Maria Byrne (Fine Gael)
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Before I call on Senator Blaney to move the motion, I am sure Members of the House will wish to join me in welcoming some family members of the disappeared and the Wave Trauma Centre to the House today. I welcome Gerry McGinley, Michael McConville, Oliver McVeigh, Ann Morgan and Sandra Peake. They are very welcome to the House for this all-important motion.

I would also like to welcome the Minister for Justice, Deputy Harris, who is here to take the motion. I call Senator Blaney to move the motion.

Niall Blaney (Fianna Fail)
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I move:

“That Seanad Éireann:

recognising that: - there were nineteen people who ‘disappeared’ as a result of paramilitary organisations during the Troubles/Conflict;

- of these nineteen, to date fourteen of the victims have been recovered, with five still missing;

- Lisa Dorrian who disappeared in 2005 and Gareth O’Connor who disappeared in 2003 are included in this nineteen;

- their cases were not included in the remit and legislation for the Independent Commission for the Location of Victims’ Remains (ICLVR) which can only work on the cases of those who disappeared up to the Good Friday Agreement in 1998; acknowledging that: - abducted, murdered and secretly buried, their families have struggled with the pain and trauma of bereavement in addition to the agony of not knowing where their loved ones are buried and why and how they were taken;

- in addition, the community has often been silent concerning these cases, with an underlying fear of the consequences of speaking out; and further acknowledging that: - since its inception in 1999 no one has ever been interviewed as a suspect, arrested, charged or convicted as a result of information that was passed to the ICLVR and that such information can only be used to recover and repatriate victims; calls for: - anyone who has information about the Disappeared, however small, to inform the ICLVR families.”

I thank the Minister for joining us and I thank the Acting Chair for reading the names of those in the Visitors' Gallery into the record, which saves me doing so. I want to thank everyone for joining us, especially the victims' families, who have endured heart-breaking losses and long quests for answers on the whereabouts of their loved ones. Following on from the Independent Commission for the Location of Victims’ Remains, ICLVR, our quest for justice continues in the cases of the disappeared.

This motion that Senator McGreehan and I have tabled is therefore imperative as we call on anyone who has information, however small, about the disappeared to inform the ICLVR. We implore anyone with information to now do the right thing and bring peace to the victims' families who have suffered for long enough.

Some 19 people were disappeared at the hands of paramilitary organisations during the Troubles. Of those 19, 14 victims' remains were uncovered through a lot of pressure and pain that, it has to be said, should not have had to applied. There are still five outstanding. Those who were found include Seamus Wright, Kevin McKee, Jean McConville, Peter Wilson, Eamon Molloy, Brendan Megraw, Brian McKinney, John McClory, Gerard "Gerry" Evans, Eugene Simons, Danny McIlhone, Charles Armstrong, Seamus Ruddy and Gareth O'Connor, who was disappeared in 2003. Gareth's case was not included in the remit of the legislation for the ICLVR, which can only work on the cases of those who were disappeared up to the Good Friday Agreement of 1998.

All of those were disappeared, it is either suspected or confirmed, by the IRA. As of today, there are still five victims whose whereabouts remain unknown. Joseph "Joe" Lynskey was added to the official list of the disappeared in February 2010. In 1972, at the age of 40, Joe, who was a former Cistercian monk, went missing from his home in the Beechmount area of west Belfast. It is suspected that he was killed by the IRA. Over 50 years later, his body is yet to be recovered.

Columba McVeigh, whose brothers join us in the Gallery, was just 17 years old when he was abducted in Donaghmore, County Tyrone, and killed by the IRA. He had been working as a painter in Dublin and had just returned to Northern Ireland a few days earlier. Extensive searches have been carried out on the Bragan bog near Emyvale, County Monaghan, based on information that has been received. However, as of yet, his remains still have not been recovered.

In 1997, Robert Nairac, was abducted from the Three Steps Inn in Drumintee, south Armagh, by the Provisional IRA. Robert was a 29-year-old officer with the Grenadier Guards, who was on a tour of duty in Northern Ireland at the time of his abduction and murder. An IRA veteran named Kevin Crilly was charged with Robert's murder in 2009, but sadly his body still remains unrecovered. Captain Nairac was recognised and awarded the George Cross after his death.

In February 2022, Seamus Maguire was added to the official list of the disappeared. It was in and around 1973 or 1974 when he vanished at the age of about 26, after leaving his home at Aghagallon, near Lurgan. Based on information that was received by the PSNI, it is believed that Seamus was murdered by republican paramilitaries.

On 28 February 2005, the 25-year-old Lisa Dorrian went missing after attending a party at a caravan site at the seaside town of Ballyhalbert in County Down. It is believed that her killer may have been in association with UVF members. Sadly, Lisa's remains are still yet to be recovered. Like Gareth O'Connor, Lisa's case is not included in the remit of the legislation for the ICLVR, which can only work on the cases that came before the Good Friday Agreement.

