Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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Before I call Senator Sherlock, I welcome the students who are with us in the Public Gallery. They are very welcome to Leinster House and I hope they have a very good visit. I am not quite sure what school they are from but we will get the name in a minute. It is great to see them here. This is the Seanad, the Upper House. Senator Sherlock is now going to raise a matter with the Minister of State, Deputy Ossian Smyth, regarding houses and home energy improvement grants, which are very important, as the students will know.

Marie Sherlock (Labour)
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I thank the Minister of State very much for coming to the Chamber today. I also offer a big welcome to all those present in the Gallery. There are three serious concerns with regard to the criteria for the Sustainable Energy Authority of Ireland, SEAI, grant system for retrofitting and how they apply to thousands of older homes in Dublin and across the country. Houses constructed before 1940 are effectively excluded from a large part of the SEAI energy upgrade scheme. Well over 15,000 homes within Dublin city were constructed before 1940. That is a lot of houses and a lot of families and individuals.

With regard to the scheme targeted at low-income households and social welfare recipients, the better energy warmer homes scheme, and access to the one-stop shop, support is only granted if the property is upgraded to the B2 standard. Not only does that involve great upheaval and work to the house, but it is also nearly impossible to get to that standard in some cases because of the age and construction type of the house.

The third key concern or issue is the cost of retrofitting. The Minister of State and I have engaged on this matter previously. The cost is simply prohibitive for many households, particularly those that are struggling to pay their bills at the moment, let alone putting together savings to retrofit their house, thereby ultimately saving themselves money on their energy bills into the future.It is those households, in particular, that I am thinking of with regard to the issues and design flaws, as I see it, in the SEAI grant systems. In the Dublin 7 area alone, about 22% of all houses have building energy ratings, BERs of F or G. There is a cost difference in terms of fuelling such a home relative to a B2 energy rated home of almost €3,000 in a calendar year. That is before we saw prices take off over the past 12 months.

The Government has an enormous target of 500,000 houses to be retrofitted by 2030. There is demand in the areas I am located in from people who want, and urgently need, to retrofit their homes because of the bills they are paying, as well as a huge appetite from communities to engage in community energy-saving and district heating schemes, but we need to get the design of the schemes right.

With regard to the homes constructed before 1940, if they are stone, single-leaf masonry or composite wall construction, in other words, not a cavity construction, they do not qualify for wall insulation schemes. If people do not qualify for wall inflation and happen to have had their attic insulated a number of years ago, they do not qualify for the secondary benefits such as draught proofing, lagging jackets, heating upgrades, windows and doors. I have come across situations on a regular basis whereby people who had their attics done a number of years ago need basic and simple other work done to their houses, yet cannot access schemes because of the age of their houses.

It makes no sense to me that there is a blanket refusal, as I see it, with regard to pre-1940 houses because wall insulation is the only way in to get all of the other work done. While I appreciate that great care needs to be taken and there are different construction needs for stone constructed houses relative to those of a modern construction standard, I do not believe it is impossible to ensure there is wall insulation in these houses. From what I understand from architects, the use of lime pointing is necessary in order to maintain the vapour permeability of such buildings. Why can we not incentivise and maintain this skill, given that there are thousands of such home Dublin?

If we are serious about maintaining and protecting our existing housing stock and not having to raze these houses in a few decades' time and incur the huge carbon cost of building new houses, then we have to protect our existing housing stock in Dublin, in particular because such a large share of the stock was built prior to the 1940s. The SEAI grants need to be designed for those houses.

Acting Chairperson:

Before we bring in the Minister of State, I want to welcome Kells national school from County Meath. You are all very welcome to the Seanad.

Ossian Smyth (Dún Laoghaire, Green Party)
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I thank Senators. The students from Kells, County Meath, are very welcome.

I thank Senator Sherlock for raising this important issue and for the timely opportunity to give an update on the Government’s supports for home retrofit. In order to hit our climate targets, we will need to retrofit the equivalent of 500,000 homes to a BER B2 cost optimal or carbon equivalent and install 400,000 heat pumps in existing homes to replace older and less efficient heating systems by the end of 2030.

Older homes, that is, generally, those built up until around the 1940s, usually fall into the category of traditionally built buildings. Traditionally built homes and buildings are considerably more complex to retrofit. The term "traditional buildings" generally refers to those buildings built with solid walls, often with a lime or earthen-based render finish. This was the dominant form of building construction in Ireland until the second quarter of the 20th century and includes stone-built dwellings.

