Rory O'Hanlon (Cavan-Monaghan, Ceann Comhairle)
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The Minister for Finance has given notice in writing that he wishes to make a personal explanation and I have decided to permit this.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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Deputies will recall that the Appropriation Act, which was enacted before Christmas, contains provisions relating to the carryover of €345.7 million capital spending from 2005 to 2006. The Seanad is due to hear statements on this Act tomorrow, in accordance with an agreement that a discussion would take place after the recess. As the Dáil has the primary role in financial matters and as I will be referring to a particular matter in the Seanad, I wish to draw attention to that matter now because it may affect the envisaged scale of the carryover.

My Department was advised late in the evening of Tuesday, 17 January 2006, by the Department of Health and Children, that the Health Service Executive had advised it on that day that there may be some alterations to its estimated outturn and, consequently, to its capital carryover figure of €56.4 million, included in the Appropriation Act 2005. The Act provided that, in regard to the HSE, a sum of €56.4 million could be made available for spending in 2006 in respect of capital not disbursed in 2005. My Department has been advised by the Department of Health and Children that, on the basis of the preliminary outturn figures for 2005 from the HSE, the capital savings anticipated by the executive in December may have been used to meet similar sized costs under the current expenditure heading. The Department of Health and Children is awaiting final verification of the outturn from the HSE.

The implications of this development for the 2006 capital budget for the HSE will be reviewed in the context of the Revised Estimates Volume 2006. I am determined to ensure that it will not have an adverse impact on the plans for the HSE's capital spending in 2006. As matters stand, the 2006 capital allocation for the HSE is €558 million, an increase of 10% on the provisional 2005 outturn.

The legal instrument that gives effect to the carryover of funds from 2005 to 2006 and which determines the actual amounts to be carried forward is a ministerial order. Under the relevant legislation, section 91 of the Finance Act 2004, the order must be made before the end of March and the draft order will be formally put before the House for approval by resolution. The Revised Estimates Volume will also include details of the carryover under each Vote and, accordingly, I will be advising the House in due course in compliance with the legal requirements.

Richard Bruton (Dublin North Central, Fine Gael)
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On a point of order, I thank the Minister for the courtesy of informing the House.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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It should just be a point of order.

Richard Bruton (Dublin North Central, Fine Gael)
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Is it not the case that the change in the Department of Health and Children's Estimates, where it is reducing its approved capital spend and increasing its approved current spend, would need retrospective approval by the House? While the Minister's personal statement and his changes by order in respect of the carryover for capital spending is fine, it appears that the Tánaiste and Minister for Health and Children would have to obtain approval from the Houses for the way she has changed her Estimates.

If that is the case, will we be seeing a presentation from the Minister to clarify what has happened? It seems quite extraordinary that money voted for capital purposes would without notice to anybody be spent on current purposes. As this is a point of order, I will not go into what that suggests about the way the Department is administering its money. I would like clarification of this point.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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On a point of order.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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There cannot be a debate or discussion on the matter. Deputy Burton may speak on a point of order.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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Would it be in order to provide time to debate this issue? This is a major error in the accounts of the Department of Health and Children——

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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We cannot have a debate on this matter.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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——and of the new Accounting Officer. In the course of the budgetary process, we were given figures that indicated a total capital carryover for the Government of €285 million under the capital carryover rules. Before the end of the year, that had increased to €343 million. I asked the Department about this vast increase. We are now told there is a further error in the Estimates of €56 million, which was wrongly classified as capital carryover when, in fact, it was spent on current account.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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There will be another opportunity to debate this matter.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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This may well throw light on the freedom of information disclosures before Christmas of the correspondence from Professor Drumm about his inability to spend more current account money in regard to staff in the Health Service Executive. This requires a major statement of explanation. It is not good enough for the Minister to leave it until the end of February, when the Revised Estimates for expenditure will be produced. The Minister must account to the House under the budgetary process for this major and unprecedented error. I remind him that my colleague, Deputy McManus, queried whether or not the head of the HSE should immediately become Accounting Officer because of the confusion that is ongoing in regard to health expenditure in this country. We deserve to be able to debate this matter.

I thank the Minister for providing this information to the House but it is deeply inadequate. It is a major error to confuse current and capital spending on health.

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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I am giving the up-to-date information, as provided to me and as I would normally do. As the Appropriation Act will be discussed in the Seanad tomorrow and as I will refer to this matter there, I wished to put it on the record in the House this evening as the money-raising powers of the Oireachtas are vested in the Dáil.

Second, the matter can be referred to in regard to the Revised Estimates Volume. The question of verification between the Department of Health and Children and the HSE is taking place. We have a provisional outturn figure.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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Do we know on what the money was spent?

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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The third point is that I am addressing the House on this matter because the Appropriation Act shows a figure of €56.4 million which, as I was informed on Tuesday last by the Department of Health and Children, will not now be available. That is my role in regard to ensuring that the Appropriation Act reference is made and that the fullest amount of information will be available for the debate in the Seanad.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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On what was the €56.4 million spent?

Brian Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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On current purposes.

Richard Bruton (Dublin North Central, Fine Gael)
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On a point of order.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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What is the point of order?

Richard Bruton (Dublin North Central, Fine Gael)
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Even if we are not in a position to clarify the matter at present, it seems that the House deserves more than a statement of clarification from the Minister in respect of his remit because it appears that the Minister for Health and Children has spent money on subheads that the Dáil did not sanction. We need to know what the procedure is and perhaps that can be done tomorrow. It does not appear that this can be passed off with a personal statement to which there is no opportunity to respond or which cannot be scrutinised.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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We now proceed——

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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On a point of order, the authority of the Tánaiste to spend money depends on the Votes of this House. She has her current spending wrong through the executive of the HSE by €56 million and she has her capital spending wrong by another €56 million so the cumulative error is over €100 million. Information was published under freedom of information legislation regarding problems——

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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We cannot have a debate or discussion on a personal explanation.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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——that Professor Drumm was experiencing in regard to staffing.

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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I now call No. 11, motion re appointment of members of the Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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Will the Minister indicate on what the €56 million was spent?

Séamus Pattison (Carlow-Kilkenny, Labour)
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I call the Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach, Deputy Kitt, to move the motion.

Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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That is a reasonable question.