These deaths and disappearances are a tragic symbol of the loss of life and the hurt experienced by communities in the North during the Troubles. It has to be said - and I am sure other speakers will say this too - that these cases are seen by many down South as a northern thing, because these victims are in the North. However, it is actually a southern thing, because they were taken south and, in most cases, were tortured and killed in the South and were buried somewhere in the South. Therefore, they are very much for us to deal with. That is part of the reason we have tabled the motion.

The motion acknowledges that communities within Northern Ireland have been silent concerning the cases of these missing people as a result of the fear of the consequences of speaking out. Both Governments, including our own Department of Justice and the Department of Foreign Affairs, need to refocus our efforts on finding the truth so families can find out the truth and can get much-needed closure.

John Wilson was the first joint chair of the Independent Commission for the Location of Victims' Remains. Deputies like him and Deputy Brendan Smith, along with many others, have consistently raised this issue over the years. In a statement to the Dáil in November 2013, Deputy Brendan Smith said:

We have yet to hear the IRA leadership of that time deal in any appropriate way with a response if there is such a thing when one is dealing with murder. The leadership of that time have very serious questions to deal with arising from this callous murder.

There must be a particular refocus by Sinn Féin to continue this quest for justice and righting the wrongs of the past. We have seen that Sinn Féin is great at glorifying its former leader, Gerry Adams, but his failure to act in these cases leaves a deplorable history in which no organisation should have any part or be proud. In my eyes, until Sinn Féin members deal with the victims they are responsible for, they cannot and should not refer to themselves as republicans. Those actions do not encapsulate the values of republicanism. The attributes of republicanism are not in accord with the manner in which Sinn Féin is currently dealing with these cases. Sinn Féin needs to take the necessary steps and to approach this very differently.

I appeal to the Minister to sit down with the families of victims on a renewed basis, along with the Minister for Foreign Affairs, and to listen to their stories. Now that east-west relations are on a better footing there must be a renewed focus on dealing with the final five cases. We must show our strong support for the efforts to recover those persons still missing so the families here with us today, and those who are not here, may finally bury their loved ones in a dignified, fitting manner.

Erin McGreehan (Fianna Fail)
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I second the motion. I thank the Minister for being here this evening. I also thank the many family members of the disappeared, who are here with us this evening, for their relentless, courage, composure and dignity. I acknowledge the incredible work of WAVE Trauma Centre, which has provided care and support for people affected by the Troubles for more than 30 years.

It is with a really heavy heart that we gather to remember the people who are known as "the disappeared". These were individuals who were murdered during the Troubles, and their bodies were hidden and destroyed so that their families could not properly mourn their loss, with the goal being to inflict more pain, and more control over the families and communities.

I am personally honoured to be a co-sponsor of this evening's motion. It is a great privilege to contribute to another important and poignant discussion on the deep, dark legacy that besets all of us on this island. It is very important that we do not stop discussing these issue. The more we highlight the plain fact that there is information out there that could give peace to families or give a person a decent burial, the more chance that someone will look to their conscience and speak up. We have a desperate, ruthless, painful past that continues to affect us all, a culture of not speaking up for fear of reprisal. We must end that culture.

The disappearing of individuals must be one of the cruellest acts anyone could commit against a family. It is the families who continue to live with the pain: who suffer, yearn and long for the return of their loved ones' bodies each day. It is difficult to imagine the pain and the suffering the families experienced. For years, they were left without answers, closure, or the chance to say goodbye. The agony of not knowing what had happened to their loved ones must be just unbearable. It is many years after the Troubles ended, 25 years since the Good Friday Agreement, and decades after these people were murdered, but people are still living with the trauma of not knowing.

I live only a few miles away from Shelling Hill where Jean McConville was buried. I go there with my children - as I have done all my life. It is a beautiful place, with the Cooley Mountains in the background and the open sea in front, with the happiness of children playing, families together and the normality of life. When one thinks about it: it is sick. Every time I go there, I think of the McConville family. I think of a mammy who was torn from her babies. I am very grateful to her son, Michael, who is in the Visitors Gallery, for taking time today to speak to me. It was not enough that she was taken from them, and they were left without parents, the IRA spent the days, weeks, months, and years after torturing that family with lies, abuse and the torment of not knowing.

Five bodies of the disappeared remain today in unmarked graves. There are still families awaiting closure. We all hope for peace and reconciliation. This is a very commonly used phrase. How can we reconcile when the location of victims' bodies is still unknown? We know where the answers lie and we as a State have a responsibility to make it as simple as possible for those with information to give it up. I urge the Minister to meet with the families of the disappeared, which I am sure he will do, to get advice from them, to create a path forward to find the bodies and the truth.

This is not a Six Counties problem; it is this State's problem. The bodies are not buried in the North, they are buried here in the Republic. It is our responsibility to act without hesitancy to get these victims a proper, final burial place. Some might ask why this is important as it happened decades ago, the Troubles are over, and it is all in the past. However, that could not be further from the truth. It is the present that mothers are going to their grave without knowing where their children are. It matters because human life, dignity, respect, and the basic decency of a Christian burial matters. With the loss of a loved one, the ritual of mourning, the tradition of the wake, the carrying of a coffin, and the physical solidarity of standing shoulder to shoulder with someone all help with the healing. You never get over the loss of a loved one, you just learn to walk with that grief. You go to the graveside. You have a conversation with them and you tell them what you are up to. You regale them with stories of what happens in your life. These families were denied all of that, and that is why it matters. That is why the people who know something - even the smallest detail - must speak up. They should not take these families' trauma and the truth to their grave.

