Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Thursday, 14 May 2015

Joint Oireachtas Committee on European Union Affairs

General Affairs Council Meeting: Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade

2:00 pm

Photo of Seán KyneSeán Kyne (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Dara Murphy, who will brief the committee on the General Affairs Council and the European Commission's country-specific recommendations for Ireland.

Photo of Dara MurphyDara Murphy (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Vice Chairman. It is a great pleasure to be here this afternoon. I acknowledge the members of the diplomatic corps who are here this afternoon and who always have great engagement in the operations of the committee.

As the Vice Chairman correctly stated, I will brief the committee on the agenda for next week's meeting of the General Affairs Council, GAC. I will also touch on the country-specific recommendations, which were published by the Commission yesterday. Finally, as it is of particular interest to the committee, I will say a few words about the situation in the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia.

First, I will turn to the meeting of the General Affairs Council on 19 May. Ministers will consider two key issues: follow-up to the special European Council meeting of 23 April on migration; and initial preparations for the next meeting of the European Council, which takes place on 25-26 June. In addition, Ministers will receive an update on a report on EMU reform, which is being prepared by the Presidents of the Commission, Euro summit, the ECB and the Eurogroup – the so-called four Presidents – and which is scheduled for presentation to the June European Council.

The first item on the GAC agenda is follow-up to the extraordinary meeting of the European Council in April. As the committee will be aware, that meeting was convened in response to the ongoing humanitarian crisis in the Mediterranean, which has seen so many migrants lose their lives in tragic circumstances. I am aware this committee held a special session on migration the following week, which was attended by the Italian ambassador, the UN Special Representative for Migration and International Development and the chief executive of the Immigrant Council of Ireland and that it is following these events closely. Across the Union also, people have been shocked and horrified by the loss of life as migrants risk everything to reach European shores. The immediate priority for the EU, its member states and third countries must be to better protect those in need and to save innocent lives.

The EU has acted swiftly since the situation began to worsen a month ago. The first step was a special joint session of the Foreign Affairs and Justice and Home Affairs Councils on 20 April, at which Ministers endorsed a ten-point action plan in response to the crisis. This meeting was attended by the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Charles Flanagan, and the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Frances Fitzgerald. Three days later, Heads of State and Government assembled in Brussels for a special meeting of the European Council. At this meeting, a statement was adopted which set out commitments to try to stop human smugglers, strengthen the EU's naval presence in the Mediterranean, prevent illegal migration and reinforce solidarity and responsibility within the Union. Shortly afterwards, the European Parliament adopted a strong resolution of its own, in which MEPs underlined the need for the Union to do more. Clearly, there is real unity of purpose across the Union when it comes to tackling serious problems with respect to migration. The focus now is on ensuring that the commitments set out at the European Council are backed by concrete action. The General Affairs Council will review progress so far and look ahead to the next steps.

One key priority is the ramping-up of search and rescue efforts in the Mediterranean, in accordance with the welcome commitment made by member states to triple the budget for naval operations run by the EU's border agency, Frontex. Another is targeting and dismantling criminal smuggling networks that operate in and around north Africa, and which are directly responsible for so much of the misery and suffering. There is also a pressing need, as highlighted by the European Council, to enhance our co-operation with third states.

The Commission and Latvian EU Presidency are together monitoring implementation of the commitments set out in the European Council statement and will jointly update Ministers at the General Affairs Council meeting. The Commission yesterday also adopted an ambitious European agenda on migration and I expect this will also contribute to a discussion at the General Affairs Council. We will need time to study this document but I am sure it will provide an important input.

Let me briefly draw attention also to two particular national contributions Ireland is making to the humanitarian effort. First, the Government has agreed this week to deploy an Irish naval vessel, the LE Eithne, to the Mediterranean to assist the Italian authorities in humanitarian search and rescue operations. Secondly, we have pledged additional financial assistance of €2 million to support those affected by the crisis in Syria, where a large percentage of refugees and migrants originate. This brings the Government’s humanitarian assistance in response to the Syria crisis to €41 million over the past four years.

