Dáil debates

Thursday, 9 April 2009

Adjournment Debate

Rural Environment Protection Scheme.

5:00 pm

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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I am delighted to see the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Trevor Sargent here and thank him for coming into the House to listen to my plea on behalf of REPS planners in Teagasc. I raised this matter on the Order of Business, along with my colleague Deputy Pádraic McCormack, who also feels very strongly about this issue.

The decision not to extend the contracts of these REPS planners makes absolutely no sense on any level. An arm of Government which has the capacity to generate €3 million net profit, while providing employment for 101 people and a service for which there is demand is to be abandoned. This is against a backdrop of the worst unemployment and economic crisis in living memory. If it were not so serious it would be laughable and if we were discussing this nine days earlier one would be forgiven for believing it was a bad April Fools' joke. Going down the road of axing the jobs of these 101 REPS planners is hugely counterproductive. As a result, the taxpayer will face a bill for social welfare payments and there will be a considerable loss in revenue in terms of income tax, PRSI and levies, not to mention reduced VAT receipts and general spending in their local economies by these individuals and their families.

The option the Minister seems to be against is retaining these 101 people in employment, where there will be no social welfare liability, they will contribute tax and levies to the State finances and they will also generate €3 million towards the funding of Teagasc, thereby allowing it, through its research and development programmes, to contribute to the long-term sustainability of agriculture and its valuable contribution to this economy. I genuinely have difficulty understanding the logic behind this move. Why, in any economy, let alone one where there is a severe need to generate employment, would one even consider axing viable income generating jobs? We have found it difficult to get a clear understanding from the Minister as to what is behind this decision. Is it bureaucracy gone mad under this Government yet again? There is agreement on the need for a recruitment freeze in the public sector, and I strongly believe in this. Thus, it is just about keeping the numbers down, regardless of their ability to contribute. In this instance we have a revenue-generating scheme, yet it appears the Department will not give the green light to contract extensions for these REPS planners. Is this part of a more sinister move on the part of the Minister to put another nail in the coffin of the REP scheme?

Since this issue was first raised, we are now aware of the 17% reduction in payments announced by the Minister in the budget, thereby breaching his contract with 12,000 farmers. Is this what the Minister had in mind all the time? Is the Minister starting a process to dismantle the scheme? Are further cuts on the way next year? Already farmers are considering the viability of remaining in the scheme. I have had contact with farmers in this predicament who must decide if the investment proposed in their REPS plans can now be justified when the Government has already broken its contract once and may do so again. Shame on the Green Party for being part of such a move and for allowing this to happen while it is in Government. The fact that it can call itself a Green Party while its members stand idly by as an environmental protection scheme is cut is truly astonishing.

Aside from the damage caused to the specific REPS programme by the refusal to renew these contracts, it will also be damaging in the long term to the Teagasc organisation as a whole. These people are the primary contact for many of the client farmers and, if they go, a large amount of knowledge and information will be lost to individual farmers and to the organisation in terms of experience and expertise. Teagasc has suffered as a result of recruitment bans in the past, which means that a large number of retirements will fall due in the next four years. To let go the dynamic and motivated members who are the future of the organisation seems to be a retrograde step. I ask the Minister to address this matter urgently, bring clarity to the situation and make a positive move to retain these posts.

My party spokesperson on agriculture, Deputy Michael Creed, received a letter from Professor Gerry Boyle, the director of Teagasc. He said it was not a matter for Teagasc but for the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food. I will read his letter for the record.

Photo of Charlie O'ConnorCharlie O'Connor (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I ask the Deputy to do so quickly.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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I understand the Acting Chairman is from an urban constituency, but this is very important for rural Ireland.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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There are farmers in Dublin South-West. I know some of them.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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Professor Boyle states:

I refer to your letter dated 4th March 2009 concerning issues related to the future delivery of the REPS service provided by Teagasc.

REPS contract staff in Teagasc are given contracts of indefinite service after four continuous years' service in REPS arising from a recommendation of the Labour Court. This has required an agreement between Teagasc and the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries & Food and the Department of Finance that when a contract REPS staff member reaches four years' contract REPS service that Teagasc's approved contract Staff Establishment decreases by one and the approved permanent Staff Establishment increases by one. Teagasc will require an indication from [the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food] that this approach can continue to be taken in the context of the required reductions in staff numbers. Otherwise, Teagasc could not continue to implement the Labour Court's recommendation. Clearly, any decision will also be significantly influenced by the outcome of the Review of Teagasc's future involvement in REPS that is imminently required by the Departments.

REPS planners are highly valued by Teagasc as the staff concerned make a very important financial contribution to the organisation [of more than €3 million] while providing an excellent service to farmer clients. It would be Teagasc's intention to remain significantly involved in REPS and we will be making this clear in the imminent Review that will take place with the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries & Food and the Department of Finance.

