Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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That was very beneficial. What we have learned over the two days took me by surprise. I am sure it has been so for others.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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Can I make a suggestion?

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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Yes.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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Perhaps we could go to the Botanic Gardens or someplace similar to discuss weed control for one of our meetings.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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Before or after the recess? It is probably not possible before the recess.

Cormac Devlin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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That is a good idea. The high growth is in the summer months so if we are going to see it in all its glory, that is an option. Perhaps with some of the councils that have responded to the clerk we might see if there is a willingness to highlight a particular area or programme they are doing or an initiative they are taking.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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Let us look at what would be realistic to organise.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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Yes, no bother. The Senator will not get any objection to that.

We have nine petitions for consideration today. Petition No. 21 of 2021 is "Taking in charge" - Mr. Terence Coskeran. This petition relates to the request that the local authority take in charge a residential development of five houses at Rocksprings, Kilross, County Tipperary. The secretariat corresponded with Tipperary County Council on the petition on behalf of the petitioner. The council responded and the secretariat forwarded the response to the petitioner and also to the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage requesting further information. The Department responded stating that, among other things, two key issues need to be determined before the Department would consider providing funding to resolve the developer-provided water services infrastructure at Rocksprings estate. The committee recommends that the response from the Department be forwarded to the petitioner for comment. Do members have any views?

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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Chairman, I should have read through this, but I did not get the opportunity. Who owns those houses?

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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Mr. Terence Coskeran.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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That individual owns them.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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Yes. He built them in 2004 and had an agreement with the council that once everything was done with regard to its planning at the time, it would take the estate in charge. Later, Irish Water was formed and this is where it is with the developer provided water services infrastructure.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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That is fine.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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The report says it is only approximately €50,000 to connect it to the council system. The reply from the Department sheds some light on the situation there and outlines two main issues. The first issue is whether Tipperary County Council has significant capacity to take the wastewater from the treatment plant. The second issue is the wider examination being undertaken by the Department regarding the alignment of the ownership of the Environmental Protection Agency certificate of authorisation of small-scale wastewater treatment plants to bring certainty to their long-term operation and maintenance. The first point seems to be covered insofar as the county council made an application on 17 September 2019. It appears to be the second point where there is an issue. It is basically the fundamental aspect of taking in charge the transfer of the long-term responsibility or the ownership of the wastewater treatment unit.

This is causing a lot of distress to this chap. It is going on since 2004. He had an agreement with the council at the time, but events took over. The recommendation is that it be sent back to him.

As I said at yesterday's meeting, I imagine he has got the same documentation on numerous occasions since 2004. We will see. Is the secretariat's recommendation agreed? Agreed.

Petition No. P00043/21 from Mr. Fernandos Ongolly concerns support access to employment for non-EEA PhD students' spouses in Ireland. The secretariat corresponded with the Department of Justice on this petition on behalf of the petitioner. The Department replied and its response was forwarded to the petitioner. The petitioner provided a very comprehensive response. The committee recommends that the correspondence from the petitioner be forwarded to the Department of Justice for comment and the petitioner be notified of same. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Petition No. P0006/22 from Mr. John O'Malley states that by-elections in Ireland may comply with legislation but they do not comply with the Constitution. The secretariat corresponded with the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage on this petition on behalf of the petitioner. The Department responded and its response was sent to the petitioner who replied. The petitioner’s reply was sent to the Department who responded for a second time advising that, among other things, the programme for Government commits to examining the replacement of by-elections with an alternate list system. It also commits to establishing an independent electoral commission, which is being processed through the Electoral Reform Bill 2022, currently being debated in the Houses of the Oireachtas. The committee recommends that the latest correspondence from the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage be sent to the petitioner for further comment. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Petition No. P0008/22 from Mr. James Walsh concerns the banning of herbicides in public places. The secretariat has corresponded with the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine and with the 31 local authorities on this petition on behalf of the petitioner. The Department responded and its response was forwarded to the petitioner. The Department also presented to the committee on this petition and the petitioner has now replied to the Department via the secretariat. Approximately two thirds of the local authorities have also responded regarding their use of herbicides in public places. Wicklow County Council responded and was identified as a local authority with a proactive, environmentally friendly approach to herbicide use. That county council has recently presented a very comprehensive report to the committee. The committee recommends that Mr. Walsh’s comments and attachments be forwarded to the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine for further comment. Do members have a view?

