Finian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)

I welcome the opportunity to speak on the Legal Practitioners (Irish Language) Bill 2007. This is an important Bill as it allows us to discuss the broader issues of our native language, the legal profession, competencies, and the new changing Ireland with its many new languages and cultures. Respect for difference and diversity should be at the core of our discussions, but we also need to ensure that the Irish language and culture are protected and respected at all costs. There is no time for fudging on this issue. In the debate today I intend to focus on the legislation and the current Irish language requirements for barristers and solicitors.

Before we go into a detailed breakdown of the Bill, it is important to deal with the background. The Legal Practitioners (Irish Language) Bill 2007 repeals and replaces the existing statutory provisions of Irish language competence for barristers and solicitors. The Bill promotes better use of the Irish language by legal practitioners and the provision of legal services through Irish. I welcome this as it is a positive and constructive development. The Bill requires that King's Inns and the Law Society have regard to Government policy on bilingualism and take reasonable steps to ensure that an adequate number of barristers and solicitors are able to practice the law through the Irish language. The Bill also provides that these institutions should hold courses on Irish legal terminology and the understanding of legal texts in the Irish language to enable practitioners to identify the nature of the service being sought and, where appropriate, to facilitate a referral to a practitioner competent to provide the service through Irish. This is an important measure.

We spoke earlier about the development of the Irish language. It is important that we ensure that the opportunity is provided for people to learn the language in the community. There are some excellent examples of good practice around the country, in places such as Galway, Donegal and Kerry, which are making a massive contribution both to the Irish language and to the development of the tourism industry. I have visited Donegal a number of times and I found it interesting to see people from different countries learning the Irish language. I was amazed at what I saw at Oideas Gael in Glencolmcille. I commend the people directly involved in this, including Liam Ó Cuinneagáin, who are doing much valuable work for the development of the language.

Both King's Inns and the Law Society will also establish an advanced course on the practice of law through the Irish language as an optional subject in their professional training courses. These advanced courses will open doors to those who are not students but wish to obtain a competence enabling them to practise law through Irish. We must support people who want to ensure that Irish citizens and Irish language speakers are respected and their rights are protected. Examinations in the practice of law through Irish will be held at least once a year and only those persons who have undertaken the advanced course will be permitted to sit these exams. The names and contact details of the barristers and solicitors who pass the examinations will be entered on to a register published by King's Inns and the Law Society. Both bodies will be required to submit a report to the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on an annual basis on the operation of the new arrangements. This is important in terms of ensuring accountability and transparency.

The current Irish language requirements for barristers under the Legal Practitioners (Qualification) Act 1929 are as follows: "No person shall be admitted by the Chief Justice to practise as a barrister-at-law in [Irish courts] unless he satisfies the Chief Justice, by such evidence as the Chief Justice shall prescribe, that he possesses a competent knowledge of the Irish language". "Competent knowledge" is defined as "such a degree of oral and written proficiency in the use of the language as is sufficient to enable a legal practitioner efficiently to receive instructions, to advise clients, to examine witnesses and to follow proceedings in the Irish language". This is the basis of a complaint I receive regularly from constituents who are Irish language speakers. They need to be confident that they can meet legal people who can advise them in their native language. The obligation to ensure proficiency in Irish in the case of any barrister who wishes to be called to the Bar lies with the Chief Justice, but there is no requirement to include Irish as an optional or obligatory subject in the King's Inns barrister-at-law degree course. Any tuition or record of proficiency required is given outside the degree course and arranged so that the Chief Justice can fulfil his or her statutory function.

The 1929 Act applied to solicitors until 1954 when new arrangements were introduced in the Solicitors Act. To qualify for admission as a solicitor, the Law Society requires students under the 1954 Act to undertake two examinations in Irish. The first examination applies to persons seeking apprenticeships and the second applies to persons wishing to be admitted as solicitors. The important purpose of the second examination is to ensure that the persons who pass it have competent knowledge of the Irish language, that is, such a degree of oral and written proficiency in the use of the language as to enable a solicitor efficiently to receive instructions, advise clients, examine witnesses and follow proceedings in the Irish language. It is the same competency test used in the 1929 Act for barristers. It is important that we understand these issues in respect of this debate.

