Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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7. To ask the Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection when persons who have been adversely affected by the contribution band changes for the State pension in budget 2012 are to have their payments reinstated and reimbursed; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [1848/18]

Peter Burke (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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14. To ask the Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection the status of the public consultation aimed at resolving the inequities in the averaging system for the State pension (contributory); and if she will make a statement on the matter. [1880/18]

Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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18. To ask the Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection if a report on the pension inequality which resulted from the 2012 changes to pension eligibility has been prepared; if the report will be published; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [2024/18]

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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I know the Minister spoke at length on this issue earlier. This morning a group of civic society bodies, including Age Action, the National Women’s Council of Ireland, the Irish Countrywomen’s Association, Fórsa, SIPTU, Active Retirement Ireland and Pensioners for Equality are all demanding that the Minister take urgent action. Unfortunately, the Minister was not present for Report Stage when I got an opportunity to try to amend the recent Social Welfare Bill so that this would be addressed in 2018. I ask her to expand on what she is now preparing to do on foot of a Cabinet decision.

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 7, 14 and 18 together.

The current rate bands applying to the State pension (contributory) were introduced in 2012, replacing the previous rates introduced in 2000.

The rate bands prior to 2000 were less generous, and the improved rate bands introduced in 2000 were a feature of the economic and political environment at that time. The economic crash changed the focus and while other payments were reduced as a result, the core rates of the pension, on which many pensioners were solely dependent, were maintained. Instead, the rates for people who had additional means and lesser PRSI contribution records were reduced.

The 2012 rate bands more closely reflect the social insurance contributions history of a person than those in place between 2000 and 2012. The current rate bands still provide pensions to people which are not proportionate with their level of contribution. For example, a person with only 20 years of contributions over a 50-year working life will still get an 85% pension. It is estimated that, to revert to the previous bands from January 2018, would result in an annual cost of well over €70 million extra in 2018, and this annual cost would increase by an estimated €10 million to €12 million each year thereafter.

It should be noted that, even accounting for inflation, people affected by the 2012 rate-band changes receive a higher rate of payment now in real terms than they would have at the start of 2007.

The national pensions framework proposed that a total contribution approach should replace the yearly average approach to the calculation of the State pension (contributory) from 2020. I hope to start a consultation process regarding this reform shortly. Following the consultation period, a proposal to Government will be submitted seeking approval of the new approach.

This reform will make the rate of contributory pension more closely match contributions made by a person. It will also have significant homemaker's provisions that will assist those pensioners who spent significant periods caring for their children or adults with a caring need.

The main aim of Government policy on pensions is to ensure that pensions are affordable, sustainable and hold their value in the coming years. The planned reforms will result in a more inclusive and fairer pension system for all citizens.

My Department has examined in depth various options that may provide some relief to those who would have a higher contributory pension had the rate bands not been amended in 2012. My officials have done extensive work and I take this opportunity to thank them for that. We have completed a report on this matter, which I intend to bring to Cabinet sub-committee A on Thursday at 2.30 p.m. Following that meeting, and subject to any necessary amendments and further discussions, I will bring the proposal to Cabinet on Tuesday and I will publish the report thereafter.

I hope this clarifies the matter.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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Again it seems we are producing reports, holding consultations and so on. In reality, as the Minister is aware, up to 40,000 of our senior constituents have lost out very badly in the 2012 changes. The Minister said it was part of the political and economic environment at the time. It was an environment with which I profoundly disagreed and I voted against it. The Minister also had the opportunity to vote against it, but she did not.

Over those years, those mostly senior women workers have lost a significant amount of money because of this. I note the first thing the Minister said about pensions is that they have to be affordable. The reality is that a grave injustice was done to that cohort of women workers. As I said to the then Taoiseach, Deputy Enda Kenny, almost a year ago, he let down his own generation and treated them badly. They lost a significant amount of pension to which they were entitled. As Professor Alan Barrett of the ESRI said, the Government changed the rules of the game in the middle of the game for that cohort of mostly senior women workers. A grave injustice has been done. We know the reality and the facts. It is more than a year since Maureen Bassett produced her great report on this injustice for Age Action. We have been talking about it for a year. What does the Minister propose to do?

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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I call the Minister.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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Does she have the support of the Minister for Finance, Deputy Donohoe, for restoration of the pension?

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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I call the Minister to respond to the first supplementary question after which there are others.

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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We are not at cross-purposes. We have had this conversation with a variety of Members of this House on a variety of occasions. I acknowledge that some people were adversely affected because of the averaging system introduced in 2012. I have also acknowledged that we will fix it. The report with my proposals is ready to go to the Cabinet sub-committee tomorrow afternoon. If I get agreement there, it will be brought to the Cabinet for discussion and approval on Tuesday. I can give the Deputy no more details than that. That is what I said before Christmas; that is what I said earlier this morning; and that is what I am saying now again.