Time is running out. The commission has proven that with the right information it does get results. I urge the Minister to put a renewed emphasis on this issue within his Department, the Department of Foreign Affairs, and within the Garda Síochána, because these families deserve peace.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the Minister. I thank Fianna Fáil for tabling the motion and giving us the opportunity to talk about the disappeared and the details outlined in the motion. In particular, I thank the family members for being here this evening. I know some of them have brought their loved ones home and others have not yet done so, but it is a fact that they are still working together and supporting each other. This awful experience has brought them all together and they are still here fighting for everyone who is among the disappeared.

We have spent a lot of time in this House talking about the European Convention on Human Rights and the British Government living up to its international human rights obligations. The Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill puts total control in the hands of the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and a self-appointed body, the independent commission for reconciliation and information recovery, for them to decide which families would or would not get access to a human rights-compliant investigation and the threshold of accountability for truth telling. We all agree in this House, Members of every party and none, that this is not just a denial of human rights, it robs families and victims of their human rights and it is a cynical and despicable attempt to withhold truth and justice and control who knows what, so it is hard to stomach when that same culture of control and denial of human rights is accepted to this day within a democratic political party in this State and on this island.

I have spoken many times in Leinster House about Columba McVeigh and the disappeared. My father before me also did so. I knew the words "the disappeared" before I knew what they meant. I knew the McVeighs because they are from the village I am from. I knew about Columba from a very young age. His name was frequently spoken in our house and there was talk about trying to get him home.Columba was abducted, murdered and buried in secret by the IRA.

All any of the families want is a proper burial. That is it. They do not want anybody to be punished. The only justice anyone is seeking here is closure on what were brutal and undeserved deaths, and to be able to bring their precious ones home as a final act of love and care, that all families deserve. No legacy mechanisms and bilateral agreements are needed to do this, just the will to do the decent thing within your organisation, to dig deep at every level of the republican movement for information for these families, to cut through a culture of control that still exists to this day, and genuinely encourage those with information to come forward and reassure them that it is okay. There is no point in denying that a culture of silence and omertadoes still exist on our island because I can give two names. First, there is Paul Quinn who was murdered in 2007, which was nearly ten years after the Good Friday Agreement. Every bone in his body was broken when he was beaten to death in a barn in County Monaghan. There is a wall of silence around what happened to Paul Quinn.

Second, there is Robert McCartney. He was punched, beaten and stabbed to death outside a pub in Belfast after his friend had a run in with a man inside. All of the 72 drinkers at the pub told detectives that they were in the toilet when the assault happened.

I know that there has been co-operation but until all of those family members are back with their families then it is not enough, and there is no excuse.

In relation to Columba McVeigh's case, I ask the Minister present, and we have dealt with the former Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Coveney, previously about this matter, to ensure that a interlocutor is used in these cases. Columba's family would prefer if there was no interlocutor and that the information is more direct. That is one request. I hope to God that when the search resumes, and hopefully soon, that Columba is found.

I call on the Minister for Justice to address the irregularity of the Troubles permanent disablement payment scheme or injured pension. We are in the situation where the pension has been introduced in the North after a long time and people are applying for it. However, I believe that a person wishing to apply was born in the South, that person does not get the same access to the pension. So a potential applicant born in the North or in the UK who was injured in the North or South of Ireland can access the pension but not if he or she was born in the South of Ireland. I understand that to be the situation and Sandra Peake from the WAVE Trauma Centre will confirm the matter. I believe that the pension eligibility situation is worth pursuing because there could be two people who have suffered in the same explosion but one of them might not have the same access to redress or supports as the other victim, which is wrong. If the Minister needs to deal with the British Government to change the situation then I think that he should do so.

To conclude, I wish to emphasise the importance of this matter. I thank the Minister for dealing with me about victims' cases in general, and I also thank the previous Minister for Foreign Affairs and the Taoiseach. We must do everything we can and not just in this case. Everyone in this House must do everything they can, show leadership and they must do as they say.

Niall Ó Donnghaile (Sinn Fein)
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Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire agus roimh na teaghlaigh atá linn sa Gallery anocht. I welcome the Minister for this debate, and I welcome the families and guests who are in the Gallery. Indeed, I welcome the opportunity to speak on behalf of Sinn Féin on the Fianna Fáil motion and commend its proposers, Senators Blaney and McGreehan.

I want to take this opportunity to extend my sympathy, and that of Sinn Féin, to the families of those killed in the conflict and who are collectively known as "the disappeared". Republicans accept, and I accept, that what the IRA did was an injustice that needed to be rectified. This has been said by Sinn Féin many times over the years and I say it again here on behalf of Sinn Féin.