Cormac Devlin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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I have no problem with that course of action. It is only right. It is to be hoped that more than two thirds of the local authorities will have responded by the next meeting. As regards the ones who have not, it would only be right for us to examine that at our next public session to see which ones have not responded.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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Seven local authorities have not responded. One of the three outstanding city councils has responded while the other two have not at this stage. The secretariat sent a reminder to them yesterday. We will look at that next time.

Petition No. P00015/22 from Ms. Eileen Kelly McCarthy concerns Castlemartyr community hall. The secretariat corresponded with east Cork municipal district on this petition on behalf of the petitioner. An officer of east Cork municipal district responded stating that it had “no responsibility or jurisdiction in relation to this matter”. The committee recommends that the correspondence from east Cork municipal district be sent to the petitioner for comment and that the matter be raised with Cork County Council. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Petition No. P00016/22 from Mr. Gamepro Yt is to make Friday part of the weekend with no school. The secretariat corresponded with the Department of Education on this petition on behalf of the petitioner and received a reply from the Department. The committee recommends that the correspondence from the Department be sent to the petitioner, the petitioner be given 14 days to respond and to be advised that if no response is received within those 14 days, the petition will be closed. That petition was received on 1 April. We are not really expecting a response.

Cormac Devlin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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That petition could have come from my household, by all accounts. The recommendation is a good course of action.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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Is the recommendation agreed? Agreed.

Petition No. P00017/22 from Ms Rebecca Smyth concerns lower outpatient waiting times for urgent cases. The secretariat corresponded with the HSE on this petition on behalf of the petitioner and, following a request for further information, the HSE replied and set out the process for managing patients and waiting times. It further advised that, in relation to this petitioner's specific case, “it is currently being reviewed by Children’s Ireland Hospital Group under the Incident Management Framework (2020) and when the review is complete, the Children’s Ireland Hospital Group will be in contact with the family concerned”. The committee recommends that the correspondence from the HSE be sent to the petitioner for comment. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Petition No. P00022/22 from Mr. Carles Pujol concerns an investigation to identify if Irish citizens have been spied on illegally. The secretariat corresponded with the cybersecurity and Internet policy division in the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications on this petition on behalf of the petitioner. The Department replied and, among other things, suggested that the Department of Justice be asked to consider this petition in the first instance. The committee recommends that the correspondence from the cybersecurity and Internet policy division be forwarded to the Department of Justice, along with the petition, and that the reply be sent to the petitioner for comment. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Petition No. P00026/22 from Ms Margaret Keogh concerns the carer's allowance. The secretariat corresponded with the Department of Social Protection on this petition on behalf of the petitioner and the Department replied. The committee recommends that the correspondence from the Department of Social Protection be sent to the petitioner for comment and the petition, along with the correspondence from the Department of Social Protection, be forwarded to the Department of Health and the HSE for consideration. Ms Keogh made some very valid points in her petition about the role of carers and the amount of money they save the State. We all know they are vital in that regard. Is the recommendation agreed? Agreed.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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I will add there are extensive discussions about carers going on in the joint committee on social protection, in addition to other committees. Maybe it could be pointed out in the letter that there is quite an airing of this matter. I accept there are some good points in what Ms Keogh said.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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That concludes our consideration of public petitions. I invite members of the public to submit petitions via our online portal at petitions.oireachtas.ie. A petition may be addressed to the Houses of the Oireachtas on a matter of general public concern or interest or an issue of public policy. Would members like to make any final comments?

