Dáil debates

Tuesday, 21 February 2006

3:00 pm

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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Question 65: To ask the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources if he will call a halt to the Corrib gas pipeline project due to the non-viability of the project as currently configured and as acknowledged by Shell and everyone else due to the lack of community consent to this project and health and safety fears and in light of there being no compelling need to proceed as a result of recent large gas finds, including the recent find in the north west that is reputed to have 12 times the gas reserves of the Corrib gas field, therefore strongly suggesting that Ireland will have no gas supply problems in the future; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [6802/06]

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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The Corrib gas project is a joint venture between three companies, Statoil, Shell E & P Ireland Limited and Marathon. It is not within my remit to call a halt to such a project provided the developers observe all obligations and discharge all responsibilities in accordance with the terms of the various consents and approvals given. When the petroleum lease for the Corrib development was granted by my predecessor, he was satisfied a viable commercial discovery had been made. I have had no information since then to the contrary.

As I have outlined to the House a number of times and most recently on 25 January, I commissioned an international consulting company, Advantica, on 25 August 2005 to carry out a thorough and independent safety review of the onshore upstream section of the Corrib gas pipeline. In parallel with this safety review I established a public consultation process, including a two-day public hearing in Geesala on the 12 and 13 October, during which the community was given the opportunity to express its concerns directly to the consultants. A draft of the safety review was published and presented to the community on 8 December and written submissions on it were invited. I have received Advantica's final report, which I intend to publish shortly.

The Deputy will be aware that after consultation with relevant parties, I have nominated a mediator, Mr. Peter Cassells, to work with the parties. I am hopeful the mediation process currently under way, augmented as needed by the results of the safety review, will allow all those concerned to work together to resolve the difficulties that have arisen. I will ensure the outcome of all of these initiatives is fully taken into account in making the necessary decisions.

What the Deputy refers to in his question as a "recent find in the north west" arises from an article in a business magazine reporting an estimate of the resource potential carried out for one operator. The reference is to the potential resources in that area and does not constitute a discovery, much less a commercial find. I note that the Deputy recognises the importance of the availability of indigenous gas in the context of security of supply and I inform him that the Corrib remains a key resource in this regard.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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I am puzzled by the Minister's reply as he states the mediation process is ongoing. The Minister knows the mediation process is scuppered as it was he who scuppered it. When it began, the Minister appeared on "Morning Ireland" and stated he had appointed a person agreeable to both sides to mediate between them and that he would leave the matter to the person and the sides to agree the format and framework of the mediation. He recently stated it was never presented, certainly by him——

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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The Deputy cannot read from quotes during Question Time.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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The Minister stated on Mid-West Radio that he never presented mediation as anything except a very wide process. The Minister has consequently scuppered the entire process. What was the Minister's reason for misleading the House? On 4 October, he stated:

Following the debates, I contacted both sides in an effort to break the impasse and indicated to them that the Government would appoint a mediator if both sides were willing to participate in a mediation process. I then called on both parties to create the conditions which would allow such a process to commence immediately.

However, matters fell apart when the Minister responded to my parliamentary question on 25 January that "the role of the mediator is wider than just the gas project". What is the Minister about? He has misled the House and destroyed the mediation process by interfering at every opportunity. The Minister has not allowed Mr. Peter Cassells to do his job. Mr. Cassells has ended the process because it has become so diluted that the men's concerns have been lost.

Shell and the five men agree that the mediation was between them. However, the Minister has turned the issue around completely. What is the reason? What is the Minister's agenda? Does the Minister agree he has not only misled the House but has not acted as a Minister should? Is the Minister's situation untenable? He has spoken about mediation but has succeeded in destroying the process.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy has often told the House that Ministers should make their announcements here but I note the Deputy has been on the public airwaves calling for my resignation.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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That would be a shame.

Photo of Tommy BroughanTommy Broughan (Dublin North East, Labour)
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Not for the first time.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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It is interesting.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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The Minister has made contradictory statements.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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I have the compact disc with recordings of the two contradictory statements the Minister made.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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In case the Deputy is not aware, I have referred to two sides of the debate in this House and in press releases. One group favours the development of the Corrib and the other opposes it. What right does anyone have to abrogate the local community's right to be consulted? More than five people are involved in this process, a community is involved and no one has the right to claim to speak for the entire community.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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The Minister's strategy is to divide and conquer.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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This is where the Deputy and the five men he speaks for——

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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Nonsense. The Minister has treated this community in a terrible way.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy Cowley will not bully and intimidate me like some of his friends tried to do in Mayo.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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The Minister made two contradictory statements. The Minister's spokesperson states in The Irish Times on 7 October 2005——

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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Deputy Cowley should resume his seat.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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I believe I have the floor. Deputy Cowley will not intimidate me like some of his friends intimidated people in Mayo.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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If the Corrib project was safe we would all support it. The Minister made two contradictory statements, which are recorded on this compact disc.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy can put the compact disc in his pocket.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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He should consider his position as he made two contradictory statements and is misleading the Dáil. It is a disgrace.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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The time for debate on Question No. 65 has elapsed. I ask the Minister to proceed with QuestionNo. 66.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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Is it a compact disc with a recording of Deputy Cowley welcoming the Corrib gas project with open arms, demanding that processing take place onshore in County Mayo?