I welcome that 14 of the 19 affected families have had their loved ones returned to them. This has arisen from the crucial work carried out by the Independent Commission for the Location of Victims' Remains. I commend the commission, and those who have helped it in its all-important work. We have heard from the commission on a number of occasions at the Joint Committee on the Implementation of the Good Friday Agreement and that has been a deeply harrowing experience. I urge the commission to continue its work. I appeal to anyone who has any information about those who are still missing to contact the commission and to assist it in any way they possibly can.

I agree entirely with the sentiment of the Fianna Fáil motion with respect to the impact on the families of those who were murdered and disappeared. The motion correctly says "their families have struggled with the pain and trauma of bereavement in addition to the agony of not knowing where their loved ones are buried". I acknowledge that even something like this debate re-traumatises the families. I know that like the many cases we have talked about in these Houses, families would much rather not have to do this. So I acknowledge that even having to attend a debate like this is harrowing for the families themselves.

Sinn Féin supports the motion. I think that it is in keeping with the Fianna Fáil motion that we acknowledge the grief of all relatives who have lost loved ones in the conflict. I suggest that not in any way to take away from the import and gravity of this motion but to allow this Chamber the opportunity to express our continued sympathy to all relatives, with whom the WAVE Trauma Centre works and supports each and every day, and I acknowledge that Ms Peake, its CEO, is in the Gallery.

Again, I call on anyone with any information, no matter how small, to bring it forward and support these families in their quest to recover the bodies of their loved ones. I support truth and justice, and I want to see truth and justice prevail for all. Again, I welcome the opportunity to speak on the motion and thank Fianna Fáil colleagues for tabling the motion. Above all else, I hope that the sentiments expressed in this motion can be seen through and that ultimately we can achieve the recovery of those who remain disappeared, and ensure that they are buried properly and appropriately, and brought home to their families.

Diarmuid Wilson (Fianna Fail)
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Like my colleagues, I welcome the families of the victims who are collectively known as "the disappeared" to the Gallery along with the representatives of the WAVE Trauma Centre. They are very welcome but should not have to be here.

I welcome the Minister, Deputy Harris, and I think this is the first opportunity I have had to welcome him as the new Minister for Justice. He is very welcome but, yet again, he should not have to be here either.

I commend my colleagues, Senators Blaney and McGreehan, for tabling this extremely important and emotive motion. I welcome the fact that 14 families of the 19 affected families have found their deceased loved ones. I look forward to the day that the remaining five families are reconciled with the bodies of their loved ones.

I commend the 19 families for coming together to form a group to pursue this issue - the location of their loved ones. I especially thank the 14 families who have already found their loved ones for sticking with this process while I am sure they were tempted, at some stages, to walk away and leave the other families to their own devices. I commend the 14 families for not doing that and for sticking together. I hope that we will get a final resolution to this horrific scene.The people who disappeared these victims denied them their lives. They denied their families a traditional way to say goodbye and a permanent graveside to visit. They denied their victims' loved ones the religious rites in which they believed. They denied the disappeared the respect any of us is entitled to when we pass on. They denied the families a grave in which their loved ones could lie beside other family members. They denied the families a permanent place to which they could always go to say goodbye.

We could all jump up and down and start hurling abuse at Sinn Féin and the Irish National Liberation Army, INLA, but that will achieve nothing. While it is important that we keep raising this issue at a political level, we need to go a step further and do so very strongly. I appeal to anybody with any information about where the other five victims are located to come forward. None of us is getting any younger. The people involved who are still alive are not young men or women. If there is anybody who can use his or her good office to talk to people who have knowledge about the location of these bodies, I beg him or her to use that influence and talk to those people.

The motion is not using this issue for political purposes. I want to make that clear. Using this matter as a political tool will not help to find the bodies. It is by dialogue and communication that we will do so. Let us put all our efforts into doing that. Let us work to see these five families getting the peace they so richly deserve. When we met with the victims' families earlier today, they said they never thought looking forward to a funeral would give them such peace. I will never forget that comment.

Reference was made to the appointment of Sir Kenneth Bloomfield and former Tánaiste John Wilson by both Governments in June 1999. I remember talking to Mr. Wilson around that time and him saying that he found it extremely difficult to deal with the situation. He was very emotional about it. Can any of us imagine what the families have gone through over all these years? If there is anybody out there who can help, let us talk quietly and get this dealt with once and for all.

Simon Harris (Wicklow, Fine Gael)
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In answer to Senator Wilson's rhetorical question, I do not think any of us can imagine the ongoing pain, grief and trauma the families have been put through. I feel humbled to be here this evening on behalf of the Government and in my role as Minister for Justice to respond to this important and timely debate. I join colleagues in the Seanad in welcoming the families and the representatives of the WAVE Trauma Centre. I look forward to taking up the offer to engage and meet with them and to see how we can support them in trying to progress this matter. We certainly will put those arrangements in place. I am conscious of speaking of and about their loved ones in front of them but I thank them for joining us here.

