Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Question 95: To ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the number on social housing waiting lists: if he has set a timeframe for the elimination of social housing waiting lists; and if he will implement the proposals in the NESC report on housing for an increase of 73,000 units of permanent social housing units in net terms between 2005 and 2012. [30566/05]

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The most recent three yearly assessment of need for social housing was carried out by local authorities in March 2005. Returns were received in my Department over the summer and the overall date is being finalised and will be published very shortly.

The Government has made substantial progress addressing the concerns raised in the NESC report, with increased housing output levels and record investment in social and affordable housing measures. New measures have been announced to accelerate the delivery of affordable housing and to maximise the availability of land for social and affordable housing programmes. The Government indicated at that stage that the more medium-term issues highlighted by NESC, particularly in the social and affordable housing area, would be addressed later in the year.

The NESC report advocated a significant increase in the social housing stock and, by way of illustration, argued for a social housing stock of up to 200,000 units by 2012. NESC acknowledged, however, that the appropriateness of the overall scale of ambition and the urgency of actions would be clearer after the completion of the 2005 assessment of housing need. The Government's consideration of this matter will, therefore, be informed by the outcome of the statutory housing needs assessment, which is being finalised, and the work of the housing forum, which is reviewing the effectiveness of the existing social and affordable housing schemes in the context of the Sustaining Progress agreement. I anticipate the announcement of a new statement of housing policy at the end of this year.

I am confident we have put in place a number of new arrangements to facilitate the delivery of strong programmes of social and affordable housing. In consultation with my Department, local authorities have developed five-year action plans for their social and affordable housing programmes covering the period to 2008. The preparation of these plans has improved the identification of priority needs and will help to ensure a more coherent and co-ordinated response across all housing services. They also provided an overview of delivery by a range of providers, including local authorities, voluntary and co-operative housing bodies and the private sector, through Part V and public private partnership arrangements.

Additional information not given on the floor of the House.

It is important also to maintain a focus on delivery. We have been expanding on the level of social and affordable housing output in recent years, and local authorities have been ambitious in terms of the level of output planned in the housing actions plans to 2008. A total of €2 billion is being made available for housing programmes in 2005 to further increase the output of social and affordable housing. It is anticipated the needs of in excess of 13,000 households will be met through various social and affordable housing measures in 2005.

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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My question has three strands — the number of people on social housing waiting lists, the timeframe for the elimination of such lists and if the Government will accept the implementation of the NESC proposal. The Minister of State said it will be later in the year before we know how many people are on the waiting lists and he is not in a position to provide that information.

I refer to a timeframe for the elimination of housing waiting lists. For example, the Government set a target for the elimination of hospital waiting lists. It is crazy and it is all over the place but, at least, the Government demonstrated awareness of the crisis by setting a target. Is such a target in place in the Minister of State's Department to eliminate social housing waiting lists?

The NESC proposal relates to the provision of 73,000 social housing units by 2012. Does the Minister of State accept it? He should give a "yes" or "no" answer. He has given a blurb about a statement on social housing being provided at the end of the year, despite the Government parties being in power for eight and a half years.

Does the Minister of State accept the NESC proposal? When will he set a target for the elimination of housing waiting lists?

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The last assessment of need calculated 48,000 families were on waiting lists, although 30% comprised single people and another 30% comprised one adult and one child. A housing policy is always in place and it is not a case of waiting eight years to publish a housing policy. We are updating and reviewing the housing policy in response to the NESC report and that work is ongoing in the Department.

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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The Minister of State said he was not in a position yet to say whether he accepts the NESC proposal.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The NESC report is a valuable document and it makes a useful contribution.

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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Has the Minister of State read it?

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I asked about the proposal.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The NESC report will not be the Bible of all time because account must be taken of what is happening on an ongoing basis. We have ploughed significant resources into social housing. The amount allocated to the social housing programme this year is up €110 million on last year. Our response is to generate a greater output through increased investment so that the number of people on waiting lists is reduced.

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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The Minister of State alluded to the extra €110 million allocated to the rent supplement scheme this year. Does he accept, however, that 40% of those in the private rented sector are in receipt of rent supplement, which equates to 57,714 people? They are on social housing waiting lists but the Minister of State has not set targets to eliminate the lists of 48,000 families. Under the NESC proposal, 73,000 units will be built by 2012. Does the Minister of State accept it?

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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I did not refer to rent supplement. I stated investment in local authority housing this year increased by €110 million.

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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My point stands in relation to the 40% of people in the private rented sector who are in receipt of rent supplement.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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That is correct. Approximately 60,000 people are in receipt of rent supplement.

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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Does the Minister of State have a target to deal with that major crisis?

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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No. Under the rental accommodation scheme, a programme will be rolled out over four years whereby people in receipt of rent supplement for more than 18 months will become the responsibility of local authorities.

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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They will be subsidised tenants.

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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The Minister of State is just moving deckchairs. That scheme does not deal with the problem.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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It does. People will be provided with homes, which is what they want. People in receipt of rent supplement felt they were only on short-term leases. I refer to the PRTB legislation and the rental accommodation scheme, under which people become the responsibility of the local authority if they have been in receipt of rent supplement for more than 18 months.

Arthur Morgan (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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However, we must wait until the end of the year for a statement from the Government before we know what is its policy, eight and a half years later.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The scheme will give those on waiting lists security of tenure and permanent homes. That is what people want.

