what the ESB is currently evaluating.

As the Deputy knows, the first thing I did when this information became public was not only to meet with the public representatives, including the Deputies, involved, but to meet with the worker directors of the company, the Oireachtas Members representing the midlands, the midland regional transition team, the regional enterprise team, and the regional skills forum. I recently also met with representatives of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions. On foot of our July Cabinet meeting, we have set up an interdepartmental group, led by the Department of the Taoiseach, to work on the just transition plan, that is to say, to prepare for different contingencies that may arise in this context. That work is ongoing. There will be several strands to the Government's approach. There will be elements of diversification within Bord na Móna. I acknowledge Deputy Naughten's submission which dealt with particular elements of that diversification. There will also be a focus on an accelerated programme of bog restoration. Many recognise that this is an area on which we can work, perhaps not only in respect of Bord na Móna bogs, but bogs further afield. There is also a need for other regional initiatives in respect of urban and rural enterprise developments that can support the transition not only for the individual workers concerned, but for the wider communities.

I assure the Deputies that Government is giving this issue very intensive attention. In addition, we have secured agreement that the midlands will be part of the platform for coal and other carbon-intensive regions. A team from the EU will be visiting to provide advice on the supports that may come from that direction. At this point, the EU has not committed to any funding in this regard but the new Commission is certainly looking at it more favourably. I recognise that we have to show our capacity to breathe reality into the words "just transition" for those working in the midlands and for the many people who are dependent on those workers as part of the operation of the midlands economy. We are working on the issue. The Deputies' raising of it is timely. Deputy Corcoran Kennedy also raised it last week. I understand that there is intense concern about these developments in the constituencies involved. I assure the Deputies that it is getting very considerable attention from Government as we prepare for the contingencies that might arise.

Denis Naughten (Roscommon-Galway, Independent)
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By Christmas Day, 2,000 people across the midlands could be without a job, with a further 2,000 people looking to the New Year in despair in light of the likely loss of their own jobs. Will the Minister give a commitment here, on the floor of the House, that he will bring in the chief executives of the ESB and of Bord na Móna and provide the public with absolute clarity with regard to a new planning application and what is to be done with the 3 million tonnes of peat currently on the bog? Will he clarify to the House that we have already missed the boat with regard to a judicial review, because the date has now expired, and that we are now talking about a new application? We are all committed to a just transition, but it must be backed up by cash. Cash must be put into next week's budget to implement that just transition. It must be provided next week, not next year or the year after. We need to put a just transition plan in place. It should be something along the lines of the plan in place in Spain, where the coal industry is being decommissioned. I will present the Minister's office with a copy of that plan. It could be used as a template for doing what urgently needs to be done across the midland counties.

Brian Stanley (Laois, Sinn Fein)
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I concur with what the previous speaker has said; time is of the essence. What we heard about the situation yesterday demonstrates that time is not on our side, as those of us who have been following the issue and making representations on it know. We are literally trying to catch up by 25 or 30 years. As has already been said, this issue needs to be dealt with in the budget next week. With regard to the climate action fund, funding needs to be released. Workers need some certainty. They do not know whether they will have a job in two, three, or four weeks' time. That is the reality. I have met workers in the last week who do not know. We declared a climate emergency; we accepted that we have one. Bord na Móna is now part of that emergency. The programme for Government says that "The Departments with responsibility for Agriculture and Energy policy will explore, with Bord na Móna, the potential of energy crops, which can be grown in the vicinity of Bord na Móna plants". I have been hammering this issue for years. Has that happened? Is that under way? The Minister needs to sit down with the CEOs of Bord na Móna and the ESB, because the two companies are linked on this issue, in order to set out a way forward, of which the Minister can then inform us. He needs to make a statement regarding co-firing as it is Government policy to co-fire peat and biomass. The Government needs to give a clear policy direction with regard to biomass, biogas, wind, solar, and forestry. These are the new industries that will be needed to replace peat.

Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)
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I assure the Deputies that I have already met with both CEOs. The ESB in particular is intensively assessing its options in light of An Bord Pleanála's decision.

The decision An Bord Pleanála has made has been made in respect of west Offaly. The application from Lough Rea is with Longford County Council. Edenderry has permission for co-firing up to 2023. That was not clear from the contributions.

I am very much aware that this is a serious threat and that we have to take it seriously. We must seek the best outcome for the workers. I have met them and am very much aware of their concerns and expectations of work based on the co-firing approach. If that approach cannot be adopted, we need to consider the contingencies associated with replacing it for the workers involved. We are examining all the options to ensure we will be in a position to make decisions in the interest of the workers and the region and in the context of the climate action plan on which we are working. I assure the Deputies that this is a top priority in my Department and that it is receiving the attention it deserves.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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The next issue is in the name of Deputy Kelly, who wishes to discuss the decision to move the new Tipperary-Clare regional Garda headquarters to Ennis. Will the Minister of State, Deputy Canney, be taking it?