The Cabinet sub-committee A is meeting at 2.30 p.m. on Thursday and mine is the first item on the agenda. Following the discussions there I will bring the report to the Cabinet meeting. I will publish that report on Tuesday and the Deputy will be able to see its contents.

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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I call Deputy Aindrias Moynihan, who has a question in this group.

Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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The injustice that was introduced with the 2012 changes needs to be addressed as quickly as possible. I recognise that the Minister has prepared a report on it. We need a clear timeline and roadmap for how things will be corrected. Every week people are losing out on income and every week more people are being hit by those cuts. It needs to happen sooner rather than later. I understand that the report will be brought to the Cabinet sub-committee tomorrow. In the event that the committee is not satisfied with it, will she publish it?

When the Minister requested that report, did she focus only on the people who will become eligible in future or did she also focus on the people who have already been hit by these cuts going back to 2012? In requesting that report, did she also ask for homemakers to be taken into consideration? A clear roadmap needs to be set out in the interests of those hit by the 2012 cuts.

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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I am sorry to have been smiling at the Deputy, but it is a case of déjà vubecause his colleague asked the same question about an hour ago. I assure the Deputy that there will be a roadmap. If an agreement is reached this week or next week, it will be very clear what we can do and when. I again say that it will involve new money that I do not currently have.

The Deputy asked whom we looked at when doing the report. We looked at everybody who has already been affected. I do not know who might be affected next month or next year until they apply - they probably do not know. Therefore, I can only look at the people currently on the books. I have an estimation of the people who will be affected. Obviously, whatever changes we make will affect the people who have already been affected and affect people who have not been affected yet.

In answer to the Deputy's second question, the homemaker's credit is not part of the anomaly relating to the people who have had a reduced pension because of the averaging system over their lifetime. Therefore, it does not form part of the report whatsoever. The report will be published on Tuesday and the Deputy will be able to see clearly what we have looked at and the options to be put to my Cabinet colleagues on Tuesday.

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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We will have two further supplementary questions followed by one response.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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The Minister had the opportunity to remedy this injustice in budget 2018.

This work could have been done before. I raised it with the then Minister and now Taoiseach and with the previous Taoiseach. I also raised at the Committee on Budgetary Oversight the question of what could be done to remedy this, but it did not seem that the Minister for Finance was very forthcoming. As such, I ask again whether the Minister has the support of the Minister for Finance and whether she expects the support of his Department to remedy the injustice done to this cohort of women workers. Is finance available in the 2018 budget to make the changes which should be made and which have worked out overall at a basic €10 million a year? It was done purely and precisely on the grounds of budget cutting which the Government in office from 2011 embarked on, continuing the policies of Fianna Fáil. That has happened over eight or ten years. Will the Minister provide the House with a guarantee that we will see the full restoration of this and an end to this injustice next week?

Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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I cannot overemphasise the need to remedy this injustice as quickly as possible. I thank the Minister for the detail she provided. It is good that the report will be published next week. Will there be an opportunity to debate the report once it is published, either here or at the sub-committee, or will the Minister be in a position to implement changes immediately? She mentioned earlier that after 2020, a total contributions scheme will be in place. In the event that people find that the new system is not as favourable to them as what is now in place, will they have the option to switch from one to the other to ensure they get the maximum pension available?

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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Flattery will get the Deputy everywhere, which I say tongue in cheek. I cannot tell the House that I have the support of the Minister for Finance because he does not know what I am going to propose and will not until I sit at the Cabinet meeting tomorrow.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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The Minister talks to him, does she not?

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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Did the Deputy say I should talk to him?

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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I said she does talk to him.

Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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We are very fortunate to have the first draft of this here.

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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The Minister, without interruption.

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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I talk to him but I have not put the proposal to anybody. The proper protocol, as I learned through lack of experience before Christmas, is to go to the Cabinet sub-committee and that meeting takes place at 2.30 p.m. tomorrow. Depending on the outcome of the meeting, the proposal will go to Cabinet on Tuesday. We can discuss the report for as long as Deputy Moynihan wishes.

Aindrias Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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I do not want to delay it. I do not want to discuss it forever.

Pat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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The Minister, please.

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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It will not delay it because, to answer the question for a second time, it involves new money. As such, the money required does not exist in the current 2018 budget. I hope there will be no need for a discussion because I hope the Deputy will be as happy as I might be if it gets accepted on Tuesday. In any event, if he wants to talk about it, that is no problem.