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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I will address the comment the Chairman made about asking the public to submit petitions. I served on the first committee on public petitions. At that time, Senator Buttimer and I were very strongly of the view that once the committee got settled in, and now that I am back on this one, it should consider moving outside Leinster House for a meeting and publicising that meeting. I am not looking for junkets throughout the country but to get our message out. On the day we move into one province, we could contact the radio stations and local newspapers there and have a sort of public forum. This will obviously not happen before the recess but maybe it is something we could put on the agenda for discussion in the autumn. There is a lot of benefit from this committee. There are always people who are not satisfied with answers elsewhere and they have a forum here, if we see they have a point of view that can be brought forward. Maybe it is something we can consider. Of course, the Covid pandemic destroyed all these plans but we might discuss it in the autumn.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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I appreciate where the Senator is coming from. He brought this matter up previously and there was agreement that was what should be done. As he said, Covid put a stop to it all. I cannot see any problem with that being organised. It would benefit the committee and start to raise awareness throughout the country if we hold three or four meetings in a year in the provinces and advertise them. We will ask the secretariat to look into it.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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That is fine.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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I do not think there are any legal considerations stopping us. The only matter is that of the precincts for public meetings. We will ask the secretariat to check it out.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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The Joint Committee on Social Protection, Community and Rural Development and the Islands will hold a meeting on one of the islands, as it has responsibility for the islands. It is possible to get round the legal consideration but I understand that it definitely has to be checked out.

I agree with Senator Murphy's proposal. He has raised it before and it is good that he raised it again. The breadth of petitions we have just discussed shows there is an interest in and awareness of the committee. The Senator is correct that a bit of publicity for the work of the committee will bring forward other petitions.

Speaking of our role as a committee, we were sought for our experience as a committee internationally for other parliaments looking at setting up similar petitions committees. Covid got in the way of that but maybe we can look at that in our next meeting. If I recall correctly, one correspondent stated their exploration of their committee was in its infancy and, given the length of time the Oireachtas has had a petitions committee, there was interest in us sharing our experience. Members like Senators Murphy and Buttimer and Deputy Buckley had time on the previous committee. That is invaluable for other parliaments across the world to learn from best practice.

I commend the work of the clerk and staff here. It is not easy, given the volume of correspondence we have received and that they also have to try to liaise with various Departments and organisations. That is much appreciated by us and by the petitioners.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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I second the Deputy's comments. Given the experience of people like Senator Murphy, we should go when asked. Covid stopped it all and I am sure those kind of requests will come again.

On the Deputy's final remarks on the secretariat, I want to make public what I said at the private meeting yesterday. Some petitioners were giving out that nothing was being done but the amount of work the secretariat does on behalf of the committee is unbelievable. I congratulate members of the secretariat in a public session because-----

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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I endorse what the Chairman said about the secretariat. Sometimes it is a last resort and people have gone through other committees so it is even more difficult for our secretariat to deal with. Everybody gets a fair crack of the whip-----

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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They do.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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-----as far as we can go with petitions.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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I understand some members of the public are frustrated that they are not getting answers they want or things are going slowly. I assure every member of the public who sends in a petition that the secretariat works full pelt, morning, noon and night. It must be frustrating for themselves that correspondence is not coming back from Departments or county councils as quickly as we would all like. I commend Ms Semple and all the secretariat staff on behalf of the committee on the work they do.

Cormac Devlin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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If our petition on no school on Fridays takes off, we will be a very popular committee.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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We will be invited to every school in the country.

Cormac Devlin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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There will be a new cohort engaging with the committee. We will have one day of school in the country left, maybe.

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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The committee is adjourned, if there are no other issues, until Wednesday, 6 July 2022, at 11.30 a.m. for a virtual private meeting, to be followed on Thursday, 7 July 2022 by a public meeting at 1.30 p.m.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
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Will that be our last meeting or have we one following it?

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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This is the last one. We talked yesterday about doing one on 14 July, the day we are to break up, but we decided that, if possible, we will bring in St. Brigid's and Owenacurra on 7 July as well.

Cormac Devlin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)
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This is an extended meeting, is it not?

Martin Browne (Tipperary, Sinn Fein)
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We have a three-hour slot. It has not been ever taken up, but we are saying that. Mr. Paddy Lynn sent in a petition about chefs and making them a special category of work to be put on the critical list. That is the first half of the meeting. We will bring them in before the recess. It was raised that the week of 14 July will be flat out. That is the week we all break up.