Seán Canney (Galway East, Independent)
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If Deputy Kelly wants to wait for the Minister, that is fine with me.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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The practice in this House is that a relevant Minister answers the questions. I mean no disrespect to the Minister of State, Deputy Canney, but he is not a Minister in the Department of Justice and Equality. If he were a Minister of State in that Department, it would be fine. As a former Minister, I know that all Ministers' first duty is to this House. I believe there are four Ministers in the Department of Justice and Equality. There are certainly three. Where are they?

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I am deputising as Chair and I have no responsibility for the Minister or Ministers of State.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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I am not saying that.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I advise the Deputy to take it up with the Ceann Comhairle. This has arisen before. All I can do is advise-----

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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I mean no disrespect to the Minister of State, Deputy Canney, who is a fine Minister of State in his own area, but to be fair he will only be reading a script. This is about a very serious issue, namely, the loss of the regional headquarters of An Garda Síochána in Tipperary. They are being moved to Ennis. To be fair to the Minister of State, although he knows my county well, he would not have knowledge about this topic. I have many serious questions. I find it extraordinary that the Department of Justice and Equality cannot honour this House by having a Minister available to deal with such a serious issue.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I understand the Deputy's frustration. It is not the first time this has happened. All I can say is that I will talk to the Ceann Comhairle. I now ask the Deputy to proceed.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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No. I will not be proceeding. This is disrespectful to the House.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I am here chairing. If the Deputy does not wish to raise his matter, I will suspend the House for the next few minutes.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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That is fine. I am entitled to make my point. I mean no disrespect-----

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I allowed the Deputy to make his point.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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I mean no disrespect to the Acting Chairman. There is no point in my coming in here to raise a topical issue if there are Ministers available and if not one has the courtesy to answer a serious question pertaining to his or her Department. It is just not acceptable. The custom and practice here is that if a Minister from the Department is not available, the Department contacts the person asking the question, in this case me, to seek agreement on another arrangement. That never happened. This is insulting to this House and to me as the questioner.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I do not dispute the case the Deputy is making and I understand his frustration but if he wishes to withdraw his issue, he may do so now.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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What is the point in asking my question? I mean no disrespect to the Minister of State who is present, Deputy Canney. What is the point?

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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I presume that if the relevant Minister is not available, a Minister of State takes the question. We do not like it but that is the procedure.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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The procedure is to make a Minister of State from the relevant Department available. In this scenario, none of the three Ministers of State seems to be available. In this case, the procedure is that the questioner should be asked whether it is acceptable for another Minister or Minister of State to take the question. I was not asked. I expected to have a Minister from the Department of Justice and Equality here today. It is the norm.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy has made his point. If he wishes, he can defer the matter. I cannot do anything else for him.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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I understand that. I have no issue with the Acting Chairman. What I am saying is accurate. This is insulting and wrong. That the Department of Justice and Equality could not bother its backside to make one Minister or Minister of State available, or extend to me the courtesy of telling me they were not available, reflects on how seriously it takes the issue of policing in County Tipperary. I would like to know where the Ministers' diaries are. I would like to know where they all were today. They had not the courtesy to come into this House and talk to the people of County Tipperary, through their public representative, about why these policing changes are being made in the county. I will not be proceeding with my topical issue. I mean no disrespect to the Minister of State who is present. It has nothing to do with him at all, to be fair to him. Through the Office of the Leas-Cheann Comhairle, who has just entered the Chamber, I wish to find out why a Minister or Minister of State was not made available or why his or her absence was not communicated to me beforehand.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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As I said, I totally understand the Deputy's frustration and can see the point he is making. I will talk to the Ceann Comhairle.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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It is more than a point. It is the custom and practice.

Eugene Murphy (Roscommon-Galway, Fianna Fail)
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We are not going to start arguing over words. All I can say to the Deputy is that if he wishes to defer his matter, he should do so and take the matter up with the Ceann Comhairle. I will also speak to the Ceann Comhairle about it.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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I thank the Acting Chairman.

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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To clarify what was said by the Acting Chairman, Deputy Eugene Murphy, if a Minister or Minister of State from the relevant Department is not available or will not be available, it is normal to tell the Office of the Ceann Comhairle.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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Did it happen in this instance?

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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I cannot say categorically but I doubt if we were told. If we had been, the officials would have dealt with it. It is the Deputy's right to request a deferral. I will ask the Ceann Comhairle to consider the matter for tomorrow or the next day the Deputy is available.

Alan Kelly (Tipperary, Labour)
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I thank the Leas-Cheann Comhairle.