The primary difference between traditional and modern construction is in the way that moisture is managed. Traditional materials and construction techniques allow for the natural transfer of heat and moisture. Solid masonry walls, therefore, relied on their thickness to cope with atmospheric moisture, being sufficiently thick to ensure that drying out took place before external moisture reached the inside of the building. This means that standard retrofit solutions are often not suitable for use with traditional buildings as they can lead to adverse and unintended consequences for the building fabric and the health or well-being of its occupants.

Energy efficiency upgrade solutions appropriate to such materials and methods are needed in these cases. For example, a stone or brick wall with lime-based mortar will need a lime-based plaster render to remain vapour permeable. A significant proportion of homes and buildings that will need to be retrofitted fall into this category of traditionally built. The SEAI advises that it does not exclude pre-1940 homes from applying for any of its grant-supported schemes. However, all of its approaches are determined by the building regulations, incorporating the National Standards Authority of Ireland, NSAI's, SR 54: 2014 Code of practice for the energy efficient retrofit of dwellings. This means that wall insulation is not recommended under any of its residential energy efficiency schemes on dwellings built before 1940 that are constructed in stone, single-leaf masonry or composite wall construction. That said, the SEAI will assess applicant homes under the various residential energy efficiency schemes for other measures outside wall insulation that may be possible.

While these homes can be eligible for SEAI support, subject to the scheme eligibility criteria and terms and conditions being met, uncertainty about what retrofit treatments are allowable or appropriate has contributed to a limited amount of whole-house energy efficiency upgrades on these buildings. For example, a home could get the attic insulated but not the walls if the SEAI's terms and conditions cannot be met.

The Government fully agrees that it is essential that we have both the standards and supports in place for the retrofitting of all types of housing to ensure that the principles of universality and fairness underpinning the retrofit plan are met. As set out in the plan, a new guidance document that is focused on energy efficiency in traditional buildings is being developed to support the proper upgrading of such buildings. This guidance document draws on expert multidisciplinary advice and expertise and will also reference case studies. The Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage is leading on this project, which also includes experts from my Department and the SEAI. This guidance should help to enable many traditional buildings to be upgraded to a building energy rating, BER, of B2 or above in a way that is appropriate to the building. It is hoped that the guidance can be completed by September. Once available, it will be an important resource to support contractors in the appropriate energy efficiency upgrade and renovation of older stone buildings while ensuring compliance with the appropriate building regulations, including under SEAI grant-funded schemes.

Marie Sherlock (Labour)
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I thank the Minister of State for that detailed response. I welcome that there will be new guidance this September. A question arises about what will be offered through the one-stop shop – currently, it is only to a B2 standard – and the retrofitting community is wondering whether it is possible to bring some of the older houses to B2 or whether a lower standard would be acceptable.

Another issue stands out, which I hope will be resolved in September’s document. The Minister of State made two comments, the first of which was that energy-efficient upgrade solutions were needed for, for example, stone or brick walls with lime-based mortar. He also stated that the SEAI would not recommend wall insulation in pre-1940 dwellings under any of its residential energy efficiency schemes. We must square this circle and ensure that we have a separate scheme for such houses. If we are serious about them surviving – they can survive, as they are of fantastic construction quality – for the next 100 years, we need to be able to get not only the financial supports right, but also the eligibility requirements to qualify for them.

Ossian Smyth (Dún Laoghaire, Green Party)
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The Senator is correct to raise this matter. How will we upgrade stone or thatched cottages, particularly when lived in by people who are in energy poverty, cannot afford to move home and need the upgrades more than anyone else?

She mentioned how difficult it was to reach the B2 standard, but it is possible to get grants that do not require people to do so. For example, it is possible to get a grant for attic insulation or solar panels. The grant for attic insulation is at 80%. There are a range of reasons to go for solar panels, including zero VAT, not requiring planning permission, being able to sell power back to the grid, etc. There is a €2,400 grant for solar panels. A number of interventions can be taken beforehand.

We will have guidance in September to clarify how traditional homes will be upgraded. I understand the question the Senator raises about how someone who needs to apply lime plaster to a building will manage the external wall insulation. We need technical guidance on that before we can proceed.

There are steps that people can still take in the meantime, for example, an 80% grant. Retrofitting is not exclusively for people with large quantities of money.