People have concerns and a number of organisations have raised issues. Many Deputies have received the two amendments submitted by Conradh na Gaeilge. The first amendment is to clarify whether the proposed terminology course will be accompanied by an examination. It states:

If no examination accompanies the subject, it shall command neither respect nor attention in the context of other subjects which shall require study and which it shall be necessary to pass. Furthermore, there is no provision in the Bill as it stands for persons who have passed the other examinations in King's Inns or the Law Society, but who have not as yet complied with the statutory Irish language requirement.

The second amendment relates to the provisions in respect of courts in the Gaeltacht. As should be the case, I have listened closely to friends and colleagues living in Gaeltacht areas. The amendment states:

At present, for the most part, English is the language of the courts in the Gaeltacht, which impacts negatively on the use of Irish in general there. Judges sitting in districts and on circuits containing Gaeltacht areas are usually not competent in Irish. At the same time, judges competent in Irish are in other districts and circuits. Gaeltacht cases are conducted at locations in the Gaeltacht or through English in the Gaeltacht itself, except in south Connemara. This situation does not accord with Government policy in relation to the fostering of Irish as the community language in the Gaeltacht. Much better that the Gaeltacht be an administrative unit administered through Irish by people interested in doing so. The District Courts are being restructured at present, in any event.

I support Conradh na Gaeilge in its concerns because we must accept that people who need a service delivered through Irish deserve such as a right. If we are discussing the protection of rights, this is an essential element. Everyone should consider the second amendment carefully because it is a sensible option. We must ensure that people who want to deal with court cases through Irish have their rights protected. This matter is an important part of the debate.

A number of constituents have contacted me with their concerns regarding the legislation's interpretation of, for example, sections 1(3)(a) and 1(3)(b) for students on the current degree course and in general. They are required to pay for and sit a statutory Irish language course run by King's Inns before they sit Irish exams. If they sit the course and not the exam, do they fall within section 1(3)(a)? What would occur if they did not do the exam or course after the Bill has been passed? The Bill does not make that clear. Does it mean that, despite paying €12,500, sitting approximately 20 exams, attending in excess of 200 lectures and completing the countless hours of work already required, they will not be entitled to the degree of barrister-at-law? Does it mean that, despite being otherwise fully qualified and competent in the practice of law having completed the degree, they will not be entitled to be called to the Bar? My constituents deserve to be listened to in the broader debate. Sections 1(3)(a) and 1(3)(b) as drafted are unclear to some and add further complication for those trying to qualify into the profession. I would ask that this unnecessary barrier be examined by the insertion of section 2 of the Labour Party's legal qualifications Bill, an interesting submission.

I am not 100% certain regarding the details of the issues, but I encourage people to listen to all of the concerns I have raised in today's debate. It is important to have them dealt with in a positive and constructive manner. I want to protect the integrity of the legal profession and to ensure the maximum support for Irish speakers. Due to certain cases, the legal profession has taken a hammering in recent weeks, but it is important that its members understand the questions of respect and trust involved in this issue. The majority provide an excellent service and get on with their lives, but we need strict regulations and supervisory authorities to ensure that trust between clients and solicitors or barristers is not damaged. Constituents, particularly brokers and those involved in the mortgage industry, have approached me with significant concerns about what is occurring in this sector of society. After the problems, it is important that the legal profession gets its act together to win back the public's trust. One cannot demand trust and expect people to give it. It must be earned.

As we are discussing the protection of people's rights, it is important to respect the rights of people with disabilities. In the past 24 hours, the Galway abuse report was published. Initiated seven years ago, it examined the standards in residential centres where young people with intellectual disabilities were abused, which was unacceptable because their rights must be protected. I raise this matter because there has been silence from many quarters. Considerable abuse took place in institutions, but the rights of the young children and adults with intellectual disabilities in question were not protected. It is important to speak out on this issue because the silence in recent days is sad.