I thank Senators Blaney and McGreehan for bringing forward this motion. It could not come at a more appropriate time, which I will comment on further presently. I share Senator Wilson's wish that it was not necessary to debate this motion but, for the reasons Senator Currie and others outlined, it is necessary. It is important that we continue to keep a visibility around and a focus on this issue and that we take the opportunity of debating this motion to accept the challenge to renew, redouble and recommit our efforts to bringing some small element of comfort, peace and closure to the families who have been through so much. The Government will support the passage of the motion through the House. At its core, it is a motion about victims and their families. As I said, it is about bringing a small measure of comfort and some important closure to the families of the disappeared, who have long suffered a particular cruelty. They have faced not just the tragedy, injustice and pain of losing a loved one to murder but also not knowing for decades where that loved one was buried. Those responsible took a loved one in brutal circumstances and then compounded that pain, grief and cruelty by depriving the family of the remains, a funeral and the tradition of grief and closure one goes through after a period of loss.

As we approach the 25th anniversary of the Good Friday Agreement and the commitments that were made in that agreement to those who suffered such personal and profound loss, it is right that those victims remain to the fore in our minds. As we look back, as we no doubt will, in commemorating 25 years of peace on the island of Ireland and the peace agreement, we should remember the commitments that were made in writing and also in spirit as to how the agreement would move us forward and try to bring about healing and reconciliation. The Good Friday Agreement specifically provided that it was essential to acknowledge and address the suffering of the victims of violence as a necessary element of reconciliation.

The establishment by both the UK and Irish Governments of the Independent Commission for the Location of Victims' Remains, ICLVR, in 1999 was one of a key set of actions taken by the Governments in fulfilling and advancing that commitment. As colleagues know, the ICLVR is responsible for facilitating the location of the remains of victims of paramilitary violence who were murdered and secretly buried before 10 April 1998 as a result of acts committed on behalf of, or in connection with, an unlawful organisation. The date of 10 April 1998 was considered appropriate as it was the date of signing of the Good Friday Agreement. The role of the ICLVR is purely humanitarian and victims are at the centre of its work. The overriding priority for the commission is to return the remains of the victims to their families in order that they can receive a decent burial and that the families may, in some measure at least, achieve resolution or closure in regard to their loss.

The suffering of the families of the disappeared is almost unimaginable. Their loved ones were abducted, murdered and secretly buried. For years and decades, these families have struggled with the pain and trauma of not knowing what happened to their loved one and of grieving while not knowing where they are buried. The ICLVR is independent in the performance of its functions. Confidentiality in respect of the information provided to the commission is fundamental to its work because it relies on information to pursue its investigations. The commission continues to promote the plight of the families of the disappeared and to call on those with information to come forward, via regular press statements, media appearances and other efforts to continue to keep a focus on the issue.We join with it this evening in echoing the call for anyone with even a shred of information, no matter how small, to come forward. In November 2021, the commission appeared before the Joint Committee on the Implementation of the Good Friday Agreement and welcomed the unanimous support. I, too, welcome the unanimous support for its work expressed by that committee.

The Independent Commission for the Location of Victims' Remains, ICLVR, has been a highly successful cross-Border legacy institution. It is important that we recognise that. It is a concrete demonstration of commitment to the families of the disappeared and the victims of the Troubles. The commission through its work has recovered the remains of some and others, sadly, still remain to be found, namely, Joseph Lynskey, Columba McVeigh, Robert Nairac and Seamus Maguire.

Seamus Maguire is the most recent addition to the list of disappeared. On the basis of information received by the PSNI, he was added to the list in February 2022. He was approximately 26 years old when he disappeared from the Lurgan area of County Armagh in the 1970s. Joe Lynskey was from Belfast and disappeared in the summer of 1972. The ICLVR began conducting excavations at a site in County Meath in March 2015. That search uncovered the remains of Seamus Wright and Kevin McKee. The search continues for Joe. Columba McVeigh from Donaghmore in County Tyrone was just 17 years old when he was abducted and killed in October 1975. He had been working in Dublin and had only returned to Northern Ireland a few days earlier. Numerous searches have taken place at Bragan bog in County Monaghan, but his remains have yet to be recovered. The most recent search began in October of last year and while it is currently paused, it is due to restart shortly. Let us all hope beyond hope that this search will be successful and finally bring some comfort to his sister Dympna and brother Oliver who continue to raise his case and seek any information that might locate their brother. Captain Robert Nairac was an officer in the Grenadier Guards and was on a tour of duty in Northern Ireland when he was abducted and murdered in County Armagh in May 1977. He was 29 years old. His remains have yet to be recovered.

The commission, with the support of the Irish and British Governments, continues to work tirelessly on behalf of families of the disappeared and is committed to completing its task of locating the remains of those who have yet to be found. This motion calls on those with information to bring that information forward. I ask anyone with information that could help recover the remains of those yet to be found to contact the commission. Commission investigations can be complicated and difficult. Information from the public is crucial to its work. It is important that persons who may have relevant information but may be reluctant to share with the commission know that confidentiality is assured, and that the confidentiality rule has always been strictly observed. A key feature of the governing legislation in Ireland and the UK is that it legally guarantees that any information given to the commission must be treated as absolutely confidential and can only be used for the sole purpose of locating remains. If an individual makes a statement or provides information as to his or her involvement or knowledge of the disappearance, killing or burial of an individual to the commission, that statement or information should not be admissible by the prosecution in a criminal process. This is further underpinned by provisions providing for restrictions on disclosure of information and restrictions on the forensic testing of human and other items that may be found. I say that to really encourage anyone with information to know that they can and should come forward.

