Dáil debates

Wednesday, 15 November 2017

Ceisteanna - Questions

Cabinet Committee Meetings

2:40 pm

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

3. To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on Cabinet committee F on national security. [47898/17]

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

4. To ask the Taoiseach when Cabinet committee F on national security last met; and when it will next meet. [48129/17]

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I propose to take Questions Nos. 3 and 4 together.

The role of Cabinet committee F is to keep the State's systems for the analysis of, preparation for, and response to, threats to national security under review and to provide for high-level co-ordination between relevant Departments and agencies on related matters. The Cabinet committee will allow greater ministerial involvement in preparing for and managing major security threats.

The committee last met on 9 November 2017. It is expected that the committee will meet again early in the new year.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I presume the Taoiseach has heard the news that France has won the competition to host the world cup. President Macron or whoever managed to get in ahead of South Africa even with the recommendation. It has made a very difficult end to a disappointing 24 hours for Irish sport generally. We pay tribute to all of those who made an effort and put a huge effort into preparing our national bid for it.

With regard to the Cabinet committee on national security, does the Taoiseach think it will become a trend that prior to every meeting a photograph will be taken of the members who will attend and that it will be tweeted? I would appreciate the Taoiseach's thoughts on this because one might say a storm is not a security issue but sometimes the national security committee might have to meet because of a terrorist or ISIS threat. I am interested to hear what the security advice is on this. It may not be a huge issue but in some respects it is an interesting development.

For a number of years, the number one risk identified in the national risk assessment is cybersecurity, due to the probability of an incident and the likely scale of impact. The Minister for Health is adjacent to the Taoiseach, and perhaps due to some luck the health system escaped the last attack, which hit the National Health Service in the UK. It is fair to say our critical infrastructure remains exposed to a cyberattack. Will the Taoiseach indicate what has been done to address this recently? Has he agreed to support President Macron's reasonable proposals to promote the issue of cybersecurity?

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I note the Minister for Housing, Planning and Local Government - and we all know who attended because of the tweet - attended the security meeting. It came a month after Storm Ophelia caused such devastation in our country. The Taoiseach will recall the day after the storm I raised with him in this House the matter of clear guidelines for employers on what they should do in the event of a status red warning. The widow of one of those tragically killed during the storm spoke last week. Pamela Goss called for no ambiguity on this issue. Has the Taoiseach reviewed the situation since? When will he be in a position to present guidelines? Because of climate change we do not know when the next disastrous storm will arrive on our shores. We need clarity on what every aspect of our society should do in the teeth of a red alert.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I call Deputy Ó Caoláin very briefly.

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I would like to ask a couple of questions.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We have just two minutes left.

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Does this new committee complement the role of the existing national security committee or is it replacing it? While there has been, probably understandably, the need for confidentiality in respect of the work of the national security committee, last week the Taoiseach, as Deputy Martin has referenced, tweeted a picture of those present at a meeting of the Cabinet committee. Surely this is unprecedented and an unwise thing to do in the circumstances. Certainly it suggests to me, with all respect, the Taoiseach is more Trump than Trudeau. Will the Taoiseach please outline the accountability and scrutiny mechanisms in place for overseeing the role of the committee?

From a justice and equality committee point of view, there has been some mention in recent times, in light of reform of the Garda, of the possibility of establishing an overarching more structured agency with responsibility for security. Will the Taoiseach outline his view on this?

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I have heard the recent news that France has been successful in its bid to secure the Rugby World Cup for 2023. Obviously on behalf of Ireland I am very disappointed at the decision. I do not regret for a second putting forward the bid. Ireland put forward a very good bid and we would have hosted a really good tournament had we had the opportunity to do so. I particularly thank the IRFU, officials in Departments, the GAA and others for their work in putting the bid together. I congratulate France on winning the bid. It will put on a fabulous tournament. It has our congratulations.

The membership of the national security committee is separate to Cabinet committee F. Cabinet committee F involves politicians and the national security committee does not. The membership of Cabinet committee F is public knowledge and is not a secret and certainly not a national security issue. I recall the first meeting of Cabinet committee F had the RTÉ cameras in to pan a shot of the people at the table, which garnered no comment whatsoever at the time yet a tweet has garnered so much comment. It says a lot about some people's terror and fear of modern media that it is perfectly acceptable for the RTÉ cameras to come in and pan a shot of a Cabinet committee meeting, as they have done for decades, and yet a tweet is somehow a threat to national security. It really does demonstrate the terror some people have of modern communications. They just do not understand, do not know what it means, cannot cope and even think it is a threat to national security. Never have I seen a criticism scrape the bottom of the barrel more so than such nonsensical criticism.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The Taoiseach needs to relax a bit.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

When the United States conducts or has just conducted a major military operation-----

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Or foreign policy.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

-----it sends photographs from it. I am subjected to plenty of ridiculous criticism-----

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Cybersecurity.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

-----but that is the most ridiculous that I have seen. I thought, when I saw the initial tweet from Deputy Lisa Chambers, it was a joke and I laughed. I cannot believe people take it seriously.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The time is up now so we must conclude.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

He is on a roll.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It is demonstrative of the terror that people have of modern communications.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It may be, but we are out of time.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The fact it is perfectly acceptable-----

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Will the Taoiseach answer some of the questions?

Photo of Billy KelleherBilly Kelleher (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

At the risk of being repetitive-----

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We have to conclude.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

RTÉ cameras can come in and pan a Cabinet meeting or Cabinet sub-committee meeting and nobody comments but somebody uses modern technology and it is a threat to national security.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The Taoiseach is blazing a trail.