Dáil debates
Wednesday, 24 February 2010
Leaders' Questions
10:30 am
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach's Government has failed the country and the people. We now have a situation where 437,000 people are on the live register, with a further 70,000 projected to lose their jobs this year; credit is not flowing from banks to business; the public service is facing serious unrest because of the Government's economic policy of cutting wages and writing blank cheques for banks and people are being indiscriminately shot on our streets, all of which is causing serious anger and frustration. This is not good governance or leadership and it will not work. The people know it will not work.
The Taoiseach leads a Government that is riven by internal tension and divided by suspicion and a lack of trust. Yesterday, we witnessed the dignified resignation of former Minister of State, Deputy Trevor Sargent. Contrast that with the actions last week of the Taoiseach in forcing his party and the Green Party to defend the indefensible former Minister for Defence, Deputy Willie O'Dea and his attempting to justify the assertion that Deputy O'Dea had lived up to the standards he set for him. Deputy Sargent recognised he had made a serious error of judgment. In light of the spectacle witnessed in this Chamber last week, will the Taoiseach accept he made a serious error of judgment in terms of the manner in which he conducted the exit of Deputy O'Dea?
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
I totally reject the usual negative narrative that comes from the Leader of the Opposition.
Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach is in a rejection mood.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
He comes into this House on a continual basis and speaks as he does when in fact he does not have a policy framework that is credible. What we have-----
Seymour Crawford (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Government has no policy at all.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
It has no policy on anything.
Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context
I ask Deputy Durkan to allow the Taoiseach to continue without interruption.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----are policies that are being implemented. They are gaining credibility financially and domestically and we intend to continue to pursue them so that growth can return to this economy and recovery can be effected.
On the other matter, the contrast I saw yesterday was the dignity of Deputy Sargent's statement as compared with what was subsequently-----
Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Compared to the Taoiseach.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----suggested outside this House by Deputy Kenny's party and others-----
Paul Connaughton Snr (Galway East, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Compared to what the Taoiseach did the week before.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----in suggesting involvement by this party in these matters. That is the contrast I saw.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Fianna Fáil would never stoop so low.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
It was a pretty pathetic and hamfisted attempt, I must say.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Just as there was an acknowledgement by Deputy Sargent regarding the particular correspondence to which he adverted, the resignation statement of Deputy O'Dea continues to defend his position on the basis, as clearly stated, that he holds the position that there was no intention on his part to mislead in any way. He acknowledges also that his continued presence in Government would have had the regrettable conclusion of destabilising the Government and, therefore, resigned.
On the position in regard to what happened yesterday, Deputy Kenny has a lot to answer for in terms of how his people behaved.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Government has a lot to answer for in terms of where this country is now and the Taoiseach knows that.
Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Even the Government back benchers are laughing at the Taoiseach.
Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Deputy Kehoe please allow Deputy Kenny to respond, without interruption, please.
Olivia Mitchell (Dublin South, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
It is all our fault.
Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Deputy Kenny without interruption, please.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The back benchers are laughing nervously.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
That is the greatest load of nonsense I have heard from the Taoiseach in a long time.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The question I asked of the Taoiseach is whether he accepts he made a serious error of judgment in attempting to defend the indefensible in the case of former Minister for Defence, Deputy O'Dea?
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach forced his Government, members of the Fianna Fáil back benches and the Green Party, to come in here and publicly defend former Minister for Defence, Deputy O'Dea who, the Taoiseach stated, had lived up to the standards he set for him. Yesterday, we witnessed a deep contrast in the dignified resignation of former Minister of State, Deputy Sargent. I have no interest in the internal machinations of the Fianna Fáil Party, be they valid or otherwise.
Noel Dempsey (Meath West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Deputy is too busy with his own.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach stated that Fine Gael has put forward no policy framework. I would like to challenge him on two issues. The Fine Gael Party has put forward a radical proposal which I know the Green Party is interested in, namely, providing 100,000-----
Thomas Byrne (Meath East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Labour Party is against it.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----jobs right across the spectrum of renewables energy, broadband, water and so on. We have costed this detailed plan and put it forward. The Taoiseach stated last July that he would respond to it but never did.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
That is a serious policy that could result in the creation of 100,000 jobs for people right across the country.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Fianna Fáil has forced the Green Party to adopt its economic strategy of cutting wages and writing blank cheques for banks. I understand that the Government proposes to invest up to €6 billion of taxpayers' money in the dead bank that is Anglo Irish Bank to pay off bond speculators and investors. There is an alternative. The Government can put that money into a stimulus package or it can break up Anglo Irish Bank into a good bank-bad bank, a concept put forward by Fine Gael more than 12 months ago.