The ICLVR has no remit beyond these Troubles-related killings and secret burials that occurred prior to the signing of the Good Friday Agreement. There are, of course, other cases where families have had to suffer the cruelty of a family member's disappearance. The Senators in their motion include the two tragic cases of Lisa Dorrian, who disappeared in 2005, and Gareth O'Connor, who disappeared in 2003. Lisa's remains are yet to be recovered. I implore anyone who has information relating to her disappearance to bring that forward to the authorities in Northern Ireland to assist.

It is also the case that there remains a larger group of missing persons in Ireland. Every year, my Department organises an annual all-island ceremony to mark National Missing Persons Day. The tenth such ceremony was held in Croke Park last December and was hosted by my colleague, the Minister of State, Deputy James Browne. This is a ceremony to provide an opportunity for people to come together to commemorate and remember their missing loved ones. It is more than that, however. It is also a platform to appeal to the public for information on missing persons. We use that opportunity each year to promote the work of the ICLVR. Those with information have an opportunity and an obligation to ease the pain of the families who have suffered so much for so long.

The Good Friday Agreement says that we can best honour those who died or were injured and their families through a firm dedication to "reconciliation, tolerance, and mutual trust, and to the protection and vindication of the human rights of all." This has framed our Government's approach to the legacy of the past in Northern Ireland. The needs of victims must be core and all relevant human rights obligations must be met. Dealing effectively with the past will allow the achievement of a more reconciled society.

In the Stormont House Agreement of 2014, the two Governments and most assembly parties agreed a way forward on legacy that would meet the needs of victims, uphold human rights and contribute to reconciliation. This approach was endorsed by both Governments as a fresh start and the New Decade, New Approach agreement was published as recently as 2020. In May 2022, however, with the publication of its Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill, regrettably, the UK Government decided to move away from the Stormont House Agreement and take a unilateral approach to dealing with the past. This Bill faces almost universal opposition. It does not have the support of any political party in Northern Ireland or of victims' groups. Enactment in its current form risks severely damaging trust and setting back reconciliation efforts. Since the publication of that Bill, the Council of Europe has on four occasions, in June, September and December of 2022, and again this month, expressed its serious concerns about the Bill and its comparability with the European Convention on Human Rights. The UK Government published amendments to the Bill in January and February. However, the Committee of Ministers of the Council of Europe, in its decision earlier this month, expressed the serious concern that those amendments do not sufficiently allay the concerns relating to the Bill.

Other major international human rights actors have also made their views known. We heard the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights express his concerns with the Bill, especially in the context of the immunity scheme, and his call on the UK to reconsider its approach. The UK Parliament's Joint Committee on Human Rights has been strongly critical of the Bill. Many families are upset by the publication and the progress of the Bill, including those waiting for inquests or pursuing civil litigation. There will be many that understandably feel that immunity, conditional or otherwise, may be more about protecting perpetrators instead of pursuing justice and getting to the truth in such cases. Every family deserves and is legally entitled to an effective investigation and access to justice for their loved one. This is a point my colleague, the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs, has repeatedly made to counterparts in the British Government, and we will continue to do so. We urge them to pause this legislation and return to a partnership approach on this vital issue that goes to the heart of the process of reconciliation. Victims need to be at the centre of any truth and reconciliation process. Their support and confidence in the process is essential to its success. While that is a broader point, I want to take the opportunity of this evening's motion to make that point.

I also want to take the opportunity Senator Currie has afforded me to remember the families of Paul Quinn and Robert McCartney and their ongoing quest for justice. They should know that we stand in solidarity with them as well. I repeat my call and that of the Government and the Oireachtas for anyone with information that could help recover the remains of those still missing to pass that information to the commission without delay, safe in the knowledge that it will be treated with the strictest confidence. The overriding priority for the Government and my Department when it comes to the disappeared is to return the remains of the victims to their families in order that they can receive a decent burial. This welcome motion seeks to bring about the conclusion and, therefore, the Government will support it.

As I said, I will also take up the offer of Senators Blaney and McGreehan to engage with the families to see how my Department and that of my colleague, the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs, Government and our authorities can further assist the families. Let us hope beyond hope that all those still missing can be reunited with their families.

Joe O'Reilly (Fine Gael)
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I congratulate Senators Blaney and McGreehan on bringing forward the motion and on their exposition in respect of it. I welcome the victims' families to the Gallery. I met them briefly as I came in. Our hearts go out to them. They are very welcome, and they have all our support. I thank the Minister for indicating in his speech that he will meet the families and that process will be put in motion. I am delighted that is the case. I want to acknowledge that.