There is no easy solution to the hardship and human suffering we are witnessing on Europe’s southern shores. However, with the special meeting of the European Council in April and the issue scheduled for discussion by the European Council again in June, it is clear that migration is now at the top of the Union’s political agenda. I can assure members that Ireland will continue to play an active and determined role in the EU response.

The second issue to be considered by the General Affairs Council will be preparations for the June meeting of the European Council, with a focus on the draft agenda. At first glance, the agenda of the June European Council might seem reasonably compact with just two items - security challenges and economic issues. However, in reality, this disguises what is likely to be one of the fullest European Council agendas for some time.

I turn first to the security challenges. A key priority for Heads of State and Government will be to review implementation of the Common Security and Defence Policy, CSDP. Previous orientations provided by the European Council in December 2013 addressed three key areas: increasing the effectiveness of CSDP; the development and provision of capabilities to support CSDP; and improving the ability of EU industry to provide those capabilities.

Next month’s meeting of the European Council will review progress in implementing the December 2013 conclusions. Good progress has been achieved on many fronts. A maritime security strategy and action plan for its implementation was agreed in 2014, as was an EU cyber defence policy framework. In the context of the European Defence Agency, a policy framework for long-term and systematic co-operation was approved by Ministers. Since December 2013, four new CSDP operations have been launched: one in Ukraine, two in the Central African Republic and one in Mali.

The European Council is also expected to address areas where further progress is required, such as financing of EU missions and operations, development of military capabilities, and the further development of the EU’s partnership policy with multilateral organisations, including the UN, NATO and OSCE. It is also anticipated that High Representative,Federica Mogherini, will seek approval from Heads of State and Government to begin preparing a new European security strategy. The new strategy will assess the impact of the changing nature of the global environment on the EU, as well as threats posed by international terrorism, serious and organised crime, human trafficking and cyber security.

The European Council will return to address the latest developments in Ukraine and, specifically, to consider whether to extend the timeframe for existing economic sanctions against Russia. Some of these sanctions are due to expire in July. At the March European Council, it was agreed that the duration of the current sanctions should be clearly linked to the complete implementation of the Minsk agreements, which is foreseen by 31 December 2015.

Tragic events since the start of the year have also focused the attention of the European Council on threats within the European Union’s own borders. The European Council will review progress on implementation of the EU’s counter-terrorism agenda. This includes a number of different strands, such as tackling the phenomenon of foreign terrorist fighters, countering terrorist content on the Internet, improving international co-operation and information sharing, including through the operation of an EU passenger name record directive, and constructive engagement with third states, notably, Turkey, which is the main gateway for foreign fighters into Syria. As previously referenced, migration will also feature prominently in European Council discussions, with Heads of State and Government reviewing progress and considering further steps.

The agenda item on economic issues provides an equal diversity of topics for the European Council to consider. Very welcome from an Irish perspective will be a focus on the digital single market, with the European Council expected to outline next steps following presentation of the Commission’s strategy on 6 May. The strategy sets out 16 key actions to be delivered by the end of 2016 under three key pillars: simplifying access for consumers and business, creating the right conditions for digital networks and services to flourish, and maximising the growth potential of the digital economy. Ireland supports a high level of ambition for a fully functioning digital single market that is both open and competitive. This would represent a win-win proposition for both consumers and SMEs, who will benefit more than multinationals in these circumstances.

The European Council will also be invited to endorse country-specific recommendations, CSRs,published yesterday,to guide member states in their structural reforms, employment policies and national budgets. I will say a few words about Ireland’s CSRs shortly.