Noel Dempsey (Meath West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Pay the €64 million in deposits.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
This would save the taxpayer serious money and would allow credit to flow to businesses-----
Noel Dempsey (Meath West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Ask the taxpayer to put in the €64 million.
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----in County Meath and elsewhere where jobs as being lost even as we speak.
Seymour Crawford (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
What about roads?
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Fine Gael Party has put forward a serious policy framework for job creation and security and new careers. The Taoiseach will not recognise this because he is locked into the tribal strait jacket of Fianna Fáil.
Noel Dempsey (Meath West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
From where did Deputy Kenny get that line?
Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Is the Government prepared to break up Anglo Irish Bank, save the taxpayer money and provide a bad bank-good bank, the concept put forward by Fine Gael more than 12 months ago?
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Come out with your hands up.
P J Sheehan (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
It is never too late to clear the plate.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The extraordinary basis for Fine Gael's economic policy is that its wishes, primarily, to raise bonds to fund all of these jobs of which Deputy Kenny speaks while at the same time default on bond holders. That is its idea of how one raises bonds. Fine Gael has as much understanding of-----
Denis Naughten (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Answer the question.
Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Deputy Creed, please allow the Taoiseach to continue without interruption.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
On the whole question of the establishment of NAMA and it becoming operational, the purpose of this is to ensure we have access to funding and that we can reduce the cost of funding-----
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----to banks so that they can provide funds to the wider economy.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
They are not doing it.
Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach, without interruption please.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Fine Gael Party has not supported-----
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Never mind Fine Gael, talk about Fianna Fáil.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----one tough decision taken by this Government in the past 12 months.
Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
They are opposed to everything.
Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Deputy Gilmore without interruption please.
Paul Connaughton Snr (Galway East, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Government got its answer.
Seymour Crawford (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
What about the Minister for Transport, Deputy Dempsey, and the roads?
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
There are 436,000 people out of work. Businesses are trying to keep going this morning in circumstances where they do not have credit from financial institutions. Families throughout the country are frightened about the future, whether they can pay the mortgage, what they can do about their levels of personal debt and whether they will have work by the end of the year. Young people are worried whether they will get a job when they graduate. That is on top of the general concern in the population about what we will end up having to pay and for how long we will have to pay for the banking crisis, NAMA and all those things.
The one thing that is needed in those circumstances is a functioning Government in which the people can have confidence. By any measure - there have now been several measures - the Government led by the Taoiseach does not enjoy the confidence of the public. Some of that is understandable. Fianna Fáil has been in office for 13 years. There is a fatigue and staleness that comes with every government in office for that length of time. It is somewhat punch drunk from the economic events of the past year and a half. In dealing with the economic crisis it is hopelessly conflicted between on the one hand, having to take the decisions necessary to deal with it and on the other hand, covering its tracks for the role the Government played in causing it in the first place. That is particularly evident in the Taoiseach's own case where he has an understandable concern to cover the tracks of his term as Minister for Finance.
There is increasing evidence of incompetence in the Government. We saw it last week with the Tánaiste's mishandling of the aeronautics jobs at Dublin Airport. The events of the past week have shown that the Government is seriously divided. It has struck the iceberg. It is now only a matter of time. We can have the predictable partisan arguments across the Chamber, but there is a service the Taoiseach needs to do for the country, which is to wind up the Government as quickly as possible and give the people an opportunity of making a decision about who should govern the country in these difficult times. If they chose to re-elect the present Government, so be it, but they should at least be given the opportunity.
We are in very difficult, strange and worrying times for people. It is not fair or responsible for the Taoiseach with a battered, broken, tired and now divided Government to continue to hang on to office in circumstances and times when the people need a competent functioning government in which they can have confidence and one that has a mandate - something the Government no longer has.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Again we have Deputy Gilmore getting up this morning to give his view of the world. It is clear from the past six months' debate on the economy that there is not a coherent alternative to the capacity of the Government.
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Where did we hear that before?
Michael Creed (Cork North West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach would not know coherence if it slapped him in the face.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
What is clear is that the Government is demonstrating its preparedness to take the decisions that are necessary and that there are no circumstances in which support will be provided from the opposite side of the House, but that will not deter us.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Far from being tired, let me assure the Deputy that we are ready to fulfil our mandate for the remainder of this term, bring recovery and growth back to the economy. The Deputy can talk down the economy and the Government all he likes. We are going to do that with or without his help.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Throughout history every ruler, where power has gone to his head, believes that nobody else can rule or govern. That is what we are now getting-----
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----from the Taoiseach and from Fianna Fáil.
