Dáil debates

Thursday, 2 June 2005

Other Questions.

Overseas Development Aid.

3:00 pm

Paul McGrath (Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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Question 6: To ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs if Cabinet approval has been sought to set a new date for the achievement of the UN target for overseas development aid; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [18614/05]

Photo of Joan BurtonJoan Burton (Dublin West, Labour)
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Question 33: To ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will elaborate on the public statement he issued on 11 March 2005 in response to comments made by Mr. Bob Geldof on the Development Aid report; the provision he has made for the allocation of moneys in forthcoming years to allow Ireland to meet its commitments in regard to overseas development aid; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [13369/05]

Photo of Jan O'SullivanJan O'Sullivan (Limerick East, Labour)
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Question 78: To ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will set a new, short, achievable timetable for the target of 0.7% of gross national product for overseas development aid in time for the UN General Assembly in New York in September 2005 when the UN millennium development goals will be re-examined; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [18496/05]

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 6, 33 and 78 together.

I refer the Deputies to my answer to Question No. 1.

Photo of Bernard AllenBernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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The Minister of State said earlier that his Department was in discussions with the Department of Finance regarding future aid. He indicated that he will be announcing the new target before the end of the year. I am sure he will publish a nice glossy brochure again next year. Will he agree that the cynics among us would say the announcement of a new target before the United Nations summit meeting will be seen as providing a figleaf to the Taoiseach when he returns to the scene of his crime in New York where he made the original commitment to0.7%? Will the Minister of State assure me that any new target will be adhered to?

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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If the Deputy followed my progress since I took up office, he will see that I have been very clear on this matter. We must set a realistic and achievable timeframe on this occasion. We must plan properly how to achieve this target and an achievable timeframe must be set. I agree with the Deputy that it would be dangerous to set an earlier target date that might not be achievable. This would have a damaging impact on the long-term public support for development assistance. It is important in this historic year for development generally precisely because we have this summit in September that noteworthy people such as musicians like Bono and Bob Geldof are doing very good work trying in an idealistic manner to urge people to increase their contribution. The contribution needs to be increased outside the European Union.

It is interesting that the targets set at the meeting in Brussels, including the interim target for 2010, will bring an additional €20 billion into the development field, which is very important. It means there will be an extra €20 billion to deal with the three diseases to which Deputy Higgins referred, namely, tuberculosis, malaria and AIDS. Some €20 billion extra will come into the development aid pool because of the decision taken in Brussels last Monday. I am proud we led the way in that regard. We must be careful about the targets we set. However, we should not forget that the Estimates package I achieved in the last budget was the largest ever in the history of the State. Some €1.8 billion will be spent over the next two years. This represents an increase of €190 million, €70 million this year, €65 million next year and €65 million the following year. This is an extraordinary achievement on which I hope to build.

Photo of Michael D HigginsMichael D Higgins (Galway West, Labour)
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Question No. 33 refers to the Taoiseach's remarks in reply to a statement made by Bob Geldof. Mr. Geldof has continually stressed the connection between aid, trade and debt. In the case of Zambia, for example, one of the requirements of the International Monetary Fund for Zambia was that it would privatise the Zambian bank, which had many small depositors. The Zambian Government said "No" and it had €1 billion removed from its debt relief. None of the countries we discussed this afternoon has a life expectancy of 50 years. It is 32.5 years or 33 years in Zambia. Some €1 billion in debt relief was taken from a country with a life expectancy of 33 years.

In regard to the points made, it is important that we make our commitment to the 0.7% contribution. In case we lose the run of ourselves, the Minister of State referred to the UN millennium development goals. They would require aid to increase from €121 billion in 2006 to €189 billion in 2015. How will this happen all over the world if we do not meet our 0.7% commitment because we have been growing too quickly? The Taoiseach's position appears to be that we became too rich to meet our commitment. His view is that if the economy went into decline, we would be able to reach the 0.7% commitment more quickly.

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy may be misquoting the Taoiseach's response to Bob Geldof's statement on the African commission. He is correct that there is a significant link between trade, debt and aid. One cannot isolate one to the detriment of the others. It is hoped this year not just to get the volume of increases required to meet the extraordinary figure the Deputy mentioned by 2015 but also to make tangible progress towards achieving this. We are providing an extra €20 billion at European level because of the decision on the interim target of 0.51% by 2010, which is good news. This is why Ireland took such a strong role within the Council of Ministers to have these targets set down for the 15 old member states and the ten new member states who went for a lower figure. This was done to send a strong signal to other countries outside the European Union, but in the OECD, who are not prepared to match the commitment Ireland and other European countries have made. It was set to act as a pressure point on other countries to come to the mark and make similar commitments to achieve the figure by 2015. Most people in the development community welcomed the announcement in Brussels for that reason. To borrow a French phrase, Pour encourager les autres.

