Tim Lombard (Fine Gael)
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I welcome the Minister of State. I raise the National Educational Psychological Service, NEPS, and whether we have enough psychologists to service the educational platforms we have. NEPS is an important service. It gives support to teachers and parents on issues regarding education. From the figures I have received, we have just over 200 psychologists working in the service. This breaks down to one psychologist per 5,000 students. That is a significant workload for any psychologist. A psychologist might be dealing with between 12 and 20 schools, depending on the size of the school. The ratio of 1:5,000 is significant. There are issues with getting children assessed, getting them looked at and the communication between the principal, the teacher and the NEPS due to the workload of the service itself. Two colleges, namely, UCD and UL, involved in bringing forward our psychologists to the workplace itself. They need to be looked at as a body to ensure the number of graduates going through the system is increased to have more psychologists available to NEPS, because a ratio of 1:5,000 does not make sense.

When we look at happens in the day-to-day running of a school, it is important to understand principals are put in a position where not only do they need to decide access to education on the basis of where the child is in the line, but also the financial implications. I have been contacted by principals who look at this and say maybe the mother and father could pay for a private assessment and maybe they will leave them to do that and bring forward the other child for assessment by NEPS. That inequality is a huge issue for us. I have it myself; I know it well. I have seen scenarios where parents have the ability to pay €650 for the assessment, they get it and they get their child on the right platform moving forward, whether the child has a numeracy or literacy issue or whatever their need is. However, if a family does not have the ability to pay and must wait on the public list, they might wait until first year for the child to get the opportunity to be assessed. That child could be dyslexic or could have issues with numbers and because of that, he or she is put at a disadvantage all the way through. Therefore, equal access to all services is the huge issue.

I will talk about what we need to do. UL and UCD must bring forward more graduates. The model of access to NEPS at the moment must change in order that it is more of a training model that gives the teacher the opportunity to diagnose a dyslexic child. At the moment, someone has to be a psychologist to do that and it is a barrier for children to move forward. It must be ensured, therefore, that they get the proper education. The 1:50,000 ratio needs to be changed. It is frightening to think one NEPS psychologist could had a workload like that, which in some areas could encompass anything from 12 to 22 schools, from what I have been told. That is just unworkable and, therefore, a lot of work is required. There is a pathway to do this but a lot of work is required to ensure we have an appropriate service for our children, who need that service on the ground.

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill (Dún Laoghaire, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Senator for raising this important matter. I am here on behalf of the Department of Education today, but it is an area in which I have a very deep personal interest. I thank the Senator for setting it out so clearly. The Department of Education wanted me to highlight that the role of NEPS has evolved and changed over the years, and the service provides a broad range of supports to schools. As the Senator pointed out, the opportunity for equality of access to those services is among the most important challenges we face. He is right to highlight that point.

NEPS, in common with many other psychological services, has adopted a consultative model of service. The focus is on empowering teachers to intervene effectively with pupils. All schools have access to a service from NEPS, which includes psychological support in the event of a critical incident; a school staff support and development service to build school capability to provide a comprehensive continuum of support in schools; ongoing access to advice and support for schools from a psychologist; and casework services for individual children where there is a need for intensive consultation and assessment. That service is provided but children have to be able to access it, as the Senator has correctly observed.

NEPS psychologists work with school staff and offer training, guidance and consultation services for teachers in the provision of universal and targeted evidence-informed approaches and early interventions to promote children's well-being, inclusion and participation in their learning. Initiatives such as the Incredible Years teacher classroom management programme, the FRIENDS resilience and anxiety reduction programmes and the NEPS literacy development programmes have been welcomed by schools and their impact positively evaluated to date. Other examples of initiatives include the provision of tailored training to schools on how best to support a range of difficult issues such as reluctant school attendance, meeting the needs of students with autism, understanding and managing children's different behaviours and trauma-informed practice in schools.

NEPS has played an important role in developing policy and supporting schools as they welcome students from Ukraine. This includes publishing guidance on supporting all children who may be experiencing distress or trauma in relation to events, and delivering well-being webinars for teachers and school staff. NEPS psychologists are also actively engaging with school principals to provide advice on supporting students from Ukraine.

In 2021 the NEPS casework service extended to over 8,500 students. Additionally, under the scheme for commissioning psychological assessments, SCPA, process, private psychologists funded by the Department provided assessments to schools for over 900 students. However, as the Senator correctly pointed out, early access to a psychologist, a correct diagnosis and the relevant supports can make the difference for a child. A year or two years is a very long period in a child's life and a very short period for an adult. It is of huge developmental significance at that time.

NEPS also attempts to support an estimated 25,000 teachers annually through its support and development service. NEPS is structured with eight regional divisions trying to support schools. There are 225 whole-time equivalent educational psychologists across the eight NEPS regions, which has grown from a base of 173 in 2014. The Minister for Education recently announced an additional 54 educational psychologists to provide services to special schools and special classes as part of budget 2023 and as part of a focus on providing extra supports to special schools. A recruitment competition is ongoing with the Public Appointments Service, with interviews commencing this month. It is expected that vacancies will be filled from that recruitment campaign.

A working group in the Department has been examining the matter of how NEPS can continue to recruit adequate numbers of suitably qualified staff. The Senator is right to highlight the university programmes, expediting graduates from that and their availability for NEPS to continue to respond to the educational psychological needs of children in recognised primary and post-primary schools across the country. The group has agreed on a number of actions that must be taken to address supply issues in the medium to long term. These include the development of a workforce plan for educational psychologists within the Department of Education. Work has begun with other Departments to advance that. The Minister for Education would like me to remind the Senator that she remains committed to supporting the well-being, academic, social and emotional development of all learners, and that NEPS is leading the Department's work in those areas.

Tim Lombard (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State for her comprehensive response to my Commencement matter. This is about trying to find a pathway. The universities are important in that regard and we need to increase the number of university graduates. A large cohort of private psychologists are doing a very important job. I know of cases of school principals contacting the local Society of St. Vincent de Paul to have private assessments paid for. That has worked well.

The number of psychologists in the service is the big issue. The recruitment campaign is very much welcomed but it comes back to making sure sufficient graduates come out of the universities. We need to make sure we have a line of graduates coming out. We need to reduce the 5,000:1 pupil to psychologist ratio. That is an amazing figure considering the workload required of these people who work so hard, and the vulnerable children in society who need support. A little bit of support in the early years goes such a long way afterwards.

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill (Dún Laoghaire, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Senator for raising this matter. He is correct that early intervention across any stream, whether it is learning or psychological support, can genuinely make a difference, not just to how well children develop in those areas but to their well-being, the management of their anxiety and their mental health at every stage throughout that process and also their inclusion within the school. Too many children have found themselves excluded for want of better and earlier interventions in different ways. NEPS will continue to support the well-being and academic, social and emotional development of all learners. The Minister is deeply committed to ensuring that comprehensive psychological service is available in schools. The recent announcement to continue to recruit is important. I hope the next time we discuss this matter in the Seanad the positions will have been filled from the current recruitment process.