The European Council will return to the question of the transatlantic trade and investment partnership, TTIP, and review progress since its most recent discussion in March. The ninth round of negotiations took place in late April in New York with technical discussions on tariffs and procurement. Discussions on other barriers to trade have been advancing and the basis architecture of the agreement is developing. Both sides have affirmed their commitment to reaching an ambitious agreement as soon as possible, noting that TTIP will create jobs and growth on both sides of the Atlantic.

Also under economic issues, the European Council will consider the report to be presented by the four Presidents on better economic governance in the euro area. Member state perspectives have been shared via official-level representatives of Heads of State and Government – the Sherpa network – and Ministers will take stock of developments at next week’s General Affairs Council. While a limited number of member states would prefer a more ambitious report, pointing, for example, towards common institutions, an EU fiscal capacity or binding reform contracts, Ireland and many other member states have underlined the importance of first fully implementing all existing EU instruments. This includes the existing economic governance framework, including the macroeconomic imbalances procedure and banking union.

Finally on the June European Council, I would flag the possibility of Prime Minister Cameron setting out his thinking on aspects of the UK relationship with the EU, including where he will wish to target reforms. His intentions in this regard may become clearer in the coming weeks.

Overall, Ireland is pleased with the draft agenda for the European Council as currently presented. It addresses many issues of strategic importance for Ireland and for the Union as a whole. Ireland will, as always, contribute actively and constructively to the preparations for the European Council, and I look forward to my own role in this regard, both at next week’s General Affairs Council and again at the June General Affairs Council.

The committee asked for a brief update following the publication yesterday of proposed country-specific recommendations. The Commission is generally proposing fewer, more focused CSRs when compared to last year. Ireland has been given four draft CSRs, covering the areas of public finances, health care reforms, work intensity of households, and sustainable mortgage and SME debt solutions. The committee will note the continuity with issues highlighted by the Commission last year. There were no surprises when the CSRs were published yesterday. As I said, we were given four CSRs instead of seven. Officials from relevant Departments are now giving careful consideration to the four draft CSRs and the underlying analysis with a view to providing a response to the Commission. For the semester process to be effective, it is important that it be based on sound analysis and that there be a real partnership between the member states and the Commission. The draft CSRs will be considered in the coming weeks by relevant Councils before endorsement at the June European Council.

I should add that Commissioner Moscovici will be in Dublin on 26 May and is due to meet the Joint Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, under the chairmanship of Deputy Liam Twomey, to discuss the European Semester issues. Earlier that day, I will be joining the Commissioner at an Institute of International and European Affairs event focused on the Irish CSRs. I am, of course, happy to hear any views the committee might have on the draft CSRs at any stage.

Before concluding, I would like to turn to the situation in the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia. This issue was raised by the committee at our meeting before the March General Affairs Council, and I have since written to the Chairman on the subject. I can confirm that the April General Affairs Council adopted conclusions expressing grave concern regarding the deteriorating situation in the country, particularly in the area of rule of law, fundamental rights and freedom of the media. The Council also urged all sides to constructively engage to restart political dialogue and restore trust in the institutions. I was deeply disturbed by developments in the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia last weekend, which saw heavily armed militants clash with the police and army and, sadly, more than 22 people killed. The events took place in Kumanovo, which is near the border with Kosovo and Serbia. Commissioner Hahn made a statement in the immediate aftermath of the events, calling on “the authorities and all political and community leaders to cooperate, to restore calm and fully investigate the events in an objective and transparent manner”. I fully support that call. I can also assure the committee that the EU will continue to encourage all efforts to bring about stability in the region.

We have a busy few weeks ahead in the run-up to what is likely to be a pivotal meeting of the European Council in June. I look forward to bringing the committee up to date on the preparations and on Irish Government perspectives when we meet again next month. I thank the Chairman and members of the committee for their time.

Photo of Seán KyneSeán Kyne (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State for a very comprehensive report. He can be assured that the joint committee fully supports his call on the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia. We do not want to see turmoil there.