Paul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Deputy Dooley was not that smart on Vincent Browne's television programme last night.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Let me tell the Taoiseach where he is wrong. The Opposition has supported the Government. We supported it on Europe. We supported it on the necessity to make the fiscal adjustment of €4 billion.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Government Deputies are very good at the political debate, but let us stick with the facts. We supported it on the fiscal adjustment, on the necessity to reform public services and in respect of this country's international reputation in every meeting and discussion we have had - I am sure the same is true of Deputy Kenny - with the European Central Bank, the OECD and the European Commission, we have talked up our economy.
Thomas Byrne (Meath East, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Labour Party opposed everything.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
We have made it clear that in circumstances where there were a change of Government, we would put the national interest first. The Taoiseach has been blessed with a responsible Opposition and yet-----
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----where we have opposed the Government we have been absolutely right. When this party opposed the blanket guarantee for the banks we were right.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Labour Party was never right.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
If that guarantee had not applied to Anglo Irish Bank, as it should not have, we would not now be stuck with the enormous bill of thousands of millions of euro of taxpayers' money-----
Timmy Dooley (Clare, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Deputy should tell us where we would be.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----that is going to have to go into that.
Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context
When we told the Government almost a year ago that the most prudent way of dealing with the banking crisis was the temporary nationalisation of the banks, the Taoiseach rubbished it. The Government has ended up with the situation where it will have nationalisation anyway by the back door in a dragged out way that is most expensive for the taxpayer. The Taoiseach's problem is that he has not been listening to the proposals coming from the Opposition parties and has not been acting accordingly. The Taoiseach has been taking decisions that are motivated by his desire to cover the tracks for his role and his party's role in the mismanagement of the economy in the past 12 years in creating the property bubble and the hand-in-glove approach it had down the years with bankers and developers.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
I reject all that again.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
One of the problems of being in opposition too long is that Opposition parties believe that they alone possess the right to define what is the national interest. I know what is the national interest in discharging my responsibilities.
Brian Hayes (Dublin South West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach is another victim.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
I reject all the assertions the Deputy has been making about my position and my disposition in dealing with the issues that faced the country since I took office.
Brian Hayes (Dublin South West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach created them.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
My role, just as much as the Deputy's role would be if he had the honour, is to seek to defend the national interest of the country. The Deputy will not define it for me as if he had a higher motive than I have.
Brian Hayes (Dublin South West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Is the Taoiseach claiming he did not cause the problem?
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
That motive has meant that the policies we have brought forward have sought to stabilise the crisis situation we were facing, have obtained international support for so doing and are determined to continue with a consistent approach that will bring recovery. There is considerable revisionism going on-----
Joan BurtonBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----as to what his party's position was during the good times when deficits would have been far higher coming into this situation. Both in terms of its policy framework and what it proposed coming into elections, let the record show where the economy would have been-----
Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
We know about the Taoiseach's position.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
-----had we followed its proposals, when its Members were saying to me when I was Minister for Finance that I was like Scrooge and was not spending enough money on health and education.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
Now we have the revisionists seeking to suggest they were the responsible ones if only they had been around. The fact is that during those times we created 700,000 jobs. During those times we had growth in the economy.
Denis Naughten (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Government has lost half of them now.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
We now need to ensure we effect recovery and rework the economy again. That is what we intend to do. I will not accept any suggestion from the Deputy, however populist it might appear.
Brian Hayes (Dublin South West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The Taoiseach just does not get it.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
The idea that the financial viability of the country would have been best served by not proceeding with the bank guarantee on 29 and 30 September 2008 is so far off the mark that it is unbelievable. It is true that everyone in the Central Bank of Ireland and all advice to the Government at that time related to the systemic nature of those institutions.
Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context
That is the situation. There is no suggestion from the Deputy or anybody else that would suggest that we could get easier access to funds by not having that bank guarantee in place. In fact the bank guarantee has provided us with the means by which banks have been able to continue to operate and has reduced the cost of access to funding. In addition, the banks are paying for the guarantee. Despite all Deputy Gilmore's efforts to suggest that the Labour Party has an alternative credible model, it does not because the basic facts he is proposing would have meant meltdown within the Irish financial system, and that is indisputable.
Paul Connaughton Snr (Galway East, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context
No, that is not correct.
Séamus Kirk (Louth, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context
That concludes Leaders' Questions. We now move on to questions to An Taoiseach.