Photo of John GormleyJohn Gormley (Dublin South East, Green Party)
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The Minister has confirmed that he intends to reach this target by 2015.

Photo of Aengus Ó SnodaighAengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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Will the Minister of State agree that if gross national product is at its highest level in this country and we remain at 0.3% or whatever, the amount of money involved will increase anyway? Therefore, to talk about an additional €180 million is playing with figures.

Have any credible development organisations agreed that the EU target of 0.7% by 2015 is acceptable? What feedback did the Minister of State receive in terms of the Government reneging on the 2007 commitment during the public consultation process? Has the issue been raised with him?

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy for attending the public consultation process in the Helix. He was the only Deputy from the Dublin area to do so, for which I thank him. We are currently on the figure of 0.41% of GNP, which is a higher figure than he perhaps thought.

Photo of Michael D HigginsMichael D Higgins (Galway West, Labour)
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It is 0.39% really.

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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The current figure is 0.41%. However, the figures will be subject to revision when we see the full end of year outturn, but this is the figure which is available at the moment.

On the question of the 2015 date, the UN said that developed countries like Ireland should achieve the 0.7% figure by 2015. The EU has committed to that figure. I hope that commitment will be reaffirmed by the Taoiseach and his colleagues in the European Council in the next month or so.

Photo of Bernard AllenBernard Allen (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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The Minister of State has jumped eight years.

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I hope they will reaffirm the commitment made at the development ministers council. This would be a positive signal as we push into the remainder of the year which will involve the millennium development summit. Deputy Michael D. Higgins referred earlier to the important issue of trade matters. The Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, Deputy Martin, the Minister of State at that Department, Deputy Michael Ahern, and I will travel to Hong Kong in December for the conclusion of the Doha round negotiations. Our intention is to make it the development round of the talks. We want to ensure a good result from a development point of view so the trade deal is of significant assistance. Developing countries are likely to gain seven times more from a trade concession than from an aid concession from developed countries. That should also be the focus of our efforts in the months ahead.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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Is the Minister of State satisfied overseas development aid funding filters down to the most needy in Third World countries? Is the Department generating value for money in the projects? Many members of the public are concerned that the money does not always go to the most needy. With regard to the consultative process, what is the general reaction of NGOs and others interested in this issue? Has the issue of the 0.7% target been raised at the public meetings? Are people satisfied with the target date of 2015?

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I do not wish to misrepresent the comments of people at the meeting and my comments will be subjective. However, the discussions have been involved. Deputy Ó Snodaigh attended the public meeting at the Helix and he may enlighten the Deputy further on it. He may be more independent because he is not a Government Member. The 0.7% issue has been raised and it is clear it is passionately held that this target should be met by people interested in development aid. Two thirds of the audience at the meetings has been dominated by NGO representatives and Fairtrade groupings while the balance comprises ordinary citizens with a strong interest in this area. The discussions have been interesting for that reason and it has been a genuine listening exercise.

Concerns have been raised about whether the money is reaching its intended target and filtering down to the poorest of the poor. Other issues raised include respect for human rights, respect for proper governance and corruption. It is difficult to explain to people that 80% of our assistance is provided government to government in programme countries. Our programme was been well evaluated over the years both in value for money and the efficacy of spending. Thankfully, our aid programme has not been the subject of corruption involving the funds advanced to countries. The reason for that is our funding is ring-fenced and devoted to sectors such as health and education and it is tracked appropriately to ensure it is used for the development of these sectors. Our programme has produced spectacular successes. For instance, in Tanzania, over a three-year period, primary school attendance increased by up to 15%, which is extraordinary.

Photo of Finian McGrathFinian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
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What about issues such as housing and water?

Photo of Conor LenihanConor Lenihan (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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Our programme has resulted in enormous successes, which I hope to share with Members in the next few months in a supplementary package similar to that described by Deputy Michael Higgins. It will explain what is being achieved through the programme. It is important that this knowledge should be shared with the public.