Dáil debates

Tuesday, 19 May 2009

Ceisteanna - Questions.

Constitutional Amendments.

12:00 pm

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Question 8: To ask the Taoiseach the constitutional referenda he will hold during the remainder of 2009; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [15533/09]

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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Question 9: To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on the position in respect of the implementations of the recommendations of the All-Party Committee on the Constitution; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [15534/09]

Photo of Eamon GilmoreEamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Question 10: To ask the Taoiseach the constitutional referenda the Government plans to hold during the remainder of 2009; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [15592/09]

Photo of Eamon GilmoreEamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Question 11: To ask the Taoiseach the position in regard to the implementation of the reports of the All-Party Committee on the Constitution; the recommendations which have been implemented and those which remain to be implemented; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [16604/09]

Photo of Eamon GilmoreEamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Question 12: To ask the Taoiseach the constitutional referenda he plans to hold during the remainder of 2009; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [17790/09]

Photo of Caoimhghín Ó CaoláinCaoimhghín Ó Caoláin (Cavan-Monaghan, Sinn Fein)
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Question 13: To ask the Taoiseach the recommendations of the All-Party Committee on the Constitution which he intends to implement; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [18645/09]

Photo of Brian CowenBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 8 to 13, inclusive, together.

When I last answered this question I indicated that two potential referendums are being considered for 2009, one relating to the Lisbon treaty and the other to children's rights. On the Lisbon treaty, Deputies will be aware that agreement was reached at the December European Council that, if the treaty comes into force, all member states will retain a Commissioner. It was also agreed that a number of other concerns of the Irish people, which I spelled out at the Council meeting, would be addressed satisfactorily, including by way of appropriate legal guarantees. On the basis of this agreement at the European Council, and on the condition of our being able to agree the satisfactory texts of legal guarantees in the coming months, I have said I would be prepared to return to the people with a new package and to seek their approval of it in a referendum.

The other potential referendum is in the area of children's rights. In this regard, Deputies will be aware that the second interim report of the Joint Committee on the Constitutional Amendment on Children on absolute or strict liability in respect of sexual offences against or in connection with children was published recently. On the central issue, that of a constitutional amendment to re-instate absolute liability in the wake of the CC case, the report states, "Two distinct views emerge" and that, "The Committee has not been able to reconcile these views and, accordingly, is unable to make an agreed recommendation on the issue". The different views emerging from the committee's report will now be examined and proposals will be brought to the Government in due course.

Deputies also asked about the recommendations of the All-Party Committee on the Constitution and its successor, the Joint Committee on the Constitution. I would like it put on the record again that neither I nor my Department are solely responsible for the implementation of all the recommendations of these committees. The fine work of the current committee and its predecessors has produced 12 reports which form a very useful repository of informed work on various aspects of the Constitution. However, the committee does not report to me. The reports are published and the recommendations are made for all. As issues arise they will be dealt with appropriately and the valuable information contained in these reports will be availed of.

Photo of John O'DonoghueJohn O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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We have very little time remaining. I will allow a brief supplementary from Deputies Kenny, Burton and Ó Snodaigh.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I would like, if I may, to ask three questions to the Taoiseach. Ireland has been bad-mouthed around Europe owing to the decision of the Irish people in respect of the Lisbon treaty. I hope the treaty is approved at the next referendum. Fine Gael will lead a strong campaign in this regard.

Does the Taoiseach expect the legislation giving effect to the Lisbon treaty referendum to be passed by the House prior to the summer recess? He will be aware of the necessity for such legislation to be in place for 30 days before the people can be advised of a referendum. In that context, does the Taoiseach expect the referendum to be held at the end of September or during the month of October? It is time the Taoiseach set out clearly the position in this regard. We must get on with dealing with this important and fundamental issue. I take this opportunity to reiterate that the Taoiseach keep Opposition parties informed of ongoing developments, as discussed last December.

With regard to the question of children's rights, it was not possible to get agreement on this issue because Government members of the committee have changed their minds. The programme for Government, which the Taoiseach drafted and of which he was a chief negotiator, contains a very clear reference to having a referendum on children's rights. Is that to be a victim of the review to be carried out now? This party believes that it is urgent and appropriate to hold a constitutional referendum to allow the electorate to decide whether the Oireachtas should enact new legislation to reinstate the criminal offence of statutory rape for the protection of children. That there was a divergent view at the committee does not mean the Government should go back to the commitment to a referendum in the programme for Government, which was driven by the Taoiseach's party.