I acknowledge his comments with regard to the possibility that the British Prime Minister, David Cameron, will set out his thinking on the EU-UK relationship. As he knows, we have deliberated on the implications of a possible UK withdrawal from the EU, and our report will be published shortly. A delegation from the committee will travel to Germany to discuss the possible implications for the EU of a UK withdrawal.

Deputy Durkan has had to go to an emergency meeting of the Houses of the Oireachtas Commission, but he hopes to be back. A number of members are absent because a delegation from the committee are travelling to Warsaw. However, we have two esteemed members.

Photo of Joe O'ReillyJoe O'Reilly (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the Minister of State and his officials. I thought it was apt that the Minister of State welcomed the members of the diplomatic corps.

Initially, I wish to address the humanitarian issue, but I will then deal with economic matters that have implications not only for Ireland but also for the constituency of Cavan-Monaghan, which I have the privilege of representing. Migration is the major humanitarian crisis. People who lost their homes have paid their life savings into the hands of people who, having no care for their welfare, have herded them onto ships and put them in real danger. There has been significant loss of life. It is good that the EU has worked on this and set out a programme to deal with the gangsters and police the area. Obviously, it is policy to share the burden among European states. It is a very complex and difficult matter. I am happy that we are providing the naval vessel LE Eithneto help with policing as well as an additional €2 million in funding. We must play our part. All EU countries will have to play their part, which will demand a high level of co-ordination. Each country will be required by agreement to make an input in a structured way, instead ofad hoc charity, and to take a share of the migrants. It cannot be left to Italy or Spain to deal with the problem. Will the Minister of State inform the committee of how it is proposed to co-ordinate the efforts of individual countries so that each country will carry a burden proportionate to its size, population and resources? No country has a greater sensitivity to this crisis than Ireland. Any Irish person with a sense of history could only have a real empathy for these people.

I was happy to hear a reference to the forthcoming discussion on the digital economy. This is an area of tremendous growth in Ireland both in terms of inward investment and domestic developments. It offers great career potential and economic and social opportunities for our people. The great weakness in our infrastructure is the lack of a universal high-speed broadband service.

There is patchiness and in areas with dispersed populations there are difficulties in this regard. I am aware of the national broadband plan and its objectives are welcome because it is of critical importance that every home in every area of the country has high speed broadband. It is the modern equivalent of rural electrification. Is there anything further the Minister of State thinks can be done at European level to assist and even speed up our domestic efforts in this area as people are fed up with the delays? How does he assess the opportunity to provide for further investment? Large areas of my constituency of Cavan-Monaghan, especially the smaller villages and dispersed rural populations, do not have access to quality broadband and, in many cases, to any broadband service at all. That needs correction as it is an injustice. A divide is developing in the country and, while I know it is because of topography and the lack of commercial viability, intervention is needed. I know that an intervention is planned, but this issue is very urgent. It is a real issue in Cavan-Monaghan.

Another issue in our area is the weakness of the euro relative to sterling, which presents a tremendous opportunity to secure Internet sales and engage in marketing in the sterling area, including Northern Ireland. There is a tremendous business opportunity in the Border region, specifically Cavan-Monaghan which I represent. To take advantage of it, traders need to have confidence and an awareness of the potential, but they also need broadband to support it. Will the Minister of State comment on this opportunity for people in my area and suggest what we can do to assist?

The next issue the Minister of State addressed, which is relevant to my constituency and the country, was the TTIP negotiations. Will he look into his crystal ball and say how he sees it panning out in the coming weeks, months and years? Will he publicly assure me and the people I represent that Ireland will bat for the domestic agriculture industry in the context of the TTIP? Cavan-Monaghan is unique in having a huge dependence on primary production, with farmers, agribusiness and food processing. Agrifood related jobs account for the vast bulk of all jobs in the area; therefore, anything that threatens agriculture will devastate the economy of the region.