I support the call of my colleague from County Cavan, Senator Wilson, for everybody to come forward with information. Anybody with the slightest piece of information should please come forward with it. Indeed, I support his call and the general call for anyone in a position of leadership capable of encouraging people to come forward with this information to please do so.It is crucial that the information be brought forward. That is a vital step.

The Minister's meeting with the victims' families is good and the motion is good but the information needs to flow so that something can be done. If the information flows, of course something will be done, in the sense that the bodies will be recovered and all that goes with that. I acknowledge what my colleague from Cavan said. I think it is fair. Senator Blaney referred to the fact that his family are very invested in this question, as his uncle John P. Wilson with whom I served in public life in Cavan and I knew very well, was the first victims commissioner. That is why the family have a particular relationship with this question and I want to acknowledge that.

It is a shocking thing that we talk about somebody looking forward to a funeral but nothing is more important for people than to gain a level of closure. As the Acting Chair mentioned, it is important for people to have a place to go to visit their relatives, to have their religious ceremonies and have all that goes with that. It is so embedded in the human condition, our religion and Irish culture. It is central to how and what we are. One of the biggest days of the year in our local communities, which brings home people from all over to the local area, is cemetery Sunday. People come back to visit their family graves and to be around family on that day. It is an important day for many people.

Our hearts go out to the victims' families. Our hearts go out first of all for the tragedy and the wrong that was done to families but also for the fact that they now have this ongoing pain of not having access to graves or a ceremony. We can only imagine what people are going through. Nothing we can say is adequate but it behoves us in our job to see what we can do to be of support. The Minister's meeting is an important step in that and I am glad it is happening.

The next important step is that those in public life who are in any position to elicit information should do so. For the families, there is deep trauma, struggle and pain. Psychologists and people who understand these things a lot better than us say that when trauma hits a family it has effects that are felt for three generations. That is trauma as we commonly understand it. The trauma that the victims' families experienced is beyond anything that one can even imagine or contemplate.

I commend Senator Blaney who is a northern man with huge interest in this issue, as does his family. I also commend Senator McGreehan for bringing this issue to the House. It should be done periodically until the very last victim is recovered and the victim's family has found comfort. There is not much more that can be said. One could hear it in people's reactions and speeches that there is a level of trauma even for people at the distance we are at from it. If there is a level of stress and trauma at that distance, we can only attempt to imagine what it is like for those for whom it is central and everyday reality. I hope that some good will come out of it this motion.

Robbie Gallagher (Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the Minister of State to discuss this very important issue. Death is an unwelcome and uninvited guest that calls to all homes from time to time, bringing with it a sense of loss and heartache. When that death comes in a sudden manner it adds a different layer to the grief. When that death comes violently it adds another layer on top of that again for the families concerned. Then when that violent death results in a family not having somewhere to pray and speak to their loved ones, that is an entirely different situation.

This evening, along with a number of my colleagues, I had the pleasure of listening to the families who are here behind me. We meet many delegations, as does the Minister of State, as part of our everyday role but this one had a profound impact on me, as it did on many of my colleagues. What these people have been through and the journey they have undertaken and are still on, is really heartbreaking. They come to us today with a renewed cry for help. They have asked us to do all we can to create more awareness of the situation they find themselves in. For the McVeigh family the journey dates back to 1975 and Oliver is with us today. The word "time" has been mentioned often today. Time is running out for the families. They have come here today to ask all political parties and none to do all they can to highlight their plight.

I am delighted that the Minister for Justice, Deputy Harris, has committed to meet the families. I understand that the Tánaiste, Deputy Micheál Martin, has done likewise. I also understand that an invitation has gone out to other parties, including Sinn Fein, and I ask that that request be facilitated also. This evening is not a witch hunt or about pointing fingers at anybody. It is about trying to bring an end to the journey that these people have been on for almost 50 years, in some cases. That is too long. It is a heartache and a life sentence that these people have been asked to carry. It has gone on long enough.

I appeal to anyone who has any information whatsoever to come forward and share that information with the authorities. People can do so in the knowledge that the information is not going anywhere else and is purely to assist in finding the bodies of those who have been so cruelly buried. Some people might think that they might have a snippet of information that is probably no good. Some of the delegation today described this as a piece of a jigsaw. It is about putting all these small pieces together to try to get a full picture. No matter how small a piece of information might be, it could be very useful to the commission in its efforts to try to find those who remain yet to be found. The heartache of the McVeigh family continues and in a number of weeks a search will resume in County Monaghan at Bragan Bog for the body of young Columba. I issue a heartfelt plea to anyone who has any information whatsoever, no matter how small or insignificant they think it might be, to please come forward and share that information with the commission.These families have been on the road for much too long and all they want is as much closure as they can possibly get. I appeal to anybody with information to come forward and give it. Regarding the McVeigh family, hopefully this is the last year we are in this Chamber making this request. I ask anybody in any form of leadership or any form of the community to come forward and give the information they have to assist people to bring an end to this living nightmare they have endured for almost half a century.