This letter is dated 2 April. For the Minister of State to come into the House this evening-----

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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The Deputy asked me to come in.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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I do not want the Minister of State to say this is a matter for Teagasc. It is no laughing matter. The Minister of State is a member of the Green Party and I hope he will say that the 101 REPS planners will be retained in their positions. There is currently a process that generates more then €3 million in revenue. In view of the current economic circumstances, this must be saved. It makes no sense to let these people go. I speak on behalf of many rural Deputies, including Deputy McCormack.

Photo of Charlie O'ConnorCharlie O'Connor (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I do not like to correct the Deputy, but there is a farming community in my constituency. I ask the Deputy not to draw the Chair into discussion.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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I wish the Acting Chairman a happy Easter.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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Like all of us, the Deputy has things to learn about Dublin South-West. I am glad to have the opportunity to reply to the Deputy. I thank him for his contribution and I hope it has not eaten into my time, a Chathaoirligh.

Photo of Charlie O'ConnorCharlie O'Connor (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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The Minister of State has five full minutes.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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Go raibh míle maith agat.

Nuair a bhí mé anseo ar maidin chuala mé an Teachta agus an Teachta Pádraic McCormack ag ardú na ceiste. Tá suim agam sa cheist mar tá aithne agam ar roinnt mhaith de lucht pleanála REPS atá ag obair go príobháideach, chomh maith le daoine atá fostaithe ag Teagasc. There is no doubt there are job losses in the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, in accordance - as the Deputy mentioned - with public recruitment policy. Many of these are due to early retirement, but this is not what we are talking about today. I listened with interest to the Deputy's letter from Professor Boyle.

In accordance with the Act establishing Teagasc, responsibility for the provision of education, training and advisory services in agriculture rests with Teagasc itself. To enable it to carry out its work Teagasc receives substantial Exchequer resources each year as well as consent to appoint staff up to a certain ceiling. It is a matter for Teagasc to allocate its financial and staff resources in accordance with its own priorities and in line with Government policy for the development of the sector. I hope the Deputy's raising of this issue will help us to square the circle and ensure that we have proper delivery of Teagasc and Government policy.

I pay tribute to the work Teagasc has done in assisting the implementation of the REP scheme since its launch in 1994. It has actively promoted farmer participation, provided excellent planning and support services and provided specialist and research-based support for the ongoing development of the scheme. Much of the credit for the success of the scheme is due in no small way to the consistently excellent service provided by Teagasc over the years.

Teagasc currently has about 43% of the REPS planning market, the balance being taken up very satisfactorily by private planners. To provide its existing REPS service Teagasc employs a dedicated body of REPS planners comprising 60 planners employed on a permanent basis and 101 on a contract basis. The REPS planners are employed by Teagasc on a self-financing basis; that is, they generate enough income through fees and so on to cover the cost of their own salaries, PRSI and travel costs, as well as the overhead costs for the operation of the scheme. This ensures fair competition with private planners. I emphasise, however, that the planners do not generate a net profit for Teagasc, as has been suggested. The requirement of Teagasc is to ensure that the service provided is fully self-financing.

The contracts of employment of the 101 planners and all other contract staff employed by Teagasc are with Teagasc itself, not my Department. I understand from Teagasc that among the contract planners, 34 contracts will terminate at the end of June 2009, a further 41 will terminate at the end of December 2009 and 26 at the end of June 2010. The ban on recruitment and promotion in the public service announced by the Minister for Finance on 27 March to correct imbalances in the public finances applies to temporary appointments on a fixed-term basis and to the renewal of such contracts. In other words, Teagasc is prevented by Government decision from renewing these contracts. However, those planners, who are able people, are in a position to work on contract either privately or with Teagasc. There is flexibility as part of their employment.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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It will be left up to one body. There will be no competition.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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It will not be one body.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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The private planners can charge what they want.

Photo of Charlie O'ConnorCharlie O'Connor (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I ask the Minister of State to continue.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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Tempting as it was to interrupt the Deputy, I thought it might be better not to.

This is the whole point. It is not just one body; there is competition out there. Farmers do get a good service because there is-----

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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There is competition when Teagasc is involved.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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Yes. Teagasc is a strong part of the equation.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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It will be gone in a year's time.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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Not unless the Deputy's party gets into power.

With a view to maintaining the quality and delivery of the overall REPS service and to ensure that REPS planners conform to the highest standards of REPS planning, Teagasc proposes to offer a once-off opportunity to the contract planners to apply to Teagasc to become registered contractors and to provide a REPS planning service on terms and conditions set by Teagasc. I understand discussions on the proposal are ongoing. However, the proposed arrangements will be required to operate on a fully self-financing basis for Teagasc, as mentioned already. Teagasc informs me that the new delivery model for REPS will increase efficiency while retaining quality and ensuring a top class service for farmers. Therefore, there is a definite continuation of work for those planners. Long may it continue.

Photo of Paul KehoePaul Kehoe (Wexford, Fine Gael)
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The Minister of State should be absolutely ashamed in offering such a response.

Photo of Trevor SargentTrevor Sargent (Dublin North, Green Party)
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The Deputy is talking up a crisis where there is none.