The Chairman spoke about the possible exit of the United Kingdom from the European Union. Personally I do not believe it will happen but that rationality will prevail and people's business and economic sense will tell them the importance of inward investment and the potential of the markets within the European Union. The debate the United Kingdom will hold on the subject will change minds in favour of jobs and livelihoods and I believe sanity will prevail. Nevertheless, we have to address the risks involved. My concern is from a national perspective, but the implications of a British withdrawal would be aggravated in Cavan-Monaghan and right along the Border because of the prospect of customs control, the need for passports and the impact on businesses. Will the Minister of State give us an assurance that Ireland will maintain a strong watching brief and that we will engage in bilateral initiatives with the Commission and the UK Government to protect Irish interests? We need to try to prevent the breakaway, but in the event that we fail to do so, we need to have a contingency plan to protect Irish interests, which means the Irish economy and especially the economy of the Border region. It would be remiss of a representative of a Border constituency to attend this meeting and not to emphasise the devastating impact if people such as the Minister of State did not make the necessary interventions to prevent the worst effects of a British withdrawal from the European Union.

Photo of Terry LeydenTerry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the Minister of State and his officials and wish him well in his deliberations in Brussels. I also welcome members of the diplomatic corps and their representatives. It is an opportunity for all of us, as members of the European Union, to exchange thoughts. It is a pity that they cannot participate in the meeting, but we will meet at their various receptions and I appreciate their regular invitations to meet their ambassador and officials.

Deputy Joe O'Reilly is the leader of the Irish delegation to the Council of Europe. He does significant work and has been very involved in dealing with the tragedy of what is happening in the Middle East. It was precipitated by the actions of the Bush-Blair amalgamation in Iraq and elsewhere, for which a price is now being paid.

RMSLusitaniawent down 100 years ago with 1,190 people on board, while Titanicwent down more than 100 years ago. Both were human tragedies which it is right to remember, but some weeks ago 1,500 people went down off the coast of Italy and I do not read much about that tragedy in any newspaper now. That shows the level of concern and the lack of acceptance of responsibility in the West, a point Mr. Peter Sutherland made very well when he spoke at a recent meeting of the joint committee. No country suffered more than Ireland, with its 1 million emigrants, in the coffin ships which got into trouble off the coasts of Canada, America and Britain, all of whom helped us at the time. It was right that Britain helped us because it had responsibility for the Irish Famine, but we will not go into that issue today as we have to try to forgive and forget. We might forgive, but we will not forget.

On the negotiations with the United States of America, will the Minister of State outline the implications for the TTIP negotiations of the Senate voting against the trade Bill on Tuesday last? I am not sure exactly how serious it is because the Bill has not been completed. A deal with the United States of America should not be pursued at any cost and there should be no cost to the Irish economy, especially in the case of the agriculture sector. We cannot allow hormone-fed beef into the Republic of Ireland at any cost to compete with our grass-fed, high-quality and often organic beef which we are exporting to the United States of America. That has to be the bottom line for this country and we must veto any agreement which would affect our fundamental and basic industry. During the difficulties faced by the building industry the economy was sustained by farming and agriculture. That is a fact.

On the possible departure of Britain from the European Union, people should read Mr. Dan O'Brien's article in today's edition of the Irish Independent.

He made interesting points in his article when he stated:

The only upside to a British departure is that Ireland will become a relatively more attractive place for businesses seeking guarantees and unfettered access to the EU single market, still the biggest market in the world. That is because there is a very considerable uncertainty over the kind of economic relationship Britain would have with the EU as a non-member. Many members already ask why they should give one country all the benefits of membership (ie full access to the single market) without having the costs of playing by the rules.

