Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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I weclome the Minister of State, Deputy Healy-Rae, to the House. He is most welcome.

Margaret Murphy O'Mahony (Fianna Fail)
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Cuirim fáilte ar ais roimh gach duine. Go mbeirimid beo ar an am seo arís. I thank the Cathaoirleach for choosing this Commencement matter and I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Healy-Rae, for taking time out of his very busy schedule to come to us here in the Upper House today. I had requested last week that the Minister, Deputy Heydon, attend today to give us an update on the discussions about the rate of nitrates derogation in Ireland. To be fair, his office contacted me to say he is not available and I thank the Minister of State for taking up the baton. I will be asking the Minister of State for an update on the discussions and what he thinks is going to happen.

It is not that long since the then Minister for agriculture encouraged farmers to expand. Because of this, many farmers and processors went into large debt and now many farmers could be faced with the prospect of herd reduction or acquiring more land. Yet many of these farmers are already in debt. The discussions on the derogation rates are reaching a crucial stage. It is essential for our agricultural industry that the present rate is maintained. Otherwise, the consequences for individual farmers and the whole farming industry will be catastrophic.It is very unfair that farmers are getting such blame for the condition of our waterways when it is obvious that there are many other bodies contributing to these problems. I suggest that these bodies be asked to get their houses in order before our farmers are asked to take such drastic steps.

Denmark is often used as an example of how farming should be done. Not a week goes by in which the media do not say Denmark is doing this or Denmark is doing that. However, it must be noted that Denmark has now reapplied for a derogation. That shows how important it is.

Our water quality is on the up but it is a very slow process. We need to give it time. Despite having the greatest number of derogation farmers, the area I am from in west Cork is showing an increase in water quality, but this all takes time. At a time when generation renewal is being encouraged, it is very unlikely that any of our talented young men and women are going to come home to take over a farm if the first thing they will be told is that they have to reduce their herd or acquire more land. It is also very unfair for Ireland to be compared with other European countries. We have an outdoor system that is unique in Europe so we cannot be compared with other countries. It is like comparing apples with oranges.

Reducing the derogation rate will also have a detrimental effect on tillage farmers. It will have a domino effect. We must remember that tillage farmers are already on their knees. They are getting the same prices they got 40 years ago. It is incredible that could happen. I am not talking about four years ago but 40. If dairy farmers are going to try to acquire more land, it will put pressure on tillage farmers, many of whom will be unable to compete. Farmers are finding it very hard to manage the bureaucracy involved in calculating phosphorous levels in animal feed. Even the farm advisers are finding this very difficult to manage. One solution would be to allow dairy farmers to export their slurry but there needs to be a financial incentive for tillage farmers to take part in this. This would also reduce the use of chemical fertilisers.

Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry, Independent)
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I thank the Senator for raising this very important matter. On behalf of the Minister, Deputy Heydon, I thank her for allowing us to discuss the importance of the nitrates derogation. As the Senator has correctly said, the Minister is in Brussels today to meet with Commissioner Roswall, who has responsibility for the environment, on this very matter, so the Senator's timing is brilliant.

Securing an extension of Ireland's derogation remains a key Government priority. Irish agriculture is different from farming on the Continent. Our outdoor system of livestock farming, coupled with the high yielding crop of grass, high rainfall and a long growing season, is central to our justification for the derogation we so desperately need. Maintaining the derogation is critical not only for the economic sustainability of farm enterprises currently availing of it but also for the broader rural economy.

Ultimately, the rules on nitrates are about protecting water quality. Led by Government, there is unprecedented engagement across the entire agrifood sector to protect our water quality. This work will continue as farmers, the agrifood processing industry and the Government share a common objective and commitment. In addition, we will have to demonstrate that we are doing what is necessary to protect valuable habitats under the habitats directive.