John McGahon (Fine Gael)
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I thank and congratulate my colleagues in Fianna Fáil, namely, Senators Blaney and McGreehan, for proposing this motion. Both Senators have been strong advocates for this on the Good Friday committee, which I sit on, and in this House. I warmly welcome the families. I have met Oliver before. I thank them for being here.

I am 32 years of age, from Dundalk and grew up in the 1990s with a concept of the Northern Irish Troubles. So many of the disappeared who have been recovered were buried in the soil of my county. I often think if it was not for a storm in Shelling Hill in 2002 and coastal erosion, would Michael McConville be here tonight not knowing where his mother was buried? Many things come into play in this when we look at the disappeared who have turned up in County Louth: Gerry Evans was recovered from Carrickrobin; Jean McConville was recovered from Shelling Hill beach; Eamonn Molloy's body was discovered in a coffin in Faughart graveyard; Eugene Simons was discovered in a bog in Knockbridge; Captain Robert Nairac is almost undoubtedly buried in Ravensdale forest.

People came for these people to take human life and dignity in one of the cruellest fashions possible. All of these were innocent young people with their lives ahead of them. Their lives were extinguished and taken away from them by the IRA based on nothing more than wrong information, falsehoods, lies and rumour. There are still families who have not been able to give Christian burials or to take their loved ones home, look after them, bury them and give them a proper funeral. It is utterly grotesque and heartbreaking that 50, 40, 30 or 20 years on, these families do not get basic justice. We will all have the privilege and pleasure of taking loved ones who pass from our lives to their resting place. Many of these families are still waiting for that privilege.

We talk about wanting information, wanting to find out what happened and people having to come forward. The IRA took these people to their graves, stole away these family members and put these people in the cold grey soil of my county, Louth, Senator Gallagher’s county, Monaghan, and elsewhere in the Border region. If people still at high levels in Sinn Féin know who was involved in these murders and the people involved have subsequently died or, because of the passage of time, cannot exactly remember, at least say that. They should, if they are serious about wanting information and bringing a resolution to these families, come out and say these people were involved, these people have died, this person has Alzheimer’s disease or dementia, this person does not know and that they genuinely, hand on heart, cannot help in locating an individual. That would bring some sort of closure and would be better than silence or saying “Well, we would like information to come forward”. I am only in this House two years and have listened to this. I do not know how the families have listened to it for 50, 40 or 30 years. I have no idea. It is the same mealy-mouthed “If you have information, come forward”.

There is one political party in this country who knows where these people are buried, or knows the people who know, and members of that party need to look at themselves and figure out what they want to do.

Erin McGreehan (Fianna Fail)
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I call on Senator Blaney to reply to the debate.

Niall Blaney (Fianna Fail)
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I was not expecting to conclude so quickly. I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Carroll MacNeill, to the conclusion of the debate. We had a good discussion with the Minister and he has acceded to the request to reopen and review the case by meeting the families concerned. We are delighted with that news.

To refer to the speech made by Senator Currie. There is something rotten that has happened over the years in the Border areas. She referred to Paul Quinn. That is at the core of this. As Senator Wilson said, this is not about getting at Sinn Féin. I commend Senator Ó Donnghaile for being here tonight but I will continue to call out his party’s republican stance until issues like this are addressed. We appeal to the Senator as much as to anybody else tonight to go back to his leadership. Oliver McVeigh’s family lives over the road from Michelle O’Neill. This applies as much to the current leadership as to the past leadership. He worked for her father. Have we any sense of the republicanism they keep talking about and coming in here telling us about? Sometimes I find it hard to listen to the rhetoric from the likes of Senator Gavan. Where is he tonight? A so-called republican. I do not mind the rhetoric, but if you are going to be a republican, back it up.

This is not a threat but a case we are making. If our appeal is not heeded tonight, every chance I get, when somebody in Sinn Féin comes in and refers to themselves as a republican, I will question it on the floor of the House or at any opportunity. The request is measured and needs to be taken with the same respect it has been expressed with tonight. We ask Sinn Féin Members to go back to their leadership with a new sense of urgency about these cases.

We will have a swathe of gatherings around flags and everything else over Easter. In Monaghan, they will be out calling themselves republicans, talking republican language and talking about their comrades over the Easter period. Talk to any of these families of the disappeared and they will say that somewhere between six and 12 individuals were involved in each disappearance. We are not depending on one individual for information. The information is there. We know it is there. There has to be a proper approach by Sinn Féin to uncover this information. That is our appeal tonight, to Sinn Féin Members as much as to the Ministers, to work collectively to bring this sorry saga to an end. It has to be brought to an end.

I thank Senators and the Minister of State for being here. I thank all contributors and the families. I acknowledge the continued efforts of the WAVE Trauma Centre in Belfast and other locations across Northern Ireland and the support it gives victims of all descriptions.

Erin McGreehan (Fianna Fail)
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I thank everybody who contributed to the motion. It is a motion of great emotion and meaning. Let us hope someone hears it and peace is given.

Erin McGreehan (Fianna Fail)
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When is it proposed to sit again?

Niall Blaney (Fianna Fail)
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Tomorrow at 9.30 a.m.