I agree with Deputy O'Reilly on the chances of Britain leaving the Union but in our negotiations as one of the 27 members it cannot be that Britain will not stay in the Union at any price. If it is Britain's wish to leave the Union it must not be at any price to this country as far as the negotiations are concerned. Members of this committee have been over to the UK. With 56 Scottish MPs having been elected, if Britain decides to defect from the Union, Scotland will follow with independence. As sure as night follows day, there is no doubt about that. We may find the repercussions of what Britain does will result not long after that in the break-up of the United Kingdom for once and for all with perhaps our having a United Ireland because the Six Counties would be unviable in that situation. All I know from my experience of working with those in Britain is that all we can do is congratulate the Prime Minister on his reappointment as Prime Minister. Fair play to him. It was a democratic election and he won fair and square. UKIP is out of the picture. He had to put certain ideas forward to win back votes and he was successful. He will honour his commitment to have a referendum. I think he will recommend that Britain stays in the Union.

While Britain has a friend in Ireland and we want it to stay in the Union, the Minister of State in his discussions and negotiations with the British Government must point out that it cannot be at any price or at a cost to the Republic of Ireland. If Britain departs from the Union, we will have to play hardball with regard to the EU in terms of any repercussions that would have for this country. We will be entering those negotiations not as a harmless or fearful player but as a determined one. We will support and help Britain but, as a former Minister of State with responsibility for trade, I emphasise that we cannot do it at any cost to this country.

Photo of Seán KyneSeán Kyne (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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I have a few questions for the Minister of State. On the country-specific recommendations, I welcome the fact that they have been reduced from seven to four. Will he agree that the specific recommendations are areas on which the Government is already working? As he said, there are no great surprises in this respect as these are issues on which the Government has been focusing. What opportunities does the Minister of State envisage there will be for Ireland if a digital single market is created?

I appreciate that the migration issue was discussed previously and that it will be discussed again at an EU Council meeting. What is the Minister of State's view of the quota proposal? I am sure he would have seen the letter from the committee to An Taoiseach a few weeks ago following our meeting with various guests, including the Italian ambassador, who gave an update on the situation, including in his home country.

On the UK situation, is there a firm indication that the Prime Minister will lay out his stall on the occasion of the next European Council meeting? From talking to his counterparts across Europe, what is his view on what could possibly be agreed to in treaty negotiations in terms of changes with respect to some of the opt-out provisions from clauses about which the UK has concerns?

Photo of Dara MurphyDara Murphy (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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Detailed questions covering a number of areas have been raised. I will start by responding to the measures taken to deal with the migration and the humanitarian crisis. We would all acknowledge the loss of life in this crisis and Senator Leyden contrasted such loss to the centenary commemoration of the loss of life on the Lusitaniain Cork last week, and we had the recent centenary commemorations of the loss of life on the Titanic. A clear comparison can be made between those events. Given the different circumstances of those two tragic events so long ago, the reality with respect to the events in the Mediterranean is that the European Union has a very important role to play to work towards reducing, to the absolute minimum, the number of people who will find themselves in circumstances where their lives are at great peril or ultimately lost. Several factors feed into that. At the most basic, there is a requirement to assist states that have arrived at a point, through conflict, bad governance or a broad range of issues, some economic and some religious, that have allowed people be of the view that while there is a risk to their lives in migrating, there is a greater risk to their lives in not migrating. This involves not only the European Union but countries of the developed world and the developing world working together. We have had meetings recently of the joint Council, involving justice and home affairs and foreign affairs Ministers, which was followed up by discussions at the General Affairs Council the following day, which I attended, and at the European Council meeting two days later.

This item is at the top of Europe's agenda. Deputy O'Reilly requested that there would be a co-ordinated approach to dealing with this issue, and this is happening. An Irish naval vessel will be deployed hopefully on Saturday. We have contributed significant moneys and, as the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Fitzgerald, said last evening, we will be taking in an additional 300 refugees. There are different elements to and objectives within the proposal that has been made with respect to the next few months but members can be assured that Ireland, and the other member states, will continue to work to achieve some respite to the crisis. As I said, a ten-point plan was agreed on 20 April and it will be discussed again in great detail next week.

