Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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Question 80: To ask the Minister for Education and Science if discussions have taken place with the Department of Finance on the use of public money on the hiring and renting of prefabricated classrooms for primary schools when the same income flow over 30 years would cover the cost of capital borrowing from either commercial financial institutions or would be cheaper if borrowed at Exchequer borrowing rates for the construction of a permanent building; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19767/08]

Batt O'Keeffe (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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Officials in the Department of Education and Science discuss the overall allocation of current and capital expenditure with their counterparts in the Department of Finance in the context of the preparation of the annual Estimates. General discussions are normally held on the amount of funding allocated to the subhead from which payment for the rental of temporary accommodation for schools is made. However, no specific discussions have taken place about the borrowing of money by the Exchequer for the construction of permanent buildings in the manner referred to by the Deputy. Following concerns raised by the Committee of Public Accounts and the Office of the Comptroller and Auditor General, the Department of Education and Science recently examined its expenditure on the rental of temporary accommodation with a view to identifying the point at which the purchase of such accommodation provides better value for money. As a result of the review, the Department of Education and Science now has a policy of purchasing temporary accommodation when the need for it is likely to last more than three years. This change in policy will minimise the amount of money spent on the rental of accommodation.

The permanent accommodation scheme was introduced in 2003 to reduce the need for prefabricated classrooms. It was designed to ensure that value for money is a feature of the provision of permanent accommodation in place of prefabricated accommodation when it is decided that an accommodation need is likely to exist for a considerable length of time. Since the introduction of the scheme, more than €100 million has been allocated to schools. This expenditure has resulted in the provision of an additional 625 classrooms and 275 resource rooms in schools throughout the country. Such facilities have been provided in addition to the classrooms provided under the major capital projects managed by the Department of Education and Science. If the permanent accommodation scheme had not been in place, a significant proportion of the classrooms and resource rooms would have had to be provided using temporary accommodation such as prefabricated classrooms.

Additional information not given on the floor of the House.

It will continue to be necessary for prefabricated accommodation to be provided, as competing priorities mean it will not always be possible to put a permanent accommodation solution in place in a short timeframe. The Department of Education and Science will continue to provide funding for prefabricated accommodation. Decisions on whether to rent or purchase will depend on the length of time such accommodation is likely to be required. In all cases, the approach will be to ensure best value for money.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I congratulate the Minister, Deputy Batt O'Keeffe, on his well-earned promotion.

Batt O'Keeffe (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Deputy Quinn.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I look forward to having a much more constructive and positive relationship with the Minister than I had with his predecessor.

Ulick Burke (Galway East, Fine Gael)
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The Minister can convey that message to her.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I invite the Minister to feel free to harness the abuse and resources of Opposition spokespersons when he is battling with officials in Merrion Street to fill his coffers.

Batt O'Keeffe (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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I will find it very helpful.

Brian Hayes (Dublin South West, Fine Gael)
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I am sure the Minister will.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I thank the Minister for his reply. He has not answered in full the question I asked, but he gave the reply his Department prepared for him. Will he not agree that for mature primary schools with all eight classes that have a proven need for accommodation — not start-up schools where there is a lead-in time as children move up classes starting with junior infants — the present policy of hiring prefabs is nonsense? It is a bit like having money on deposit in the post office and going to a moneylender to get cash. In one school, the details of which were submitted with the question, the annual cost of the rental, which is dead money, would finance a loan of €5 million over 30 years, which would provide for the construction of a solid building. I invite the Minister, if he is not yet at that stage, to enter into a serious dialogue with the Department of Finance on this issue. Considering the current financing policy, none of the officials in the Department of Education and Science would pass a junior or leaving certificate business organisation or economics examination if they were to sit it on the basis of their behaviour.

Batt O'Keeffe (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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Obviously I do not accept that because I find there is a wealth of talent in the Department, which I am delighted to have available to me. I will write to the Deputy to give him a detailed outline of the number of purchased prefabs and the number that are rented. We have done a survey and are compiling the results. In deference to the Deputy, all that information will be sent to him.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I thank the Minister.

Batt O'Keeffe (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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I take the Deputy's point about doing our business better. I have been reviewing this area since my appointment. We have made significant improvements in getting much more permanent accommodation over three years. We have been reviewing the cost-effectiveness of what we are doing. The capital programme has been improved dramatically over the years. I am considering other ways of doing business, as the Deputy suggests. I am engaging outside experts to review the way we do business in terms of renting and purchasing prefab accommodation. They will also consider how we might progress our demands as they arise in terms of the planning we should put in place and whether we should have a proper systematic layout throughout the school system.

Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)
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I welcome the Minister's constructive response and I would be happy to engage with him. If he is to engage in a programme of capital expenditure during a downturn in the construction industry, which could be very positive and beneficial generally, would he consider using the Planning and Development (Strategic Infrastructure) Act to accelerate the planning? Many applications are stuck in the planning process at present. There is nothing more strategically important than the education system for our knowledge economy.

Batt O'Keeffe (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy will be aware that I had charge of developing areas in my role as Minister of State with responsibility for housing. There has been considerable interaction between the Departments of Education and Science and the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, and planning sections in local authorities. We have made great strides in co-ordination and joined-up thinking and action. As Minister for Education and Science, I will continue that process.