In many cases, the Government is providing financial and other supports for farmers going beyond regulatory requirements to improve water quality. For example, the Farming for Water European Innovation Partnership, which has a budget of €60 million and which commenced last year, provides financial support for specific targeted actions. To date, more than 4,200 farmers have applied for this support. Our aim is to support 15,000 farmers by 2029, which is very significant. The Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine is also providing TAMS grant support for capital investments in low-emissions slurry spreading equipment and manure storage.Since 2015, a total of more than €138 million has been paid to support significant investments in family farms in manure storage and low-emissions slurry spreading technology. Almost 54,000 farmers are participating in the agri-climate rural environmental scheme, ACRES, which includes water protection quality and using the principle of the right measure in the right place. The Minister of State, Deputy John Cummins has also made significant progress towards the introduction of a targeted exemption threshold for stand-alone manure storage under the exempted development regulations. This will be in place in the coming weeks. This is also very significant.

There have been a number of significant developments in securing an extension of Ireland’s derogation and it is important to update the Seanad accordingly. First, a Cabinet committee on water quality chaired by an Taoiseach was established in March to co-ordinate efforts to secure the derogation. The Taoiseach raised the importance of our derogation with the EU Commission President Ursula von der Leyen. The Minister, Deputy Heydon has also discussed the matter with Commissioner Roswall and is meeting with the Commissioner today in Brussels to advance the case for renewal, as I already stated. The Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine is in ongoing contact with its commission and member state counterparts in Brussels, most recently making the case for the renewal at the EU nitrates committee on Friday last. On Monday, 15 September, the Minister welcomed the delegation of senior commission officials to Ireland to discuss the renewal and that team visited a dairy farm to see the work under way to protect water quality.

The programme for Government states that the Government will do everything in its power to make the case at EU level to secure retention of the derogation. The Government continues to work intensively on this. Although this will be a challenging process, the Government remains fully committed to working with farmers and the broader industry to develop the best case possible for the renewal of the derogation from 1 January, 2026. It is critically important that we all get behind the twin objectives of improving water quality and securing Ireland’s next derogation.

Margaret Murphy O'Mahony (Fianna Fail)
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It is great timing that the Minister is in Brussels. Perhaps at some stage I might take credit that when I brought it up in the Seanad he took off to Brussels.

Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry, Independent)
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It would not happen only for the Senator.

Margaret Murphy O'Mahony (Fianna Fail)
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It would not be my first time. No better woman to claim that.

Pat Casey (Fianna Fail)
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It is on the record.

Joe O'Reilly (Fine Gael)
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We all support that.

Margaret Murphy O'Mahony (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister of State and the other Ministers for their commitment to the retention of the derogation rate. I pointed out, and I know he is very aware, how important this is to the Irish farmer. It is important not only to the dairy farmer; it has a huge domino effect across all farming sectors and therefore to the local economy. I ask the Minister of State to continue to do his best and acknowledge the work he and others have done.

Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry, Independent)
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This morning I met with IFA leadership who have young farmers and people who are interested in agriculture for a multitude of reasons. They were in Agriculture House. They realise, as we all do, the importance of what is happening in Europe today. We discussed all of these issues. I have nothing but the utmost confidence in the reliability and wherewithal of the Minister to lead us on this matter. The Taoiseach, Tánaiste and everybody from there down across all parties realise the importance of what this will mean in the future. The Senator said it in jest but it is very important that this House and every one of its Member is seen to be uniting behind this effort. We are on the head of a pin. We must focus our efforts on getting this derogation. It will mean so much in the future. Do we have a good case? I believe in the quality of our way of farming and the way we carry on our farming practices. I am passionate about that. In the past every one of us had practices we would not be proud of today, for example, our methods of storing and spreading slurry and of outwintering cattle. Every one of us did it. We were up to that height in gutter. Where was the water and seepage going?That is the way we were but look at the way we are now. Now farmers can go out at night, turn on a light and feed their cattle in a pair of shoes like the ones I am wearing. We have come on an awful lot in comparison with the way we were, especially the few of us who might have grey hair or no hair. We remember what it was like.

We are all trying to achieve the same thing. I thank the Senator for what I would call a timely debate on this matter. I sincerely thank her and her colleagues in the Seanad for rightfully having a debate on this matter.