I am taking the points raised in order and am moving from the serious humanitarian crisis just discussed to the question the Vice Chairman raised about the digital single market and the potential opportunities it will present for Ireland. As he will be aware, significant moneys are being committed under the national broadband strategy. The digital single market has three key areas. To answer the Vice Chairman's question directly, the reason we can benefit from this single market is that we have 29 of the top 30 digital companies based in Ireland. I wear another hat as the Minister of State with responsibility for data protection. If one goes through a list of these companies, one will find they are nearly all large American companies. That reminds us that in the broader digital economy, Europe has not managed to produce or to be significantly innovative. The development of the digital single market along with the services single market presents an opportunity for Europe to regain the competitive advantage it has lost and continues to lose. The digital single market strategy targets include simplifying access for consumers and businesses such as through harmonised consumer and contract rules, more efficient and affordable parcel delivery, tackling geo-blocking of digital services, further copyright modernisations and simplifying VAT rules. Another target of the strategy is shaping the environment for digital networks and services to flourish such as reviewing telecoms and media rules to encourage investment in next generation infrastructure, management of the wireless spectrum and reviewing the role of online platforms such as illegal content and a review of e-privacy issues and, finally, maximising the growth of potential of the digital economy.

That includes having the right regulatory standards for big data and cloud computing and ensuring interoperability of e-services for the consumer, including through e-government and e-health services and also strengthening digital skills. There is huge potential for every European country but Ireland perhaps is better placed than most in that regard.

I will briefly come to another area, namely, the transatlantic trade and investment partnership, TTIP. The vote on Tuesday night should send the positive result we in Ireland would like to see, and I believe they will be voting again today. President Obama has personally engaged with this issue. When the Taoiseach visited Washington on St. Patrick's Day it was at the top of the agenda and they discussed the issue in great detail. We are absolutely resolute with respect to the protection of our agricultural industry.

Photo of Dara MurphyDara Murphy (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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There will be significant benefits for the broader agricultural industry through TTIP. We must all take every opportunity to point out when we talk about the dangers of lower standards being associated with TTIP that in no way is it going to be or allowed to be a vehicle for lower standards to be introduced in either direction. In fact, TTIP gives the opportunity for the European Union and the United States of America, collectively, to set the bar and establish worldwide standards across food and other sectors. This opportunity must be grasped. In the beef sector we do have concerns and they are being addressed at the very highest level. On the broader issue, TTIP is potentially of more benefit to Ireland than many other countries but all countries can benefit. Given the GDP growth of somewhere between 1% and 2% for both jurisdictions, and given how hard we have struggled over the past five years plus to have any growth in GDP in the European Union, we should look very carefully at the potential of TTIP, in particular bearing in mind that the European Single Market itself was such a benefit.

Photo of Terry LeydenTerry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I have a quick question in that regard. If Britain decides to opt out of the European Union, this deal dies as far as Britain is concerned. It would have to negotiate a separate deal with the United States of America. If it is out of the 28 then it would not benefit from the TTIP negotiations that are currently ongoing. That is an interesting point.

Photo of Dara MurphyDara Murphy (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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It is. I have not forgotten that all members asked about the United Kingdom. I might come to that next. Up to last week we had two questions. First, who would govern in the United Kingdom and how the election would evolve. We now know that. I congratulate David Cameron on the achievement of his re-election as Prime Minister. We were all interested in watching events evolve, but that was a matter for the people of the UK. The second question is what is the position of the United Kingdom. Members asked specifically about our engagement. The Taoiseach will have a bilateral meeting in the coming weeks with David Cameron. I do not have the exact date. I compliment the committee on the work it has already done in meeting with a broad variety of groups in the United Kingdom. We had a discussion on the matter raised by Senator Leyden. We also had a very interesting debate in Seanad Éireann in recent weeks.