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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The Minister is jeopardising the entire community.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy should represent the entire community and not just a small group of people.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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The Minister is working for Shell. It is a disgrace.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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We know for whom Deputy Cowley is working.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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For whom am I working? I am working for the people in my constituency. People wish to be safe in their houses. I ask the Minister to state for whom I am working.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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I ask the Minister to answer Question No. 66.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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This is the anarchy Deputy Cowley wishes to support. This is typical of the intimidation and anarchy Deputy Cowley wishes to espouse.

Jerry Cowley (Mayo, Independent)
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The Minister is talking complete nonsense. Those five men have the support of 99% of the community. People do not wish to be blown up in their houses.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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It is a considerable task negotiating with Deputy Cowley, who will not listen to answers.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Question 66: To ask the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources the extent to which he has quantified Ireland's future energy needs and security of supply in view of the scale of economic growth and the increase in the population; his projections in the area of alternative renewable energy sources; his proposals and expectations in respect of the Corrib gas field; the discovery of further oil or gas finds on or offshore; the early use or availability of suitable interconnectors; if he is satisfied regarding the adequacy of supply to meet demand in the future; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7090/06]

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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I will publish an energy policy consultation paper in the coming months that will set out medium and long-term perspectives for national energy policy. The policy proposals will be informed by projections for growth in energy demand and related economic and demographic trends as well as the key imperative to ensure sustainability and security of energy supplies and fuel diversity.

The current target for renewable energy is to more than double the contribution to electricity production from renewable energy technologies to 13.2% by 2010. Targets beyond the 2010 target will be determined in the context of the all-island electricity market. We are progressing an all-island vision for renewable energy by 2020 and beyond that we will set future all-island targets.

The realisation of indigenous fuel supply potential, including Corrib, will make a critical contribution to national security of supply. We will continue to encourage further exploration for oil and gas. The development of the east-west electricity interconnector is a critical and immediate priority for Government. Decisions need to be made now to deliver on this strategic infrastructure by 2011. At my request, the Commission for Energy Regulation, CER, is finalising its advice to me on the legal, technical and financial arrangements for commissioning the development.

Following completion of the current technical and planning phase, the construction phase of the second North-South interconnector is set to begin in 2007, and the target date for having the interconnector operational is 2012.

The adequacy of supply to meet demand is analysed in the generation adequacy report by ESB national grid and by the gas capacity statement by the CER. The most recent assessments concluded that the gas transmission system will cope with forecast demand for the foreseeable future and the electricity generation capacity should be manageable up to 2009, predicated on the provision of planned new generating stations.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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When does the Minister expect to publish this consultation document to generate an adequate debate? Has the Minister studied the implication of various alternative energy suppliers exiting the Irish market? I refer to wind generated electricity and petroleum or gas. Why are energy suppliers exiting the market? In the case of electricity is it because excessive costs prohibit them from accessing the grid? Are there other reasons and, if so, has the Minister studied these? What type of interconnector is being used, in view of the fact that 2009 is the deadline? Will the interconnectors meet the same standard as those in mainland Europe?

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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We have some way to go before we put the interconnector in place. When we do so we will select an interconnector of at least 500 MW and the most modern that can be found. We considered two 500 MW interconnectors but most people are of the view that a single 500 MW interconnector would be sufficient for the moment.

I presume the Deputy's comment on players exiting the market refers to a statement by Airtricity yesterday. Regulation of the energy market is a matter for the independent regulator, who will respond fully to the points raised by the company. I would be concerned if anything were to disrupt the progress we are making. We are making progress towards the target of 13.2% for renewable energy by 2010. The system caters for approximately 750 MW at present. Of that figure, approximately 490 MW is generated by wind energy, some 240 MW is generated by hydro energy and 20 MW is generated by biomass. We anticipate the additional 700 MW will be delivered in the main part by wind energy.

The company concerned has written to its domestic customers advising them it will pass on costs to customers but it is retaining the 40,000 small and medium enterprise customers and is continuing work on four wind energy plants. Supply will not be affected.

Concerning the Deputy's first question, the policy paper will be published in the first half of 2006.

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Does the Minister think it advisable to direct the regulator, particularly in view of the signals given to the industry generally by energy suppliers exiting the market in respect of the confidence required at present?

We have slipped by approximately 10% in our projections to meet the Kyoto targets. Does the Minister think that given the preparations now being made by alternative energy suppliers who are willing to come into the market but may be impeded from doing so, it will be possible for him to direct the regulator on how that should be handled? If so, what might that direction be?

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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I do not have powers to direct the regulator, except in extremely general terms. Under the Energy (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill, which the Deputy will be pleased to hear will be published shortly——

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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Very good. It is a long time coming.

Photo of Noel DempseyNoel Dempsey (Meath, Fianna Fail)
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——a provision will be included to enable a Minister in an emergency to direct the commission and individual market players to take appropriate safeguard measures in the area of security of supply. It will also extend the remit of CER in some areas, particularly safety and security of supply.

Regarding the point made by the Deputy on the Kyoto Protocol, I was involved in its final agreement. Subsequently, our share of the burden within Europe was our 1990 emissions plus 13% of that figure. The year after we secured that figure, it was estimated we would exceed the 13% figure by another 22%, in other words, it was estimated that by 2008 we would be 35% above the 1990 figure. We are another 10% above the agreed figure at present. While we have made major progress, that is not to say we do not need to do more. It is not that we slipped by 10%. We reduced the amount considerably during the intervening four or five years. At the time we signed it, we were approximately 29% above it. We were due to go to 35% above it, and we are now approximately 23% above it. The matter must be tended to and is a matter directly for the Minister of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. Obviously, as I have responsibility for energy, I have a role to play in this matter, as do several other Ministers.