Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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55. To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht his views on whether the various restrictions now being placed on turf cutting here will lead to a situation where turf cutting will cease to exist. [44627/13]

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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The Government does not believe that turf cutting should come to an end on all bogs and is not following a strategy that would result in this outcome. Peatlands make up more than 20% of the State’s terrestrial area. They are of considerable economic, social and environmental value and therefore must be managed with care. Within weeks of coming into office, the Government decided to draw up a national strategy on peatlands conservation and management to deal with long-term issues such as land management, restoration, conservation, tourism potential, carbon, accounting and community participation in managing this resource.

This national peatlands strategy is currently being prepared with oversight by the Peatlands Council and with input from relevant Departments, agencies and semi-State companies. It is intended that a draft of the strategy will be published this year and comments of the public will be sought on its contents. The strategy will be broad-ranging. Among many other issues, it will address the regulation of turf extraction within and outside protected areas and should dispel unfounded fears that the Government wishes to end traditional turf cutting in Ireland, while also making clear that Ireland’s peatlands must be managed in a balanced way. This balance involves conservation in certain areas, protecting traditional rights - and the owners of those rights - and having in place the appropriate systems that can respond to new challenges as they arise, whether they come from changing agricultural practices, pressure from development, water quality issues and so on.

In addition to the overarching national peatlands strategy, work is also progressing on the preparation of a national raised bog special area of conservation, SAC, management plan to consider the management of Ireland's 53 raised bog special areas of conservation and the review of raised bog natural heritage areas, NHAs. I intend to publish these documents in draft form in conjunction with the national strategy.

These initiatives will provide an appropriate policy response to managing all of Ireland's peatlands for the future. They are being developed in a collaborative fashion with the assistance of the Peatlands Council and will be subject to further broad public consultation once drafts are published before the end of the year. I urge all those with an interest in the management of the peatlands to avail of the opportunities to participate in shaping that future.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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I can only conclude the Minister did not write that reply himself, because it does not tally with what turf cutters on Moanveanlagh bog in the Listowel area have told me he stated at a public meeting there on the future of turf cutting. According to five people who the Minister knows, who attended the meeting and to whom I have spoken, the Minister stated at that meeting that the State eventually would own all the bogs and turf cutting eventually would stop. The Turf Cutters and Contractors Association have been warning people for a long time that this issue does not simply concern 53 so-called special area of conservation, SAC, bogs but would eventually result in a further 75 being affected from the beginning of next year, as well as the hundreds that are proposed NHAs. Our conclusion was that it was the ambition of the present Administration eventually to wipe out all turf cutters. The Minister can imagine our alarm when we heard from a group of turf cutters - at least the Minister told them the truth - that he had informed them that all turf cutting eventually will stop. Did the people who attended the meeting hear the Minister correctly? Five minutes before entering the Chamber, I spoke to the person who chaired that meeting, just to verify this because it is rather hard to believe the Minister would say such a thing, and he verified it. I understand he is an acquaintance of the Minister.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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First, that is completely inaccurate. I acknowledge this is coming from a second source and not from Deputy Flanagan but it is absolutely and totally inaccurate. I was invited to a public meeting on Moanveanlagh bog, which up to 100 people may have attended and I was very upfront with them. I was very truthful to them just as I have been from the outset of this entire discussion.

Some people do not seem to be able to understand the truth, what is accurate and so forth. I was very clear with them about the 53 raised bogs, that the consultants were anxious to come down and consult them - but they did not accept that proposal - that we were reviewing the natural heritage areas, NHAs, and that I was coming up with conclusions. I was very clear on this and that turf-cutting on all other bogs would continue.

Nobody ever at any stage said that this was the end of turf-cutting in this country. When Deputy Flanagan is addressing public meetings perhaps it is convenient for him to say that to stir up emotions and so forth but what I said was very clear. We are currently considering three strategies, as the Deputy demanded in a motion tabled in this House. I am doing exactly what he asked for, namely, we would draw up a strategy for the 53 raised bogs with a view to perhaps allowing cutting in a few of them and to allow for restoration as called for in the Deputy's motion. The programme for Government gave a commitment that we would review the NHAs and move towards preparing a management plan for those bogs and that review is coming to a conclusion. The Deputy's organisation is a member of the Peatlands Council and his organisation agreed and signed up to stop cutting turf in June 2011 but then it withdrew from that in September and it has not engaged since. I appeal to the Deputy as public relations officer of the TCCA to ask it re-engage in this process.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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I found it interesting that the Minister when answering Deputy McLellan's question referenced the fact that something was private property. I was delighted to hear him recognise that concept because the lands he is talking about are also private property. If he thinks that adopting an ostrich-style approach to this will solve it, it will not. Of of the 9,000 turbary rights holders on the so-called 53 special areas of conservation, SACs, fewer than 1,000 have signed his final agreement, the one that finalises matters that the Minister said was not final. In terms of the 30,000 turbary rights holders and landowners on the NHAs, the Minister has not solved anything in that respect. Fewer than 1,000 of the 39,000 have been solved and the Minister thinks he can bulldoze ahead with this.

When the Minister was asked on our local radio station did he notify these people, and we should remember that he cares about private property, he said they were "probably notified". I imagine that response would not be very strong in court. He also went on to blame the previous Government, and he can blame it for many things but he cannot blame it for signing in the regulations that his Government signed in. As for who do I believe, I believe the people in Moanveanlagh because all the way along the line they have told us the position as it is.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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First, we are not taking property from anybody, the people will retain their bogs in the 53 raised SACs.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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And the liability associated with them.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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As regards the court, there was a court decision recently that again supported the Department from the point of view of informing people-----

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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The Minister should bring me to court then if he is so-----

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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That is probably where the Deputy wants to go.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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Why not let us test the law?

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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Obviously, he wants to get more publicity.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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Test the law.

Peter Mathews (Dublin South, Independent)
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Only half a minute remains for this question.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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If the Minister was that sure about this he would have done that already.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Flanagan does not seem to realise that breaking the law is unacceptable in this country.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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What law have I broken? Prosecute me if I have broken the law.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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There is European law and there is Irish law.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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The Minister should prosecute me if he thinks think I have broken the law.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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It is my responsibility here as a Minister to enforce the law.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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It is the Minister's duty to prosecute me if he believes I have broken the law.

Peter Mathews (Dublin South, Independent)
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Deputy Flanagan, please.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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Obviously, that is what Deputy Flanagan wants. I repeat-----

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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Clearly I have broken no law. That is the-----

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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Is the Acting Chairman in control of this Chamber?

Peter Mathews (Dublin South, Independent)
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I am in charge.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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The Acting Chairman should not allow this. I did not-----

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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-----only conclusion to which one can come.

Peter Mathews (Dublin South, Independent)
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We are moving on to the next question.

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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Prosecute, put up or shut up.

Peter Mathews (Dublin South, Independent)
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Deputy Flanagan, please.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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In conclusion, this House makes law. As Minister, I have to ensure that the-----

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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Where is the law that I am breaking?

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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-----law is enforced.

Peter Mathews (Dublin South, Independent)
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Deputy Flanagan, please.

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Flanagan is doing his best to encourage the-----

Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)
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The Minister keeps referring to my having broken a law, which law have I broken?

Jimmy Deenihan (Kerry North-West Limerick, Fine Gael)
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-----non-compliance with that law. He just wants to be put out.

Peter Mathews (Dublin South, Independent)
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I ask everybody to refrain from further discussion on Question No. 55. We are moving on to Question No. 56.