Photo of Dara MurphyDara Murphy (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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When the committee goes to Germany it will become particularly aware that the view of Ireland in this discussion is much sought and much respected. What we are aware of is that in some initial commentary that has come from the United Kingdom, we share their concerns on many areas. In terms of ease of business, regulation and growth, in the past 12 months we have seen significant progress, in particular through quantitative easing, the Juncker package of €320 billion, and especially the commentary from First Vice President, Frans Timmermans, on the need for Europe to have regulations that work for citizens and businesses alike. We will be very engaged.

Members will be aware that the Department of the Taoiseach and other Departments, including the Department of Finance, are looking at the potential effects of various outcomes that may emerge from this process from the point of view of the United Kingdom. We are very clear that we want the European Union to stay united as 28 member states, which obviously includes the UK. It will however be a matter for the people of the United Kingdom to decide themselves in the referendum which will now take place at some time in the future. Ireland will of course ensure in any steps that are taken that our national interest will be to the forefront of our deliberations, as it always is in all respects and negotiations. We are still very much waiting to see what the proposals are. The matter raised in the specific question on the June European Council is not on the agenda but I am aware that David Cameron will have a number of bilateral meetings with the Presidents of the Commission and the Council, and other Prime Ministers, including the Taoiseach in the coming months. We look forward to seeing what-----

Photo of Terry LeydenTerry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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There will be interesting times ahead.

Photo of Dara MurphyDara Murphy (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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Yes, there will be interesting times ahead. I am certain that the UK and its relationship with Europe will be mentioned again at this committee in the future. We will wait and see what happens.

It is very important for Ireland that the Government continues to focus on this country and what we can achieve for ourselves within the European Union in terms of continuing to create jobs and employment. To an extent, currently, this issue is a matter on which we are bystanders but at every opportunity I will make the point to my colleagues in the United Kingdom that countries in Europe, collectively, including the UK have done very well as members of the European Union. We have had a very safe and secure Continent, when one considers what went on in previous generations. There are many areas where we can champion what at times is an imperfect European Union but the benefits vastly outweigh the so-called disadvantages some may perceive.

Photo of Seán KyneSeán Kyne (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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Could the Minister of State refer to the country-specific recommendations, CSRs?

Photo of Dara MurphyDara Murphy (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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In terms of the country-specific recommendations, we welcome the fact that there was a reduction in them. We also welcome the fact that the Commission seems to have had a far more concise approach generally to the recommendations. Your analysis, Vice Chairman, is accurate. We did not foresee any surprises. There are no surprises in our recommendations and they relate to the four areas of which we are already fully aware. The fact sometimes gets lost in some of the narrative about the country-specific recommendations and their purpose, that they sometimes restate what a Government already knows. It is not designed to be unhelpful, it is a simple statement of fact. We have had a very difficult number of years economically and therefore in the area of health care, in particular in jobless households, we are aware that while we have reduced unemployment from 15.1% to below 10% currently, there are too many households where we need to assist people. We must continue to foster an environment where jobs can be created.

The broad thrust of the CSRs, in Ireland's case, reflects the fact that this economy is being well run and is performing well. It is certainly my intention, as a Minister of State, to ensure we continue to do that. We will be working towards addressing all the country-specific recommendations which, ultimately, are to the benefit of our citizens.

Photo of Seán KyneSeán Kyne (Galway West, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State. It is reassuring to know that all countries will be working to ensure that the issues of migration and the tragedies that have occurred in recent months are to the fore at EU Council level. We welcome the reassurance in respect of Senator Terry Leyden's question on agriculture, which is hugely important to this country, and that it must be to the fore in terms of TTIP. I expect this issue of whether the UK will exit the European Union will be debated for a number of years. That issue will be to the fore of this committee's concerns and deliberations, and rightly so.

The joint committee adjourned at 3.10 p.m. until 2 p.m. on Thursday, 28 May 2015.