I encourage people to consider raising national standards and the introduction of inspections of residential centres and community homes for children and adults with intellectual disabilities. I want to ensure the protection of the almost 400 children with disabilities in residential units and that what occurred in Galway will never recur. It was a horrific nightmare. It is difficult enough for the families of children and adults with intellectual disabilities to deal with the major issue itself, but we must speak out and action must be taken when cases of abuse show how vulnerable those young people are. I raise this matter in the context of the legal profession because it is important in today's debate on barristers and solicitors. I referred to civic responsibility and trust of the legal profession.

The Bill is to facilitate and promote the Irish language in our legal system. I am convinced that the Bill's provisions will lead to significant improvements in the teaching of Irish by King's Inns and the Law Society. I am hopeful that the Bill will better ensure that an adequate number of solicitors and barristers are available to provide legal services in Irish to any clients who require them. Supply and demand is the key issue we must address. If a different section of society demands barristers and solicitors who can use the language, we must be able to deal with it. This is the responsibility of all Members of the Oireachtas because we must ensure that the rights of people who want to speak Irish as their first language everyday are protected. They have a right to have their cases held in Irish, particularly in Gaeltacht areas where it is unacceptable that judges are not proficient in Irish and cannot deal with the cases locally. We must deal with that to ensure an adequate number of solicitors and barristers is available.

This is important legislation. The purpose of the Legal Practitioners (Irish Language) Bill is about promoting better use of the Irish language by legal practitioners and the provision of legal services through Irish. It is important that we deal with this issue and follow it up in a positive and constructive manner.

I welcome the idea of having an advanced course on the practise of law through the Irish language as an optional subject in professional training courses. That advanced course will be open to those who are not students but who wish to obtain a competence to enable them practise law through Irish. I am delighted there are people who want to get directly involved in these courses because they are important, particularly for those who have an interest in the issue and who want to serve their country in that way. That is important in respect of the legislation before the House.

We talk about people's rights in respect of the legal profession. There is a shift in society, and in this regard I commend the human rights lawyers, against those who raise human rights issues. It is important we are vigilant in terms of our legal standards, protecting human rights and justice issues generally because we must ensure all our citizens are protected and treated with respect. I link that to this debate because the Bill deals with legal practitioners. As I said earlier, we cannot allow particular people involved in the legal field to either rip off people or not respect other cultures and languages.

That leads me to the broader debate, which is important also. We have many foreign nationals living here and all the languages that involves is another area we should explore. If we are talking about respecting diversity and celebrating difference, we must respect that difference and if a person's first language is Irish or another language, we should explore that also.

I am aware there are people in minority communities in the State who have an interest in developing these services, including people from Poland, Nigeria, Latin America, Spain and Italy. They would be effective in advising those people and they should be supported. We should think outside the box in developing these services. We are debating the Irish language in the legal profession but we must be more creative when it comes to respecting minority religions in our own country. That is the way forward for a country such as ours. We must accept that we are a rapidly changing country. There has been a massive change even in the past nine or ten years but we must also manage that and be positive about it. If people break the law we should treat them the same way as we would treat others and let them suffer the full rigours of the law. Equally, we must ensure that people's rights are respected, particularly the rights of those from minority communities.

I raise these issues because there are many people doing valuable work in this area. Those of us not directly involved with the Irish language or Conradh na Gaeilge but who have many friends and colleagues in this area are aware of the magnificent work they do in developing the language. I commend them and take this opportunity to welcome the valuable work they do.

Our language and our culture is a key resource, both for us as a nation and also internationally. People come to Ireland because they want to see what Ireland is like. They do not come here and expect to see somewhere like Lanzarote. They come here for our language, our culture, our new way of life, the rain, our love of beautiful scenery in Kerry, Cork and particularly the very scenic spots in Dublin North Central, Clontarf and around the bay. I hope that bay will be protected for the next 20 years in the interests of tourism.

On the legislation, it is important that those in the legal profession listen to the people who are demanding their rights as citizens of this State. As legislators, we must ensure that we listen and respect the people who want to avail of the services of the courts and justice system through Irish. Solicitors and barristers should be able to advise people through Irish if that is their choice. It is about respecting choice. There is massive potential also with all the gaelscoilleanna being developed in Dublin and urban areas throughout the country. There is a future in that area for the professions involved.

I welcome some of the positive contributions to the debate. I hope some of the ideas I put forward will be accepted and I look forward to future debate.

See this speech in context