The Constitution declares: "The publication or utterance of blasphemous... matter is an offence which shall be punishable in accordance with law." The Taoiseach will be aware that the Defamation Act 1961 provided that "every person who composes, prints or publishes any blasphemous or obscene libel" is guilty of such an offence. Blasphemy is not defined in the Constitution nor is it defined in any Act of the Oireachtas. It is impossible to say what the offence consists of. State-sponsored bodies have made their position clear. In 1991, the Law Reform Commission stated that "there was no place for blasphemous libel in a society which respects freedom of speech". In 1996, the Constitution Review Group commented that the retention of the current constitutional offence of blasphemy was not appropriate. In July 2008, the Oireachtas Joint Committee on the Constitution noted the redundant nature of blasphemy in Irish law and concluded that "the deletion of the reference to 'blasphemy' from the Constitution might be advisable". In view of that body of opinion, why is the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform proceeding with something that is not defined in law? Is it his intention to proceed with a referendum on this matter?

Photo of Joan BurtonJoan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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I wish to ask the Taoiseach about this strange proposal to introduce legislation on blasphemy and the view of the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on the Constitution. Has the Taoiseach taken any soundings of public reaction, including that of various faith communities, who are hard put to understand why the country will now be faced with an offence of blasphemy in a way that nobody had anticipated or provided for?

Photo of John O'DonoghueJohn O'Donoghue (Kerry South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I should have informed Deputy Kenny and I wish to inform Deputy Burton that the Select Committee on Justice, Equality, Defence and Women's Rights will be considering that amendment today.

Photo of Joan BurtonJoan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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I ask the Taoiseach about the report in today's newspapers that other EU states are requesting Ireland to set a date for the referendum on the Lisbon treaty. Does the Taoiseach have a date in mind? Other European states are quoted as having asked us to have a date identified by the European Council meeting in June. Has the Taoiseach decided on a date and what will be the timeframe? Have Fianna Fáil and its coalition partner, the Green Party, reached agreement on the approach to the European Defence Agency? The Green Party has stated that it is unhappy with that proposal and wants it addressed in the context of the Lisbon treaty referendum. Have the two parties reached agreement on the matter?

Photo of Brian CowenBrian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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It would be the intention to have legislation on the referendum before the summer recess if we have a successful outcome. At this point I cannot anticipate whether the legal guarantees that are being worked on will provide us with the outcome we desire based on the December Council conclusions. However, if we get those and if they are what are required, then of course that enables us, as I said in my primary reply, to go the people with a new package based on that detailed work being conducted and a decision of the European Council being made at the June Council meeting.

In respect of any EU states that are seeking a date for a referendum, I refer them to the conclusions of the December Council meeting, which were agreed by all the member states. They clearly set out the areas upon which further work is being conducted. On the basis of a successful outcome we will be in a position, having obtained the decision of the European Council, to indicate when we will hold a referendum. We have to approach this step by step. It would not be appropriate to give an indication of that detailed work in advance of it being completed and agreed by a formal decision of the European Council because that would be anticipating an outcome that we cannot predict at present. As matters stand, we must be mindful of the decision of the people and until such time as we complete the current process we should avoid coming to a conclusion on that because otherwise one would be anticipating an outcome without completing the work.

The questions put to me pertained to referendums. One of the issues raised will be subject to further discussion this week by the Select Committee on Justice, Equality, Defence and Women's Rights. This issue is referred to in the Constitution and the question that arises is whether to address it through a referendum or by way legislation. The Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform can discuss the issue in some detail and he addressed it with a great deal of clarity in a newspaper article published on 1 May. Unfortunately, he is misrepresented as being motivated by other reasons, which is certainly not the case. It is a question of dealing with the issue in the interest of proceeding with the Defamation Bill 2006 while respecting the Constitution's provisions on freedom of expression. The Government is holding discussions with the EU's legal services on all these matters and hopes to reach a conclusion by June.