Jim O'Keeffe (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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Question 5: To ask the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform his views on the upsurge in the level of gun crime, robberies and hostage-taking; and the steps he has taken to deal with the activities of armed gangs to bring them to justice. [16224/05]

Joe Costello (Dublin Central, Labour)
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Question 6: To ask the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the steps being taken to deal with the surge of serious crime over the past few months, including the spate of gangland style killings, robberies of cash in transit consignments and abductions and kidnappings; if he intends to provide additional resources to the Garda to help it combat these killings; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [16261/05]

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 5 and 6 together.

I have outlined previously to the House the extensive range of measures which have been taken to deal with the types of crime referred to in the questions. Those measures will, of course, continue.

I have been concerned for some time, and this is a concern shared on all sides of the House, that serious offences which have been taking place have made evident the emergence of a gun culture in Dublin. This, sadly, has been manifest in the number of fatal shootings that have taken place, particularly in recent weeks. Those deaths will be comprehensively investigated, as will the incidents of armed robberies and other gun crimes which have taken place. The Garda Commissioner advises me that he is confident of success in a number of those investigations.

The Garda has amassed a considerable amount of intelligence about gun crime in Dublin and has a very clear picture of what is going on. Both the Garda Commissioner and I, in the course of intensive discussions in recent days, have agreed that the time is now ripe to build on that work in ways that will strike at the heart of the gun culture which has emerged.

I can report to the House that last night the Garda Síochána launched Operation Anvil. This is one of the most intensive special policing operations ever undertaken in the State. It will be intelligence-driven and will be aimed at those involved in gun crime of any kind in the Dublin metropolitan region.

Its cost will amount to €6.5 million, which I have made available from my Department's allocation for this year, in addition to other allocations to the Garda Síochána. It will involve about 15,000 additional hours overtime being worked each week by gardaí in the Dublin area. This expenditure will not adversely affect existing agreed overtime allocations across Garda divisions, including those for the Dublin metropolitan division.

It would be counterproductive for me to give precise details of what will be involved in Operation Anvil but it will involve divisional uniform and detective patrols throughout the region, backed up by national units, overt and covert operations, mobile and foot patrols, random checkpoints at specific locations, extensive searches, execution of warrants and gathering and collation of high quality criminal intelligence. The Commissioner is adamant this will not be done by sucking in those involved in community policing, depriving that area of the necessary manpower. The operation will be focused, sustained, targeted and relentless.

One feature of the gun culture that has emerged is the apparent belief on the part of some criminals that they are not bound by or subject to the laws of the land. Nobody is above the law and, likewise, nobody is beneath the protection of the law. Operation Anvil is intended to supplement existing operations to ensure that lawlessness does not prevail, that the threat posed by these criminals is met sternly and effectively and, above all else, human life is respected.

While our legislation for tackling organised crime is one of the toughest in Europe, I propose it is strengthened further. The Criminal Justice Bill 2004, which is on Second Stage in the House, provides for a comprehensive package of anti-crime measures which will enhance Garda powers in the investigation and prosecution of offences. These include a general power on the issue of search warrants, including a superintendent's right to issue an emergency search warrant in certain circumstances, increased detention powers of up to 24 hours for arrestable offences and a statutory power to preserve a crime scene. Part 3 makes provision for the admissibility as evidence in court of statements by witnesses who subsequently refuse to testify or retract their original statements. I am considering introducing several amendments, including a proposal to provide for criminal offences for the participation in a criminal organisation, as requested by the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Justice, Equality, Defence and Women's Rights.

With the recent increase in violent crime involving firearms, there is an overriding necessity to ensure public safety and security are given priority in any review of policy and legislation on firearms. I have decided to bring forward proposals in the context of the Criminal Justice Bill to provide the secure custody of firearms, minimum sentences and new offences for modifying firearms, such as the sawing off of a shotgun barrel. I intend to provide for severe penalties for the possession of sawn-off shotguns and the modification of shotguns.

I ask all sides of the House to help me expedite these measures in a genuine spirit of co-operation. I ask all Members to welcome the measures the Garda Commissioner has put in place since last night, which will be a substantial and unprecedented operation against gun crime in Dublin city.

Jim O'Keeffe (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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At long last the Minister has stirred himself, even if only by making available funding of €6.5 million to the Garda Síochána. This should be of some help and I wish the force every success with the provision of an additional 15,000 hours in overtime.

Are we clear on the extent of the gun crime problem? The rate of crimes involving guns is unprecedented, with a minimum of one murder a week and robberies of ATMs and cash in transit, with large amounts of moneys being taken out of the system by criminals. The Minister will have the co-operation of all sides of the House on necessary legislation. I suggest, however, he circulates his proposals on making membership of an armed gang a criminal offence. It should be published on a separate basis to the Criminal Justice Bill so that it can be passed quickly by the House. It may be tied up if it is locked into the Criminal Justice Bill as there are many other issues in the Bill that need to be teased out.

