Seanad debates
Thursday, 6 March 2008
Order of Business
10:30 am
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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The Order of Business is No. 1, motion re Diseases of Animals Act, back from committee, to be taken without debate at the conclusion of the Order of Business; No 2, Social Welfare and Pensions Bill 2008, Committee and Remaining Stages, to be taken at the conclusion of No. 1 and to adjourn not later than 1 p.m. if not previously concluded and to resume at the conclusion of No. 18 if not previously concluded; No. 3 early signature motion re Social Welfare and Pensions Bill 2008 to be taken at the conclusion of No. 2; and No. 18, all-party motion No. 34, re cluster munitions, Senators may speak for seven minutes and may share time with agreement of the House.
Frances Fitzgerald (Fine Gael)
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Yesterday, I spoke about the reviews being done into the incidents in Portlaoise and asked for time in the House to discuss them. Having seen and read the reports and seen the commentary on them today, I am certain this House needs to spend time as soon as possible discussing them and analysing their implications for the Minister for Health and Children and the HSE and for how our health services are run.
These are extraordinary reports. John Fitzgerald's report, which is an investigation into the crisis in Portlaoise, shows how the HSE acted. If this is how it behaves in a crisis how does the system work the rest of the time? The report states clear communication problems exist within the HSE. Too many people are doing too many jobs and do not know what are other peoples' jobs. There is confusion and uncertainty about roles with a lack of authority and responsibility.
The Minister and the Department of Health and Children are ghost-like figures. Their roles are completely unclear as is whether they have any impact. The report does not find anyone responsible for anything which happened and speaks about a systems failure. There is no such thing as a systems failure. Somebody somewhere is responsible.
I reiterate the point I made yesterday that we must discuss this as a priority. For this House to be seen as relevant, these reports should be discussed here next week and I hope the Leader can arrange this. In any other country, these reports would be a resigning matter for somebody somewhere. They are not in this country and business goes on as usual. The very least we can do is discuss it here.
I also wish to raise a point made today on transport. The Government was re-elected because it told the people it could successfully manage the economy and various projects. The lie of this is shown today in reports on Transport 21 and the delivery of projects. Again and again, we see projects delayed.
Frances Fitzgerald (Fine Gael)
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The join-up of the Luas, due to open in 2008, does not have a completion date. The Luas extension from Connolly Station to the docklands is delayed by another year. The Luas Tallaght to Citywest route has been delayed from 2008 to 2010 at least. The Cork to Midleton commuter rail line has been delayed from this year to 2009. Portlaoise train depot, which was due to open last year, is still not opened. The completion of the M3 motorway has been put back from 2009 to 2010. It goes on. The metro from the city centre to Dublin Airport has been put back from 2012 to 2013 and this probably underestimates the time.
Who manages the economy and infrastructure development? Why are there no targets or proper deadlines? It exposes the lie that the Government can manage the country and projects well. Commuters in Dublin pay the price every day for this mismanagement.
Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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I also wish to refer to the Portlaoise report. Looking at it from a disinterested point of view in terms of trying to take the patient and emotion out of it, extraordinary questions must be asked on both sides of the House about the process. This is not a matter solely for the Opposition benches. I do not want to make this into a political issue. However, I want to know how the risk register was applied to Portlaoise hospital. What was supposed to be happening there and what was not? What were the key performance indicators required for that area? I want to know if people's bonuses was tied into it. Were there mid-year reviews? How could it happen that people were using out-of-date equipment? Management must take responsibility for that. