Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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The Order of Business is No. 1, motion re appointments to the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission, referral to committee, to be taken on the conclusion of the Order of Business, without debate; and No. 2, European Stability Mechanism (Amendment) Bill 2014 - Second Stage, to be taken at 3.45 p.m., with the contributions of group spokespersons not to exceed eight minutes and all other Senators not to exceed five minutes.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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I would like to ask the Deputy Leader where stands Irish Water at this stage and the whole water charges debacle. I found it a little perplexing over the past few days to see Government Deputies and Senators wringing their hands, saying it is terrible and blaming the management of Irish Water. I remind Members opposite that it is their creation. They created Irish Water and set it up as a separate private entity against the advice of PwC.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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It is not private; it is public.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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It might as well be private as it is a separate entity. They set it up against the advice of PwC. I genuinely call on the Government - Senator Conway does not have to leave at this stage as water falls from the sky and it is free-----

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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We do not comment on Senators leaving the Chamber.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Only 500,000 people have returned the documentation out of 1.2 million. The whole thing is a debacle. The Government might as well shut it down, suspend any further charging and try to get this right. Most people want water conserved and want a fair system, with which I would agree. However, the situation is going from bad to worse and it will not get any better unless the Government shows some leadership. I formally ask the Deputy Leader to ask Ministers to suspend water charges, carry out a proper review, give the system time and put a proper and correct system in place.

I refer to the very serious statements of fact made in regard to the cover up of abuse and rape in the North of Ireland by the provisional movement and by members of Sinn Féin. Unfortunately, this country has had to deal with terrible affairs in regard to child sexual and physical abuse. On foot of the announcement by the Director of Public Prosecutions in the North that there will be a specific inquiry into three cases, what action will the Government take? I am certain there are people in this State - in the Republic - and Irish citizens in the North who have been affected? Are there any plans for the Government to set up an inquiry in this regard?

I will not mention any names as I do not want to politicise the situation any more than it has been but everyone knows what the real situation is and who knew what. Perhaps the Government will have a specific response in regard to any inquiry. It may be useful in the coming weeks for the Minister for Justice and Equality or the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs to come to the House to address these matters. Even though it was a paramilitary organisation - some would call it a terrorist organisation - its cover ups were institutional, about which there is no question. It was systemic in that organisation.

The social welfare and pensions Bill is due but I am no further down the road in regard to getting answers from the Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection about the airport pensioners, the airport pension scheme and the drastic reductions the Government proposes to make to the pensions of both retired members and deferred members, who will take hits of up to 60% to what they were promised.

These reductions also affect the active members of the scheme. I have mentioned this time and again. We all know that if this is allowed happen to this pension scheme, it will happen to pension schemes all over the country. This is not just about the 15,000 people who are affected. It is very unfair. I think we would agree on all sides of the House that what is being proposed is absolutely outrageous. I cannot get an answer from the Tánaiste. She keeps referring to the fact that the expert panel liaised and dealt in a very detailed manner with people's concerns. It did not and we all know that.

In advance of the social welfare Bill, I need to know the Government's position, so I can prepare amendments to that Bill. With that in mind, I would like to table an amendment to the Order of Business that, even for half an hour, the Tánaiste would come to the House and make a statement on the position with regard to pension changes that have been passed under the State Airports (Shannon Group) Bill 2014, which affects 15,000 current and former airport workers. They are entitled to know whether the Government will bring forward any amendments to stop these drastic reductions in their pensions. I formally propose that amendment.

Michael D'Arcy (Fine Gael)
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I will begin by supporting Senator O'Brien's request for a debate on child abuse. This is something that is better discussed in the open. It is something that unfortunately I know too much about, being from County Wexford and from the diocese of Ferns. The natural instinct for every institution is to cover it up. That is always the wrong thing to do. I support the call for the Minister for Justice and Equality, or the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, whomever is the appropriate Minister, to come to the House and for that debate to be held. It could be worthwhile for us to do so.

Water is the issue of the moment, there is no question about that. I am a little perplexed at the fact that we are looking at a net figure for water of €175 million. This is on top of other charges and on top of the pain that has come previously but, as Senator O'Brien has discussed on many occasions, the VAT reduction to 9% for the hospitality sector was paid for out of people's pensions. That amount of money was multiple times the amount that will be taken for water but it got no coverage. Fine Gael did say before the general election that we intended to do that which, again, Senator O'Brien has acknowledged on a number of occasions in the past. However, I am amazed and perplexed at how an amount of money several times more than that required for water can be taken per annum with no conversation whatsoever about it.

I also wish to raise the issue of the desecration of the grave of a former Taoiseach of this country, Mr. W.T. Cosgrave. Not alone was he Taoiseach, but his son was also a Taoiseach and his grandson was a Member of this Chamber, formerly Cathaoirleach, and also a Member of the Dáil. I cannot condemn this enough. It is disgusting and scandalous that anybody would do that to anybody's grave.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Michael D'Arcy (Fine Gael)
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Being a politician is somewhat irrelevant, but given that this man was one of the giants of 20th century Irish history, this act should be condemned in the most severe manner. It is a scandal for that to have happened and even worse, to some degree, on the same occasion that An Taoiseach, Deputy Enda Kenny, is launching a book about W.T. Cosgrave.

Jillian van Turnhout (Independent)
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The recent allegations of child abuse are not allegations at all, as they are very credible. I am concerned to hear Maíria Cahill talking about taking calls from other survivors and victims of abuse and that she is being put in this position. I ask the State to clarify where information should be brought. We all know it should be brought to the Child and Family Agency and to the Garda, but this question must be addressed, particularly in the context of abuse that has happened in the past, and what supports will be provided by the State to survivors of such abuse.

Yes, we need to talk about an inquiry, but we also need to talk about immediacy. We know when every one of these events happens that there are people who are hurting all over this State and who need to given clear direction in terms of where they should go.

Where is the stalled Children First Bill? It has been on Committee Stage in the Dáil for the past year. I am a member of the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children so I know it is not in the plan. We have an obligation to ensure we put the child protection code into our statutory system.

I wish to mention the forthcoming publication of the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences) Bill 2013, particularly in the context of initiatives that I have been working on since my appointment to the Seanad, such as tackling the proliferation of child abuse material, legislative guidance on the disclosure of children's confidential sexual assault counselling notes - it was promised in the House that this would be included in the Bill - and measures that might be taken to reduce the demand for human trafficking of adults and children. On the latter point, I commend the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Frances Fitzgerald, on her comments and the commitments she made at the EU Anti-Trafficking Day organised by the Immigrant Council of Ireland in the Mansion House last Friday. On that occasion she said she would examine very carefully the potential of legislation criminalising the purchase of sex. I particularly welcome her commitment in light of the Seanad motion that we, the Taoiseach's nominees, tabled back in October 2012 calling on the Government to criminalise the purchase of sex in Ireland in order to curb prostitution and trafficking. The same express recommendation was made by the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality in its comprehensive report on prostitution law in Ireland published in June 2013.

The general scheme of the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences) Bill was due to be published in January 2014, and more recently we have been told that it will be published in this session. I ask the Leader for clarification of when exactly the Bill will be published. Has the general scheme of the Bill been approved by Cabinet? Since I have come to this House I have been told that all the answers to my queries will be in the Bill, and I await its publication.

David Norris (Independent)
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I am surprised and disturbed that No. 1, on the appointment of the Equality Commission, will be taken without discussion, which seems to me to be a complete abrogation of the role of the Seanad.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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It is going to the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality and then coming back.

David Norris (Independent)
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That is not Seanad Éireann.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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Then it will come back here.

David Norris (Independent)
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Without discussion, again. That is what it said on the Order Paper I got.

Michael D'Arcy (Fine Gael)
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We do not know that.

David Norris (Independent)
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We should be discussing it, particularly in the light of the fact-----

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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It is a referral motion.

David Norris (Independent)
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It does not matter. We should be discussing it because these are very serious appointments. The Equality Commission was sabotaged by the previous Government with the able assistance of some of the people who are now being reappointed, including the gay one. We have an excellent new commissioner, Ms Emily Logan. We certainly should be discussing the matter. I look forward to taking up the Acting Leader's assertion that we will discuss it when it comes back. I certainly will not sit quietly if we are expected to take it without any discussion. We ought also to ask them to include, as the other side agreed with me when discussing this matter five or ten years ago, a provision whereby the Equality Commission is required to human-rights-proof or equality-proof Government legislation. That should be part of its remit.

With regard to the sexual offences Bill and this rubbish about Turn off the Red Light, which is being discussed in Northern Ireland, it is a very populist initiative, a good vote-getter and something the public like, but it does not reflect reality. A survey was conducted by Queen's University, Belfast, in advance of the discussion on prostitution and on criminalising the purchaser. The latter is a mad idea because one does not criminalise a sale, so that it perfectly legal to sell something but not legal to buy it. The university carried out a survey comprising 181 sex workers or prostitutes. Less than 1% said they were doing such work in an involuntary fashion. Less than 1% were doing that work involuntarily and 98% disagreed with its being criminalised. That is 98% of the people - mainly women - at the coalface. However, 80% of the public agreed, and that is why the initiative is so popular with colleagues who do not bother to think the issues out. This is absolutely ridiculous. Prostitution has never been got rid of - it is a permanent fact. We are only driving it underground and causing distress and danger to the people working in the area.

Finally, I will comment on Irish Water.

It is extraordinary that the company is talking about bonuses for a rotten worker. The company has 2,000 extra passenger workers, many of them carried over from the previous situation, and a whole load of people who are getting over €100,000. They are going to get their bonuses automatically. Here we are in Seanad Éireann getting €60,000 and complaining about it. People who are parachuted into the Seanad by the Taoiseach without as much as an election are producing legislation seeking to halve the income we get. When will we learn?

John Gilroy (Labour)
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I have spent many occasions on my feet in the House referring to mental health issues, including one area in particular, section 58 of the Mental Health Act. It allows for the non-consensual administration of electroconvulsive therapy to patients. This needs to be repealed urgently. The Minister of State has given some indication that she is disposed towards repealing it.

Section 58(2) of the same Act begins: "Where it is proposed to perform psycho-surgery on a patient..." Section 58(6) defines psycho-surgery: "In this section "psycho-surgery" means any surgical operation that destroys brain tissue or the functioning of brain tissue and which is performed for the purposes of ameliorating a mental disorder." It is absolutely obscene in this day and age that such a section exists in any statute. Psycho-surgery was discredited as a treatment for mental illness in the 1950s. I call on the acting leader to bring this part of the Mental Health Act to the attention of the Minister of State immediately with a view to repealing what I consider to be an absolutely barbaric section, as would any reasonable person.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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I join others in seeking an update on the Irish Water situation. In line with my party colleagues I call for the full suspension of water charges until such time as we have some clarity and until we see an end to type of headless chicken management that we became used to under the former Minister for Health, Deputy Reilly, and that we see from the Government and the management of Irish Water. Some of the examples are frightening. In one case I am aware of, which is similar to the situation in many older parts of cities and towns throughout the country, there is one access point and one meter beneath an old house and this is distributing to several properties on the street. Following an inquiry in recent days about how the situation could be rectified, Irish Water informed me that if I could send on €1,500 in advance, it would arrange for a contractor to come and then the contractor would invoice us for rectifying the situation.

We continue to have issues between landlords and tenants in respect of who is responsible and, in the event that the tenant does not pay, whether the landlord is liable and so on. We have a government in denial. Backbenchers are wringing their hands, as Senator O'Brien has rightly said.

It is clear that nobody at all has any business acumen. I will use a supermarket as an analogy. We have employed 100 managers, 100 administrative assistants and 100 directors before there is even a loaf of bread on the shelf, before there is even a recipe for baking the loaf of bread, before there is even a safe way to provide that loaf of bread, while expecting people to pay for it. The only logical and fair thing at this point is to suspend the operations of Irish Water until such time as we can stand over the infrastructure and the quality. Only then should we introduce a charge, based purely on ability to pay. It should not include those on social welfare or the less well-off.

This has not been a plan. It has been the high-profile exit strategy of the Commissioner-in-waiting, Phil Hogan. It has done little more than put a further dent in a Government that the people are continuing to lose confidence in. The reality is that those in government are completely detached from the needs of the people in the context of water and what they can afford. I second the amendment put forward by Senator O'Brien.

Catherine Noone (Fine Gael)
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I was delighted to hear this morning that Ireland has been named among the top five countries in the world to visit in 2015 by the Lonely Planetguide. The guide's annual lists have enormous influence in the travel industry and it is no exaggeration to say that when the Lonely Planettalks, the world listens. Aside from our stunning landscape, friendliness and incredible hospitality, the guide drew special attention to the Wild Atlantic Way, which was opened last year by the then Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Varadkar, saying it rivals California's Pacific Coast Highway and Australia's Great Ocean Road. This is a fantastic accolade and a testament to the savvy decision to invest €8 million in the route in last year's budget.
The guide went on to cite hospitality as one of Ireland's qualities. Although our people are undeniably our greatest asset, the retention of the 9% VAT rate and the abolition of the air travel tax undoubtedly contribute to Ireland's overall attractiveness. Today is a great day for Irish tourism and such a glowing recommendation by a globally-respected publication will no doubt result in a major boost to Ireland's already booming tourism industry.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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I wish to outline a formula for Senators. It is a scrambled egg with a little water. We all know one does not put water into scrambled eggs, but here goes: need improvement - 1.5% to 9% performance related payment with Irish Water; meets expectation - 2.75% to 14%; exceeds expectation - 4% to 17%; far exceeds expectation - 19%. There is need, meet, exceed and far exceed. I invite all Senators to tick the appropriate box in respect of their own jobs here.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Is the Senator seeking a debate on the issue?

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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My question, and all Senators should put the same question, is whether Irish Water is fit and has the ability to carry out the task of performance-related payment. It is not. The only people who are really competent to carry out that task are the Irish people, and they have decided "No", that there is no need, no meet, no exceed and no far exceed. The only time we should use words such as "exceed", "far exceed", "need" or "meet" in respect of Irish Water is with regard to the abject performance, incompetence,-----

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Do not confuse it any more, please.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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-----the undrinkable communication and the boiled up fantasy that it is doing a good job. The only job Irish Water is doing is bullying the Irish people into paying for incompetence. My 91 year old mother, a pensioner who has never made a comment in her life about having to pay bills, said to me when we were filling out the application that I could send in the application but she will not pay. When I asked her why she would not pay, she said: "No, because it is unfair and unjust." It is the first time in her 91 years, after 69 years of work, that I have heard her speak like that about the Irish State and about this particular monstrosity. This is all against a backdrop of a cataract of 40% of our clear, clean water gurgling, flowing and dripping down into the earth.

I consider the initiation, establishment and development of Irish Water to be pivotal to the Government's credibility of purpose. I do not wish to see the Government undermined by the Irish people because they cannot believe in or trust the credibility, validity and justice of Irish Water. The conglomeration and monstrosity that is Irish Water must be rectified and I call on the Minister to come to this House and tell us how he will do that. I hope a Senator will second that call.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Are you proposing an amendment to the Order of Business?

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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Yes.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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What is the amendment?

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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That the Minister come to the House and explain how he will rectify the monstrosity that is Irish Water. Will somebody second it?

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Yes, Senator Higgins will second it.

Lorraine Higgins (Labour)
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The Senator just agreed to.

I wish to raise the scandalous profit that was made on a site sold by the National Asset Management Agency, NAMA. It is 1-6 Sir John Rogerson's Quay in Dublin city centre. It was sold by the agency for €7.5 million in June 2013 and was then resold last August for €17.75 million. This undoubtedly calls into question NAMA's strategy of rapidly selling its property assets at grossly under-valued prices and ultimately at a significant loss to the Irish taxpayer. A 136% increase in the property price is not reflective of the bounce in the property market in Ireland and it requires further explanation.

NAMA's chief executive officer, Mr. Brendan McDonagh, has stated that the agency will sell up to €250 million worth of assets every three months. In view of the profits to be made by private investors at the expense of Irish taxpayers, this statement is most concerning.

I am aware of a court case being pursued by a US pension fund which alleges that prices were held down by private equity firms such as Blackstone and Carlyle, among others, that formed companies - with representatives from each private equity firm involved - and tried to buy companies or assets in various countries. The firms which are the subject of the US court case to which I refer were accused of agreeing not to compete for each other's exclusive deals and allocating transactions among themselves in order to keep purchase prices down. I understand that NAMA and IBRC have sold billions of euro worth of Irish assets to Blackstone and other private equity firms. In light of what has been revealed in recent days, I am extremely concerned that the best price is not being achieved for the taxpayer when NAMA is selling assets.

There is no doubt that leopards do not change their spots and to expect companies such as Blackstone and other private equity firms to conduct themselves any differently when buying assets in this country rather than the US would be foolhardy to say the least. Let us be clear: there is no practice in place whereby competitors are being eliminated from the auction process in order that assets might be acquired at lower prices.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Is the Senator seeking a debate on this issue?

Lorraine Higgins (Labour)
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That is why we need to engage in a debate with the Minister for Finance with regard to the transparency of loan sales relating to NAMA and on how that agency is conducting its deals.

Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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NAMA is-----

Lorraine Higgins (Labour)
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A 136% increase in the price obtained in respect of the resale of a particular site in Dublin is absolutely disgraceful.

Sean Barrett (Independent)
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On Sunday last, advice on how to operate economic policy in this country was given to this House and the Government by the chief executive officer of Ulster Bank and the man who was head of Permanent TSB between 2007 and 2012. Both of these individuals are opposed to the deposit and loan-to-income ratios which the Governor of the Central Bank has proposed. The British Government owns an 81% stake in Ulster Bank, which effectively bankrupted itself at one point.

The chief executive of Ulster Bank, Mr. Jim Brown, who previously appeared before the Joint Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, is a very personable man. However, we must ask the question as to how he turned it from being a source of major finance for industrial development in the Belfast area at the turn of the century, into a bankrupt entity. Permanent TSB was heavily criticised in the Nyberg report, which indicated that it had the highest ratio of loans to deposits in the country and that at one point it was lending out over 275% of its deposits. This was a recipe for bankruptcy and we were eventually obliged to bail out that bank. We should debate issues but advice from bankrupt bankers on how we should run the country must surely come at a pretty heavy discount.

On the same topic, last Friday the Central Bank named the members of an 13-person inquiry charged with examining the position in respect of alleged rogue banks. Irish Nationwide is named as one of the latter. This will be a useful exercise and I wish the committee charged with carrying out the inquiry well. One could say - similar to the allegation sometimes made in respect of buses in Dublin - that we have waited six years for a banking inquiry and now two have come along at once. The work of the inquiry to which I refer will complement that being carried out by the relevant Oireachtas committee. It must be remembered that the Central Bank played quite a central role in the financial crisis because it was not doing its job when the latter arose. The Central Bank should come clean with regard to what on earth it thought it was doing between 2000 and 2008 when it was supposed to be regulating the banking sector.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Sean Barrett (Independent)
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It is a case of the Central Bank adhering to the old adage "Physician heal thyself". The bank was supposed to be in charge but it managed to bungle matters in a most comprehensive way. I would like to hear its version of what went wrong in addition to the results of its investigation into other people.

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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I was extremely disappointed to hear about the desecration of the grave of W. T. Cosgrave last night.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Terrible.

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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I hope and pray that the perpetrators of this wanton act of vandalism will be brought to justice in the near future. I wonder about the mindset of these people and I am obliged to ask whether they have minds at all.

I was glad to read the article in today's Irish Independentstating that Ireland has been rated fifth in the top ten countries in the world to visit next year. This points to the attributes we have as a nation and the welcome we have for the visitor, and it augurs well for tourism next year and in the years to come.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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I want to support Senator van Turnhout's call for a debate on the Children First Bill, which, as she said, has been stalled on Committee Stage for some time. We supported that Bill when it was passing through this House and the Dáil on Second Stage. It is important it is completed because we need to have robust and fit-for-purpose systems and supports for victims of crime.

Senator van Turnhout raised it in the context of the Maria Cahill case, which is obviously now in the public domain. I wanted to take the opportunity to make a number of points in that regard. A Senator in this House asked me five minutes ago whether I would condemn what she perceived was a Sinn Féin cover-up of abuse. I resent that absolutely and completely. In fact, I find it offensive that anybody would believe that I or any member of my party would be involved in a cover-up of abuse.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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If anybody has any information in regard to an alleged cover-up then-----

John Gilroy (Labour)
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Gerry Adams might.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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-----there is a responsibility-----

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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There are loads of people-----

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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I thought the Senator was part of the new generation.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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You are all the one now.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Order, please.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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People can heckle and they can politicise this issue if they like-----

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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He is just trotting out the line his leader gave.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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People can heckle-----

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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I am entitled to make my contribution, with respect. I will make the point again that I find it offensive that people would allege that members of my party, including the leadership-----

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Not just members.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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-----that any member of Sinn Féin would be involved in a cover-up of abuse.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Does that include Gerry Adams?

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator's leader was involved in a cover-up.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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If they have any proof, or if any individual has any proof, they should bring it to the relevant authorities.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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We have. She is a woman called Maíria Cahill. She is a real person called Maíria Cahill.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator Cullinane, without interruption. Has the Senator a question for the Leader?

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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I have, but I find it disgusting that there are people who would politicise an issue such as this. I will finish on this point because I think it is-----

Michael D'Arcy (Fine Gael)
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On a point of order, every speaker to date in this debate has tried to stay away from politicising this, except Senator Cullinane.

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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That is not the case at all. Look at what the Senator's party leader has said.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Has Senator Cullinane a question for the Leader?

David Cullinane (Sinn Fein)
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My question is to the Deputy Leader of the House. Can she arrange for a debate on this because what that Bill does is to set out very clearly the limitations of public representatives in what they can and cannot do in instances like this. It also sets out the responsibilities, which are to give support to victims, to make sure they go to the proper authorities and that the systems in place are robust enough to be able to give those supports to victims, which is what the Bill is about.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Incredible.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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On 21 November 2012, I introduced the Employment Equality (Amendment)(No. 2) Bill 2012 to the House. The purpose of my Bill was to ensure that people cannot be discriminated against in the workplace on grounds of age. At the time we mentioned that we have many progressive legislative measures to ensure people in the workplace are not discriminated against on grounds of gender, race or sexual orientation. However, a blind eye has been turned to this far more prevalent form of discrimination. My Bill was seconded by Senator Crown and received wide support across the House. Many Senators, from both sides, spoke on the issue and supported the Bill in principle.

On 1 April 2014, Deputy Anne Ferris introduced the Employment Equality (Abolition of Mandatory Retirement Age) Bill 2014. Her Bill, which in principle supports my Bill, proposed: "That leave be granted to introduce a Bill entitled an Act to amend the Employment Equality Act 1998 and to provide for related matters." The Bill proposes to amend the Employment Equality Act 1998 and to abolish compulsory retirement ages for persons willing and able to continue with the job in which they are employed. When does the Deputy Leader believe this Bill will be taken on Second Stage? It appears that we have a form of lottery which decides at random which Private Members' Bills shall be selected. This is no way to treat such a serious Bill. I feel positive the Deputy Leader will push this Bill forward.

Michael Mullins (Fine Gael)
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I strongly support Senator D'Arcy in his call for a debate with the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Fitzgerald, on new penalties and sanctions for those involved in cattle rustling. This activity is a new low in criminality. A pattern appears to be emerging in this regard. The stealing of cattle, sheep and other livestock would not be happening unless there was an outlet for them and I believe illegal abattoirs are also emerging in certain parts of the country. This crime may be linked in some way to that of petrol stretching and other illegal cross-Border activities. We need an open and forthright debate with the Minister in regard to this emerging criminal activity.

In regard to Irish Water, it must be made to work. While major issues must be sorted out, the company and concept of Irish Water must be made work in the interest of fixing a broken system. The system is broken because of 20 or more years of under investment in our water system. Last week, Senator Leyden mentioned the situation in Roscommon. I would like to offer him some good news, namely, that due to a significant investment made by the Government recently in water treatment plants in County Roscommon, the "boil water" notices will, hopefully, be lifted within the next couple of months and the situation will be rectified for once and for all.

I met some constituents over the past weekend who asked why I do not stand up in the Seanad and inform Members that people in rural areas in County Galway have been paying for their water for the past 30 years and are happy to do so in order to have a safe, reliable water supply at the right price. I believe there is an issue of equity in regard to water. Why should people in rural Ireland pay for their water, but people in large cities and towns get off scot free? There is a balance to be struck, but we need a system that works and is fair. We certainly need to sort out the issue of bonus payments for people who are paid to do a job well. Bonuses should not be part of the equation.

Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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We have had much discussion about Irish Water and debates on wind farms and renewable energy in the House. One issue connects both, which is that end users, who are ordinary people, are constantly being saddled with extra and unnecessary expense in order to cushion various vested interests. Whether it is to do with the preservation of excessive jobs in Irish Water, the payment of unimaginable bonuses or unnecessary extra costs paid to consultants and contractors, ordinary people are expected to pick up the tab constantly. We see it with electricity also, and I ask the Deputy Leader to organise a debate on electricity prices in the context of the 50% increase in the public service obligation, or PSO, charge brought about by the Commissioner for Energy Regulation, which is to be levied on every electricity bill. Despite the fact that wholesale energy prices have fallen internationally due to cheap coal, lower oil prices and increased extraction of shale gas, struggling Irish families are being hit with an annual hike in the PSO from €48.62 to €73.06, including VAT, from 1 October. We must have a debate about what the Society of St. Vincent de Paul is calling a regressive tax that will place an extra financial burden on vulnerable people. It comes on top of a multitude of increased costs. The PSO is in effect a green tax on electricity, the proceeds of which will be used to subsidise wind farm operators who receive €94 million a year in compensation to keep them in business as the price of energy falls. We must look at how unprepared we have been as a country and at how our Governments have failed to plan adequately for the transfer from fossil fuels to renewable energy. I ask for a debate on the issue. It looks likely that Poland will veto resolutions on carbon reductions at EU level.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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The Senator can make those points in the debate.

Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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Will ordinary Irish people end up paying extra for a policy that is proving to be unworkable? I call for a debate on that.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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It is an honour and a pleasure to second Senator Mary-Louise O'Donnell's amendment to the Order of Business.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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I thank the Senator.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I am glad to be associated with it.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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The Senator is not necessarily my preferred choice, but he is here.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Any port in a storm, my dear.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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I will attribute that to the Senator.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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You should be grateful for small mercies.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Speak through the Chair, Senator Leyden.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator made a very convoluted speech which I found hard to understand, but besides that.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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Convoluted or well written?

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Well written but convoluted.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Does the Senator have a question for the Deputy Leader?

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I am delighted that Senator Mullins has taken an interest in the Roscommon-Galway constituency, where he looks like a potential candidate. He will have to resolve the water issue long before he dips his toe in that water.

Michael Mullins (Fine Gael)
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We will have it ready for the Senator by February.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Mullins will have great difficulty getting a seat in that constituency on the next occasion, given the poll he received the last time. The construction of Irish Water shows the ineptitude of the Government. I look back at Charlie Haughey, who, as Taoiseach, established the IFSC, which currently employs 50,000 people.

John Gilroy (Labour)
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The good old days when Charles Haughey was Taoiseach.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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He had the ability to set up a company and make it work. The Government is unable to establish a company and make it work. That is obvious from what it has done to what was a successful water system in most parts of the country. One would think this water scheme had just been invented and that there had been no pipes in place for the last number of years. This particular tax is regarded as a poll tax. Senator O'Donnell's mother is a very wise woman, but I am surprised to hear that the Senator was filling in her form if she is not going to pay. It was an unnecessary exercise.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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She is a very qualitative citizen.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Does Senator Leyden have a question?

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I have not filled in any form as yet. It is likely, with 1 million people not filling in the forms, that others will be encouraged to do likewise. There seems to be a revolution in the Labour Party and many may vote for a wise Fianna Fáil motion being debated in the other House recommending that the whole process be suspended for six months to a year to resolve all the teething issues before coming back with a proper approach.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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The Senator is way over his time.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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We opposed the Water Services Act on this side of the House and are delighted that we did so. The question of paying bonuses to people who are not doing their jobs was the subject of great interest for every member of the public I met at the weekend----

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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The Senator can make these points during the debate.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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Senator Terry Leyden is becoming as convoluted as he accused me of being.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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When are we going to have the debate?

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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There is a proposal for a debate on the matter.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Are you acceding to the request that we have a debate on it? I am delighted and hope the House will now actually accept the very wise proposal made.

Fidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael)
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Listening to the debates over the weekend, two words struck me: "hypocrisy" and "cover-up". On the hypocrisy of the leader of Sinn Féin, Deputy Gerry Adams, it took the courage of a young woman, Mairía Cahill, who had been violated to finally get an admission from him that there was the practice of having kangaroo courts within the Republican movement, which was a second abuse, on top of the horrendous violation of a young woman. I was the Senator who approached Senator David Cullinane to ask if he, as a Member of this House, and other Sinn Féin Members would be condemning this practice. Instead we heard him say that if there was any proof, it should be shown to him. Where are we going? Are we growing new, little versions of Gerry Adams in this House?

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Does the Senator have a question for the Deputy Leader?

Fidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael)
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What I am looking for is less hypocrisy and more truth.

I was also struck by the hypocrisy of the Government and members of the Government parties in the cover-up about Irish Water. Let us call a spade a spade. Irish Water is not perfect, but Members of the House on the Government side and Government Members in the Dáil put Irish Water in place. The legislation was approved in this House, despite the objections of many on this side. I did not vote it because I did not know what the cost would be; I saw it as a second form of tax and we did not know for what the first billion we would pay in taxes would be used, while we received no answers on the question of bonuses. I received an answer from Irish Water in March this year, that X% of salaries was being held back and that only if staff performed would they receive a bonus. Now the Government is reeling it out as if it was a bonus on top of a salary. We have had nothing but hypocrisy and a cover-up. One million people are not wrong and they are right not to sign until we have received the truth, have accuracy and fairness. I absolutely support Senator Marie-Louise O'Donnell's call to have the senior Minister in the House to discuss Irish Water.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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The Senator is way over time.

Fidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael)
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We must have fairness on the issue.

Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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I, too, call for a suspension of the operation of Irish Water. We have seen the Government ignore the reports of its own consultants, PricewaterhouseCoopers, who told it not to establish Irish Water in the way it did. Now it is giving out about the fact that it is not working, even though it was told that it would not work in the first place. I do not know why it is crying because in 2009 Fine Gael policy was to establish Irish Water; therefore, they it has been dealing with this issue a long time. Last week the Government parties were borrowing money to buy votes to win an election. What they have done in the case of Irish Water is borrow money to establish it, although it will end up losing them votes and an election. They seem to be out of touch; their own Ministers were saying people would be charged a modest amount of money. When one is being charged over €180 for the first hour of a call-out to plug a leak and hundreds of euros annually, it is not by any standard a modest amount of money for people who are struggling and who, in many cases, only have €10 at the end of the month for discretionary spending. They keep on squeezing those in the middle with families who are struggling with mortgages and are now going to be struggling with water bills from a quango that they set up.

The Government was told not to set up this quango but it did so anyway. Now it is crying that it is in existence even though in 2009 the establishment of Irish Water was in a Fine Gael policy paper.

Members opposite have given out about NAMA, the National Asset Management Agency, and its lack of transparency. I remind them that Fianna Fáil brought in the NAMA transparency Bill-----

Lorraine Higgins (Labour)
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Who brought in NAMA in the first place? Fianna Fáil brought in NAMA. Those are double standards, Senator Daly.

Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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-----but Members opposite shot it down.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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The Government is now spending the fruits of it.

Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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They wonder why NAMA is not transparent yet they did not want to introduce a measure that would make it transparent.