Will the Minister also consider introducing legislation on hostage-taking? I appreciate serious penalties exist for false imprisonment. However, to mark our absolute revulsion at hostage-taking, it should be set out as a separate offence. It is all very well to have certain penalties for stealing, but stealing involving hostage-taking must be a separate offence. I urge the Minister to examine this and I assure him he will have co-operation from this side of the House if legislation is introduced. We have legislation dealing with hostage-taking with regard to international crime but not domestic crime. If it is sufficiently important to deal with it internationally, why not take it into account in our domestic legislation?

Regarding resources, the Garda is welcome to the 15,000 hours of overtime, but can the Minister take any further urgent steps to ensure the Garda will have the support it needs on a continuing basis, in terms of manpower and equipment? The Garda operates with equipment to which armed gangs have ready access. There is no encryption or security in their walkie-talkie equipment, which is 20 years out of date. The Garda PULSE computer system also needs to be upgraded. Can we urgently provide the Garda with the necessary resources on a continuing basis?

Could the Minister give an analysis of the situation regarding armed gangs in the country? It is important that the public know. I have heard that there are 17 armed gangs. Is that correct? How many people are involved? I know the Minister cannot name names, certainly not in these circumstances, but would it be important in terms of alerting the public to the situation in full, and giving it more information as to who is involved, their numbers, the extent of the problem and the number of gangs involved? The public should also be told about the weaponry involved. In the past three years, some 1,300 weapons have been stolen, while I do not know how many have been smuggled into the country. The public is concerned, and entitled to the information available. If it had it, the public could be of assistance to the Garda in dealing with the horrendous problem facing us.

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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I welcome Deputy O'Keeffe's support for getting on with the core legislative requirements to deal with the problem. Although some of the provisions of the Criminal Justice Bill are controversial, most of the central ones, such as detention, search and scene preservation powers will assist the Garda Síochána in the fight against this kind of crime.

Regarding crime involving organised gangs, the Joint Committee on Justice, Equality, Defence and Women's Rights has considered the matter and I am moving on Committee Stage to meet that committee's thought-out proposals.

Hostage-taking is a form of false imprisonment——

Jim O'Keeffe (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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A gross form.

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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——and a very serious offence for which the penalty is life imprisonment. I heard Deputy O'Keeffe on radio discussing whether we should regard hostage-taking as a separate species, so to speak, but we should remember that the penalty for false imprisonment can be life imprisonment. I do not want to speak entirely off the cuff, but perhaps a case can be made for a minimum sentence where a threat is made to the life of an individual. Almost anything, even putting someone in a cupboard, can be false imprisonment, but when someone's life is threatened for the purpose of committing another felony, there may be a case for a minimum sentence. We could consider that on Committee Stage of the Criminal Justice Bill.

It is true that depending on one's definition of a gang, there are between 15 and 30 groups of people here who confederate to commit offences. At this stage I do not want to say much about them, but in case the Deputy thinks these figures are conjured up, I have seen spreadsheets with the names of people involved, an elaboration, a map, so to speak, of how these gangs are organised and inter-related. It is not as if the Garda is blundering about with no strategic view of the problems.

Deputy O'Keeffe should note that there is a clear pattern of people who in the past were members of paramilitary bodies, now using for their private ends all the thuggish skills they developed and the mercilessness they exhibited, threatening and killing innocent people, and shooting people in the head. On a number of recent occasions, intelligence briefings have suggested to me that former so-called patriots have now taken to the most appalling thuggery to enrich themselves.

Regarding firearms, the theft of shotguns in particular is a serious matter. One of the proposals among the Committee Stage amendments of the Criminal Justice Bill is to create a mandatory regime for secure custody of firearms in the houses of those who have them for lawful purposes. I will deal with that on Committee Stage.

Joe Costello (Dublin Central, Labour)
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I welcome what the Minister said about giving €6.5 million to Operation Anvil, but I remind the Minister that just before Christmas he provided some €4 million to what I believe was Operation Crossover, for the months of November and December. Once the money and overtime hours are gone, the resources are gone and we are back to square one. If I recall correctly, it was in November that the Minister came out with the rather flamboyant expression: "I don't believe there is any new energy in crime in Dublin". That was in November 2004. The Minister said he believed the situation then was "to some extent, the sting of the dying wasp". Since then, there have been ten or 12 gangland-type killings, so the Minister is clearly out of touch in this matter.

What we are now getting is a belated response by the Minister in an effort to show the public he is doing something about the situation, though he made no effort to prevent any of these killings or to bring the perpetrators to justice. When the €6.5 million is spent, we will be back to square one again. Can the Minister now give us some commitment that we will not merely get a small pool of money for use on a once-off mechanism, with the plan, if there is one, to be then thrown aside once again? Can we have the commitment in resources and personnel on an ongoing basis? The Minister might outline to us how he would provide something of this nature. When a person is shot dead emerging from Mountjoy Prison, in broad daylight, the situation is clearly out of control.

Will the Minister agree that one of the reasons there are so many killings by these hit-men, who are paid by criminal gangsters with access to drugs, and a great deal of money as a result, is that the hit-men are at virtually no risk of detection, prosecution or imprisonment? In the past five years, the detection and prosecution rate has been only 16%, the lowest such rate for all headline offences. If one commits a gangland murder, one is less likely to be punished for that than for any other headline crime one might commit. What will the Minister do about that?

Regarding security firms, is it a fact that we currently have no licence scheme, regulations or standards for any of the security operations here, and that some 26,000 security personnel go merrily about their business while there are no proper standards or vetting procedures in place? Can the Minister give us some idea of when the private security services legislation will be in operation to the extent that it will have some meaning?

With regard to the gun culture, what will the Minister do about the enormous number of weapons that are available in this country? The Minister indicated that some of these are paramilitary weapons, some are smuggled weapons while others are stolen, but having that knowledge is not good enough. What steps will he take to get those weapons out of circulation?

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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I act in conjunction with the Garda Commissioner in the allocation of funds. Operation Crossover, to which the Deputy referred, was a successful operation. It targeted specific areas on the western side of this city and had a significant effect.

Joe Costello (Dublin Central, Labour)
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Everything is now back to square one.

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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We are by no means back to square one. There was a significant improvement in the situation arising from Operation Crossover. I attended the opening of a new offenders' transition home in the Blanchardstown area some days ago and, on that occasion, voluntary groups who are concerned with crime in the Blanchardstown area reported to me that there had been a dramatic improvement in policing in their area, with which they were happy, and that the improvement was being sustained. I congratulate local Garda management for reallocating its resources to produce this greater visibility.

It is true that I believed last year that, as a result of Operation Crossover, the organisations of major players had been broken up and that they were effectively on the run. However, others have stepped into their shoes and the Garda Commissioner has asked me for these extra resources. Deputy Costello would ask why these are not available all the time and would suggest that there should be no particular set of operations but constant overtime and the attendant constant flows of money.

Joe Costello (Dublin Central, Labour)
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I am not saying that, I am saying the opposite.

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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It is important that when we engage in a certain type of expenditure, we keep it under review to assess whether it has lost its vitality and whether it is yielding dividends.

Joe Costello (Dublin Central, Labour)
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I am seeking ongoing resources.

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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It would be easy to simply tell the Garda Commissioner that he can have as much money as he wants which can be spent as he wishes, but I cannot do that and I accept the Deputy is not inviting me to do it. I cannot operate on the basis of proclaiming that there is no limit to overtime and that the Garda can do what it wants at any time. If that psychology took hold, we would simply see diminishing returns.

I thank the Opposition Deputies for heeding my call last year to pass the legislation establishing the Private Security Authority of Ireland. The authority is now up and running in Tipperary, its chief executive has been appointed and it is putting in place the licensing regime for cash in transit companies. I outlined previously to the House the issues that arose in this area and the 120 day period which I had allowed the banks and cash in transit companies to get their houses in order.

Joe Costello (Dublin Central, Labour)
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Do not give them any time.

Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)
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I could click my fingers and demand that it be done tomorrow but if it is necessary to buy equipment and to establish new training regimes for the workforce and so forth, time is required. However, I should make clear to the chairmen of the banks, most of whom I know personally and whom I hope will hear my remarks because they keep an eye on what happens in this House, that I am not bluffing about the 120 day period. If they think that on day 119 they can begin to engage in this process, they are greatly mistaken. I urge them to act on this now because I will not hesitate to impose a regime on the banks which will allow me to direct the level of security for which they must pay. This country deserves protection from those who steal large sums of money because it is they who will later take other people's lives and invest the proceeds in drugs.

Pat Carey (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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We must move to the next question.

Jim O'Keeffe (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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May I ask another supplementary?

Pat Carey (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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No, it will soon be time for ordinary questions and other Members wish to speak. In the interests of all Members, we must proceed.

Jim O'Keeffe (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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I just wish to make two points.

Pat Carey (Dublin North West, Fianna Fail)
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We must proceed to Question No. 7.