Fergus O'Dowd (Louth, Fine Gael)
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They will not be given homes.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Question 96: To ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the progress to date of the provision of social housing envisaged under Part V of Planning and Development Act 2000; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [30676/05]

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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Up to the end of June 2005, a total of 1,294 housing units had been acquired under Part V arrangements, comprising 485 social and 809 affordable units. In addition, the Department estimates 736 social and 1,477 affordable units are under construction. The social units are being provided to both local authorities and voluntary housing bodies for letting to households on the waiting lists. The Part V provisions are fully operational in all local authorities and I am satisfied they are contributing significantly to the provision of social and affordable housing. The manner in which local authorities avail of Part V arrangements for social and affordable housing is a matter to be determined by individual local authorities based on the need identified in their housing strategies. Local authorities may specify different percentages of social and affordable houses, subject to Part V requirements, in their housing strategies. It is not intended that Part V be the only mechanism for the provision of social and affordable housing. The local authority housing construction programme and the voluntary and co-operative construction programmes continue to be the major contributors to the national social rented housing stock.

Taking account of new local authority housing, vacancies arising in existing houses and output under other social and affordable housing measures, I anticipate that the needs of approximately 13,000 households will be met in 2005. Detailed information on an individual local authority basis of all housing outputs for 2003 and 2004 and for the first six months of 2005 is available in my Department's quarterly and annual housing statistics bulletins, copies of which are available in the Oireachtas Library. I can send the Deputy a copy if he wishes.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Does the Minister of State acknowledge the Department's record on this issue is appalling? While the private sector has responded to demands with record house completions, the number of house completions for which the Minister of State is responsible remains inadequate. What happened to housing needs assessment? Is the Minister of State satisfied developers are circumventing the Part V regulations where there is a shortage of social and affordable housing? Is the obligation of the provision of social and affordable housing under Part V of the Planning and Development Act 2000 not applicable where the development takes place in towns or villages for which the local authority has not yet produced a development plan?

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The output arising from Part V is growing and, with the level of housing produced and 2,200 houses under construction, the dividend from Part V will be significant. If construction commences on a new estate there may be no provision under Part V as planning permission was granted before the law took effect. The dividend from Part V is slow. I reported on housing needs assessment in the last question and the outcome will be announced next month.

The dividend from Part V can be provided on-site or off-site. It can be provided in the form of land, sites, partially built houses or cash. All these methods are subject to agreement between the developer and the local authority. The Deputy may be referring to one case in his county. The preference is for social and affordable housing to be built on site but there may be cases where that is not possible. The local authority may come to an agreement with the developer but alternative sites must be in the functional area of the local authority. One could not allow the construction of social and affordable housing 30 miles away from the development in the city.

Any offer from a developer must be approved by a local authority. Some developers have made cash payments, totalling approximately €17 million. This sum is ring-fenced and is used in the provision of social and affordable housing.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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The Minister has identified an interesting point. I am aware that the social and affordable housing must be provided within the same local authority but in County Galway that may be 50, 60 or 70 miles from the source. The development may take place near the city and the social and affordable housing could be transferred to Clifden or Glenamaddy. That is ridiculous. What is the logic behind such land swapping?

Does the Minister accept the 2002 amendment to the Planning and Development Act allowed developers to transfer land away from valuable sites, such as those near Galway city or any city? If the local authority agrees, a developer may transfer his obligation under Part V from Galway city to Glenamaddy, Spiddal, Clifden or Ballyconneely. This renders the scheme ridiculous as it draws people away from the centre of population and their work places and results in roads being clogged as people come to the city to shop or work. The obligations under Part V are being met in this way.

I wish to draw the attention of the Minister of State to a case that occurred in my constituency. A person purchased a house under the social and affordable housing programme, financed by a local authority loan. If that person wants to change the mortgage a clawback payment of the full price of the house must be paid to the local authority. A person in my constituency purchased such a house for €150,000. Over two years, he has repaid €10,000 but he was quoted €220,000 to redeem the mortgage from the local authority. How can the Minister of State stand over this anomaly? Will he take steps to correct it?

Eamon Gilmore (Dún Laoghaire, Labour)
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It is a rip-off, Minister.

Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I wonder who controls the council.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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Most people agreed that flexibility was necessary to allow social and affordable housing to be provided off-site on occasions. The last change in the law allowed that option. It is not the developer who calls the shots.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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It is an arrangement between the developer and the local authority.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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I am aware of the case to which the Deputy refers. It would not be appropriate for a developer to construct social and affordable houses in an area where there was not a need.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Houses are needed everywhere.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The local authority has its housing strategy and outlines what is needed and where it is needed. It would not be satisfactory to provide social and affordable housing in areas not envisaged in the strategy.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Why was this changed in 2002? What was the arrangement with the builders? The Government caved in.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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Flexibility was necessary. I understand the case to which the Deputy is referring.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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I am not referring to a particular case, I am referring to the principle.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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The principle is sensible but it would not be appropriate to locate houses 50 miles from the main development.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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That is happening.

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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Regarding the other issue raised, until last year all social and affordable housing was financed by the State system. Two financial institutions, Bank of Ireland and EBS, now allow loans for affordable housing on new houses only. We are discussing this and seeking their agreement for re-financing. To date the institutions have not agreed, so the only way of redeeming the mortgage is the manner described by the Deputy. When the banks and financial institutions agree to re-financing the case the Deputy raised should not occur.

Pádraic McCormack (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Will they give their agreement?

Noel Ahern (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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They are very slow in doing so.