John Gilroy (Labour)
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Fianna Fáil could have done so when it was in government but it did not.

Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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Our legislation would have ensured any NAMA property for sale would be put on a website and be available for all to see. This reaction from Members opposite is a bit like crying over Irish Water.

I agree with colleagues opposite who raised the issue of the recent desecration of the grave of W.T. Cosgrave. It is a disgrace that anyone would do this to a former leader and person who served this country. Although we disagree with much of what happened in the past, I agree with colleagues opposite that the desecration of his grave is an absolute disgrace.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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While I agree with Senator Marie-Louise O'Donnell’s amendment to the Order of Business, I am calling for a special debate on the North of Ireland. The situation there is in crisis mode. Sinn Féin and the DUP, Democratic Unionist Party, are singularly incapable of governing in the North and do not seem to want to govern. The Irish Government is also allowing the British Government and the parties in the North to direct affairs and be involved in talks, playing a backroom role itself. A recent statement from Theresa Villiers, the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, referred to the subsidiary role of the Irish Republic in the talks in the North. This is a breach of the practice and agreements over the past several years.

Fine Gael and the Labour Party do not have an instinctive appreciation of the relationships which helped bring about the peaceful situation in Northern Ireland. I also do not believe Sinn Féin and the DUP are capable of governing in the North without some serious input from the Irish Government. I am calling for a debate on this.

I am also calling on the Deputy Leader to ask the Government to take much more of a role in the North of Ireland. Deputy Eamon Gilmore, when Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, took a disgracefully side-line approach to the North.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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That is unfair.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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It is a fact. The current Minister, Deputy Charles Flanagan, is slightly more involved. He needs to get in there, however, representing this country and the people of Northern Ireland who are misgoverned by the Sinn Féin and DUP governing arrangement.

Ned O'Sullivan (Fianna Fail)
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I second Senator Thomas Byrne’s amendment to the Order of Business.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator Byrne, was that an amendment?

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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It was not actually. I called for a debate.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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I am happy to support that call for a debate.

Ned O'Sullivan (Fianna Fail)
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I support his call for a debate on Northern Ireland. I am glad he raised this issue because it has concerned me, as well the general public, for quite some time. With all due deference to my colleagues, Senators Mary White and Mark Daly, among others, doing great work on the Good Friday Agreement committee, we are sleepwalking through the situation in Northern Ireland. I have been following the North closely and believe it is a very fragile situation there. It is far more serious than we think. Although the focus is rightly on the terrible incident involving Ms Cahill, for which I hope she will get full justice, there is a dysfunction in governing there. Whatever about the Government here, we can have our rows and ructions between Fine Gael and Labour but they will still work together in some shape or form for what they believe is the good of the country. The two parties in the North in government cannot even look at each other.

This peace process is not finished. The actual term “peace process” has become totally devalued and we need to forget it. We need to have a fresh look at it with a new impetus from the Taoiseach, Deputy Enda Kenny. It is the one area in which he is not particularly proactive. It is important the Taoiseach of the day should give leadership. All taoisigh, going right back to W.T. Cosgrave, have shown leadership on the North. I was very shocked to hear W.T. Cosgrave’s grave was desecrated. It is an absolute disgrace because he and his family have given tremendous service to this country.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Ned O'Sullivan (Fianna Fail)
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The Commission for Energy Regulation is before the environment committee today on water tariff principles and proposals.

The Government has made a hames of Irish Water. I met a number of the workers who are installing water meters over the weekend. They are not getting bonuses, nor did they draw up this crazy scheme. They are paid to install meters and have thus far installed 450,000 of them in extremely difficult circumstances in certain areas. As usual, the man with the shovel is getting it in the neck, although he is not responsible for what has taken place. He is earning his wages and should be respected.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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Senator Darragh O'Brien first raised the issue of Irish Water, which was discussed this morning when the Cabinet considered an update on issues related to Irish Water. The Government has recognised, as Ministers have been stating for some time, that it must do more to ensure there is full public understanding of the reasons for the establishment of Irish Water and full public trust in all aspects of the implementation of that decision. All of these issues are being carefully considered by the Government, working with Ervia, as Bord Gáis is now known, and Irish Water as a matter of priority. The Fianna Fáil Party signed up to water charges in the memorandum of understanding.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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That is not true.

John Gilroy (Labour)
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It was only three years ago.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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On a point of order, the Fianna Fáil Party, led by Deputy Martin, staged a walk-out from Dáil Éireann on the day Fine Gael and the Labour Party passed the relevant legislation. The entire Opposition took part in the walk-out.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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That is not a point of order.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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If I am allowed to continue, I would like to provide my colleagues with the full context. To set this matter in context, as some Opposition Senators acknowledged, the House had a full debate on the Water Services Act.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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The Dáil did not have a full debate on the legislation.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Please allow Senator Bacik to reply to the questions asked from the floor.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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I agree that the other House should have given more time to the Bill. The Seanad, however, was careful to give plenty of time to the debate and I am glad we did so.

The Government has affirmed its support for the establishment of Irish Water as a long-term strategic investment. We are conscious that Ireland is the only OECD country without water charges.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy Leader should be sure to read that out correctly.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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Water is a vital natural resource and the vast majority of people agree on the need to ensure-----

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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The Government wants to throw John Tierney under a bus.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Please allow the Deputy Leader to continue without interruption.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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The Senators opposite clearly do not want to hear what the Government is proposing to do about Irish Water.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senators must allow the Deputy Leader an opportunity to reply.

Fidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael)
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She should stick to the facts, rather than being unnecessarily provocative. Irish Water is a mess.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator Healy Eames should show some respect to the House by allowing the Deputy Leader to make her contribution without interruption.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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The Government has reaffirmed its commitment, which was set out clearly in the legislation, that Irish Water, as a public company, will not be privatised. It is important that people are aware of that.

The metering programme is ahead of target and progress has been made on the roll-out of domestic metering. Senators are aware of the free allowances and water subsidy for social welfare recipients.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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One visit to the toilet per day and one shower per week - that is the free allowance.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Please allow the Deputy Leader a chance to continue.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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An income tax rebate of up to €100 per household was announced in the budget.

Notwithstanding these measures, the Government recognises there is significant and legitimate public concern about aspects of the roll-out of Irish Water. Many of the issues of concern are being addressed by the board and management of Ervia and Irish Water in the first instance. The board of Irish Water will expire in November and the Cabinet has stated that future decisions on governance arrangements at the company will be made in the coming weeks.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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It may still throw the members of the board under a bus.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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As several of the commentators who have been fair on this issue have pointed out, we lose 41% of water through leakage. The water system is not working because of decades of under-investment by the Fianna Fáil Party and other parties in government.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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The money was spent on administration.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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I am not singling out any particular Government but there was under-investment in water throughout the boom years.

