Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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9. To ask the Taoiseach the proposals he is considering to expand the scope of statistics being collected and reported relating to employment and wage levels beyond those required for OECD comparisons. [17336/16]

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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The CSO collects and reports on a number of statistical outputs relating to employment and wage levels. These include the quarterly national household survey, which is the official source of estimates of employment in the State; the job-churn related statistics from administrative data sources that explore the flow of jobs and workers between firms and within and between sectors, which began in 2012; the monthly unemployment statistics, which began in 2015; the earnings, hours and employment costs survey, which is the official source of short-term earnings and labour costs estimates in the State; and the new structure of earnings survey, which is planned to be published before the end of July 2016 and which will include detailed structural earnings for 2014.

These statistics will be primarily based on linking existing administrative records and survey sources rather than primary data collection.

The above outputs fulfil a number of national demands as well as meeting Irish requirements in the context of European statistical legislation governed by EUROSTAT, the official statistical office of the European Union. The harmonised European statistical requirements generally mirror those requirements of other international organisations such as the OECD and the United Nations.

The CSO is continually engaging with national and international stakeholders to assess the relevance and scope of statistics on employment and wage levels. Where gaps are identified, the CSO will consider proposals to expand the scope of the statistical domains, subject to resource constraints and burden on respondents.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Chief Whip for her reply. The question is to ask the Taoiseach the proposals he is considering to expand the scope of statistics being collected and reported relating to employment and wage levels beyond those required for the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development comparisons. While extensive work has been undertaken by the CSO on employment and various methodologies are used, significant work is required on wage structures across the economy, especially at the lower end. Up to 600,000 people earn wages of less than €30,000 and it would be useful if specific work could be undertaken on wage levels, especially low to middle income wage levels in the economy. There is a view across western Europe and developed economies that there is a growing disparity between corporate incomes and those of workplace employees and between different sectors. In the financial and technology sectors prospects are far better, but wages have been reducing in the retail and manual sectors.

It would be useful if statistical work was also undertaken on the impact of the minimum wage on overall wage levels. While the minimum wage has brought up wage levels, there might be an argument that in some sectors employers have brought incomes down to meet the minimum wage. It has been my view that in the hospitality sector, for example, over a decade or so that happened, in essence, in many jobs and that once the minimum wage was set, incomes for certain posts came down to meet it. Very little work has been done on that point. We need to critically analyse the wage structure within society and the economy because much academic work undertaken points to the fact that wide gaps are opening up. There are people on very high incomes but the middle income group is declining as well. That is happening in the United States and in most developed economies. It could be a feature of globalisation but ultimately it is having an impact on the nature of democracy. The issue could be the subject of a particular statistical analysis by the CSO. Will the Minister of State ask the CSO to give consideration to that?

Did the Minister of State say there is no proposal to expand the scope of statistics being collected and reported relating to employment and wage levels beyond those required by the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development comparisons? My understanding from the reply is that the status quowill prevail? Could the Minister of State indicate whether that is the case?

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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The final line of the reply outlined that the CSO is continually engaging with national and international stakeholders to look at how we collect data and the best value we can get from data. As to whether we would consider expanding the scope of statistics being collected, the answer is "Yes, we will". When new opportunities are put to us, they are evaluated based on the cost of collecting the data versus the return. One such example is a pilot that is currently being undertaken by the CSO, which was established in the second quarter of this year, namely, the minimum wage quantum survey, the details of which will probably be released later on this year. It might go some way towards establishing the kind of information Deputy Martin seeks - that we all seek - on the basis of the kind of wages that are paid and for what contract hours, to establish whether they are if-and-when contracts, zero-hour contracts or continually 20-hour or 40-hour week contracts.

1 o’clock

While a real effort was made to impart the information to me, much of what is done is based on sampling surveys, as opposed to conducting a detailed analysis of every single worker in the country because obviously that would not be cost-effective. However, the trend obviously is something of which the Government is aware and is tracking. It will be interesting to look at the detailed data that come out of this second quarter pilot survey on the exact quantum of the wages and it will be fed back to the Deputy as soon as possible. There is also a lot of the other stuff the Central Statistics Office, CSO, seeks to track with regard to the living wage and its interaction with the Low Pay Commission. Obviously, it is something on which the office is working but it is open and willing to consider both international best practice and changes it would be necessary to apply here arising therefrom and any suggestions people in this House and beyond might have. However, it must be cost related to the benefit of the data we get back on a statistical level.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the reply and would be interested in the minimum wage quantum survey referred to by the Minister of State. She might indicate when Members can expect it to be completed. On the Minister of State's point regarding the sampling methodology, essentially the surveys she mentioned earlier such as the household quarterly survey, the earnings hours and so on all are sample-based surveys. She might revert to Members at a later stage, but what would it take to conduct a proper research-based statistical analysis involving primary data? I ask because the State carries out a census and when I was Minister for Health long ago, I was involved in initiating the longitudinal study to provide long-term data to inform policy on children and young people. That was a long-term commitment made by the State at the time. Likewise, there is a case to be made in respect of wage and employment structures. What would it take for a full-blown primary data procurement approach to understanding them fully? While sampling can give a good indication, it also may miss things along the way. The Minister of State may respond at a later stage as to what it would take to go outside the box and take a form of approach other than just a sampling approach.

Gerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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There is a race to the bottom. There is a huge argument for workers' rights, and as part of all this, when there is a deliberate effort to promote a low-wage economy, one must have best practice and I welcome the Whip's assertion that the CSO will look at other suggestions in this regard. Best practice is needed when it comes to comparing wage levels here with those in the OECD and elsewhere.

Are we dealing with Ceist Uimh. 7, faoi child care, feasta?

Seán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Are we dealing with Question No. 7?

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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No, Question No. 9.

Seán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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Question No. 9 only.

Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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I thank Deputy Adams but do not agree with him that there is a race to the bottom. There obviously is a flux and a change with regard to the economic climate that has being dealt on the country for the past ten years and certain people have taken advantage of that. However, it is the job of the Government to make sure it puts in place policies that recognise people do so and fix it.

In response to Deputy Micheál Martin, I expect the quantum survey results to be available by the end of the year and, as soon as I receive them, they will be laid before the House and will be available to the Deputy. This morning, I asked the very question asked by the Deputy as to why one cannot simply approach an organisation such as the Office of the Revenue Commissioners, which collects all the data with regard to people in employment. It was explained to me it is not quite as simple as that because although the Revenue Commissioners are charged with collecting tax, they do not collect the exact data that would be necessary to provide the statistics the Deputy and I would need. It was brought to my attention that, thankfully, almost 2 million people are employed in Ireland and to conduct a survey of a size that would provide exact statistical data would be an enormous task. On an annual basis, the CSO conducts a survey with 30,000 businesses, which is a mammoth task for it to do each year. The CSO explained to me that, in Swords, the office is working with 2 million pieces of paper - perhaps it was 200 million pieces of paper - arising from the census results and, consequently, it would be an extremely large project to ascertain the wages and standards of each employee in the country. That is why the CSO works on statistical trends because obviously there is a huge variance between the cost of obtaining the information on the 2 million employees and what can be done with samples. However, as soon as I have to hand the results from the quantum survey, I will give the Deputy the nod and will let him know when it is ready.

Seán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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We will move on to the next question.