Mark Daly (Fianna Fail)
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A bonus culture will fix the leaks. Is that the answer?

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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We have boil water notices in County Roscommon and elsewhere and shortages of water in Dublin. The system is not working. It is fragmented and inefficient and was under the management of 34 different local authorities.

It is important that we have a public utility to seek a more efficient and a better infrastructure for water.

On the issue of pay structures within Irish Water, the Cabinet said Irish Water is a commercial State company, a public company, set up by Bord Gáis.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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I thought the Senator said a public company.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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Yes, a public company.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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Public but bonuses.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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In the model of others such as Bord Gáis. Senator MacSharry should be aware of what we mean by a public company.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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Public but bonuses.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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Is the Deputy Leader supporting the bonus culture in Irish Water?

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Will the Senator allow Senator Bacik to reply?

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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Is she supporting the bonus culture?

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Will the Senator please allow her to reply?

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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These are questions to which the public want answers.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Will the Senator please allow her to reply?

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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Senator Darragh O'Brien did not seek a debate on Irish Water today but Senator O'Donnell did. I have submitted a request to have the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Alan Kelly, come to the House and I am awaiting a response. I would be happy to have the debate today or tomorrow.

John Gilroy (Labour)
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Now they are worried.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Please allow Senator Bacik to reply to the questions raised. Senator D'Arcy please.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator D'Arcy, please.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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I am simply trying to give a fair response.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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I am trying to get order for the Senator. Please allow the Senator Bacik to make her response.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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On foot of Senator O'Donnell's request I have submitted a request to the Minister's office to have him come to the House and I am awaiting a response. As Senator Ned O'Sullivan acknowledged, as we speak the Commission for Energy Regulation is appearing before the Joint Committee on Environment, Culture and the Gaeltacht on the issue of charges, in particular. That is a huge issue. It is the uncertainty about the money that is causing people enormous concern, and rightly so. At the end of my response I may have an answer for Senator O'Donnell.

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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I thank the Senator.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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I ask the Senator to hold off until I know. If I can I will have him in the House today and, if not, tomorrow.

Senator Darragh O'Brien also raised the issue of sex abuse and the recent public concerns around Maíria Cahill and her assertions, comments and statements on what happened to her and the cover up of the abuse she had suffered by senior figures in Sinn Féin-IRA. Like others I want to be sensitive about this. Senators O'Brien and van Turnhout were sensitive in their contributions on this matter. It is unfortunate that Senator Cullinane responded in such an aggressive manner in politicising it. I want to be fair. I was on "Prime Time" last night on the issue. I spoke passionately about it and as a practitioner I have represented Survivors of Abuse before the redress board. I know how much it costs people to come forward and make these disclosures and then to be treated in a way that is distrustful or disrespectful is appalling in any institution or in any position of power.

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Hear, hear.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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That is a general comment on this issue. I am glad to note that the DPP in Northern Ireland has announced a review of the case - that is important - and of any other cases that may arise. Certainly Maíria Cahill in her brave and courageous comments has said there will be others. The Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Joan Burton, has already met Maíria Cahill and others, including Deputy Micheál Martin, have also met her. I am aware the Taoiseach is to meet her this week. Senator Darragh O'Brien asked about the Government response. If the DPP's review in Northern Ireland uncovers issues that have arisen in this jurisdiction, clearly we need to ensure those are investigated here. We might await what further Government response comes forward.

Senator Darragh O'Brien also asked about the Shannon Airport scheme. I have corresponded with many of the individuals who are deeply concerned about the effect. I am aware there are ongoing issues in respect of that matter. On the question of whether there will be amendments to the social welfare Bill, I do not know. I cannot accept the amendment today but I am happy to make further inquiries for the Senator, as I have done already in seeking to respond to those who have corresponded with me on the issue.

Senator Michael D'Arcy raised the issue of cover-ups of child abuse, particularly in the diocese of Ferns. He is right about that. We have seen this happen in other institutions too. He also raised the issue of Irish Water, which I have dealt with, and an issue I had not been aware of, namely, the desecration of W.T. Cosgrave's grave in Inchicore. I am concerned to hear that and, like others, we should all condemn it. I am glad it was condemned from the other side of the House also because the desecration of any grave is an appalling act of vandalism.

Senator van Turnhout raised in a very sensitive manner the concerns about the Maíria Cahill case and asked who people in this jurisdiction should contact. Clearly, Túsla and the Garda would be the appropriate authorities here; and the PSNI and the child support services in Northern Ireland.

I am told that the Children First Bill is still awaiting Committee Stage in the Dáil. I will make inquiries as to whether we can bring that forward, but clearly it cannot come to this House until it has been through the Dáil.
Like Senator van Turnhout, I am concerned to see the criminal law (sex offences) Bill coming forward. I know the Attorney General is looking at a number of outstanding issues but it is a priority Bill for publication. I understand that it is planned to publish it before Christmas. There are a number of issues in that legislation that are or particular interest to many of us in this House, including the issue of criminalising the purchase of sex.
Senator Norris has also raised this issue and disagreed fundamentally with Senator van Turnhout. I would disagree with Senator Norris and wish to put that on the record. I am a supporter of the "Turn Off the Red Light" campaign. I urge Senator Norris or anyone else who has a concern about the proposed criminalisation of purchasing sex to examine the report of the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality, which was adopted unanimously with cross-party support. The committee's report supported and recommended the introduction of new legislation criminalising the purchase of sex in line with the Swedish approach which many of us saw in practice and were impressed by - notwithstanding any survey done by Queen's University, of which I am aware.
Senator Gilroy referred to section 58 of the Mental Health Act. I know the Senator has a long track record of raising mental health issues. I also know that particular provision was controversial in the lifetime of the last Seanad. As the Senator knows, attempts were made to deal with this matter. On 12 November, there will be a debate in this House on suicide and mental health issues. We might try to have a concerted effort to raise that specific issue then as well as raising it directly with the Minister.
Senator MacSharry referred to water charges and I have dealt with the Irish Water issue.
Senator Noone welcomed the announcement by the Lonely Planetguide that Ireland is in the top five destinations to visit in 2015. She specifically mentioned the Wild Atlantic Way and I agree with her that it is a huge boost to the Irish tourism industry to have that sort of endorsement from Lonely Planet. It is hugely welcome. The policy to retain the 9% VAT rate and the development of the Wild Atlantic Way have provided a major boost to tourism and have contributed to the great increase in visitor numbers, which we all welcome.
Senator O'Donnell referred to Irish Water and I have already responded to that issue, as well as the amendment to the Order of Business. I will await her response.
Senator Higgins referred to the sale of a NAMA site on Sir John Rogerson's Quay. There is a comment about this in the Irish Independent today, which I read with concern. I would be happy to seek a debate with the Minister for Finance on current NAMA strategy, which would be useful. It may also be a matter for the Joint Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform if it has not already had NAMA representatives in on that same issue.
Senator Barrett raised banking issues, including some interesting points on Ulster Bank. In particular, he looked at the Central Bank's announcement of its inquiry into rogue banks. He said there were two banking inquiries at once after we have been waiting for so long and asked who would investigate the Central Bank.

Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)
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Three.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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I suppose the Oireachtas banking inquiry, of which Senator Barrett and others are members, will be the appropriate body to investigate the role of the Central Bank and any failings in its regulation or lack of regulation in the past. We all await that strand of the banking inquiry's investigations with anticipation.
Senator Brennan mentioned the vandalising of the grave of W.T. Cosgrave and I agree with him in that regard. He also welcomed the Lonely Planetannouncement.
I have already commented on Senator Cullinane's contribution. I was disappointed, however, to hear such an aggressive approach being taken on this sensitive issue. It is important that we would be sensitive in our treatment of this issue. It does appear that there has been a cover-up and I think most people would agree with that.
Senator Jim D'Arcy raised the issue of cattle and sheep rustling, which is not a new crime. In fact, it was a widespread crime in Ireland in the 19th century. I entirely agree with him that it is a serious criminal matter and I will be happy to seek a debate with the appropriate Minister. He suggested contacting the Minister for Justice and Equality with a view to re-examining penalties for rustling. Of course, it is already a criminal offence under the Criminal Justice (Theft and Fraud Offences) Act, but I think the Senator's idea is to create some sort of specific offence. We will ask for the Minister to attend the House for such a debate. It might also be a matter for the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine. It seems to me that it is more of a policing issue, however, so that may be the appropriate view to take on it, rather than looking at a new offence.
Senator White raised her 2012 Bill on the compulsory retirement age and age discrimination. Like Senator White I was delighted to see Deputy Anne Ferris introducing a similar Bill in the Dáil. As the Senator said, there is lottery system in the Dáil which means that Deputy Ferris's Bill cannot be guaranteed a hearing. If I may say so, I think we have a much better system, through Private Members' time, of allocating time for Bills in the Seanad. I hope we can move forward with Senator White's Bill if Deputy Ferris's one does not get time in the Dáil.

On that note, I also commend Senator White on introducing her Bill on parental leave. Trinity College is organising a talk on parental and paternity leave tonight and I will be chairing it. The talk will contrast the approach in Ireland to the superior approach in Sweden. The Minister, Deputy Fitzgerald, made positive comments on this matter and we will all work together on it.

Senator Mullins raised the issue of cattle rustling and called for the Minister for Justice and Equality to come before the House. The Senator pointed out that Irish Water is seeking to fix a system broken through decades of under-investment and he raised issues regarding County Roscommon in this regard. He made the point that in many rural areas people are used to paying for water - this raises issues of equity as those in urban areas may not be used to such payment.

Senator Mullen raised the issues of Irish Water and wind farms, calling for a general debate on energy pricing and security. I think this would be a useful debate in anticipation of a climate change Bill.

Senator Leyden also referred to Irish Water but I must confess I lost track of his contribution when he spoke of a revolution in the Labour Party of which I am not aware.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy Leader is yet to be informed.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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It must be terrible not to be informed of an ongoing revolution - Senator Leyden was involved in the creation of the HSE so he would know about such matters.

Senator Healy Eames raised the issue of Ms Maíria Cahill. I have already addressed this and expressed concerns regarding the cover-up, how she was treated and the need for sensitivity when dealing with survivors of sexual abuse because it is very difficult to come forward and disclose such incidents. We know now that it can take years for a person to come forward and it can be very hard to go through the legal process.

The Senator also raised the suggestion of Government hypocrisy on the issue of Irish Water. As others have noted, Senator Healy Eames campaigned for the 2011 general election on the back of the NewERA document.

Fidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael)
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On a point of information, I am referring to the debate in this House on Irish Water.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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There is no such thing as a point of information and I ask the Senator to resume her seat.

Fidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael)
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I supported water charges but the way they have been rolled out is wrong.

Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator was an Independent.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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I ask the Senator to resume her seat.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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We did have a full debate in this House on the water services legislation.

Fidelma Healy Eames (Fine Gael)
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We did not get answers.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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The Members of the House are being very hard on Senator Bacik.

Ivana Bacik (Independent)
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There was a far better approach taken to the debate in the Seanad than to the debate in the Dáil.

Senator Daly spoke of water charges and NAMA and I responded. The Senator also spoke of the desecration of the grave of William T. Cosgrave and I appreciate his comments as it is important that we all condemn the desecration of any grave but particularly that of a person who played such a prominent role in Irish history and politics.

Senator Byrne referred to water charges and Northern Ireland. I think he has raised a very important issue on Northern Ireland and I will seek a debate on this because he is correct that there is a crisis of governance there at the moment. Senator Barrett recently raised in this House the need for vigilance to ensure we do not sleepwalk further into crisis. We must take proactive steps but I disagree with Senator Byrne on the approach taken by the Government. I think the Government has made strong interventions but it would be useful to hear in this House what is going on. Senator O'Sullivan also sought a debate on the North and I am happy to seek this. It would be useful to hear from colleagues on the Oireachtas Joint Committee on the Implementation of the Good Friday Agreement. I served on that committee during the last term of this House and I would like to know how the members see issues in the North. The Minister must come before the House on this issue.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator Darragh O'Brien has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business, "That a debate with the Minister for Social Protection on the changes made to pensions under the State Airports (Shannon Group) Act 2014 be taken today." Is the amendment being pressed?

Darragh O'Brien (Fianna Fail)
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Yes.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Senator Marie-Louise O'Donnell also proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That a debate with the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government to allow him to outline how he proposes to rectify the problems associated with Irish Water be taken today." Is the amendment being pressed?

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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No, not today, but I will press it tomorrow.

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Why not press it now?

Marie Louise O'Donnell (Independent)
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No.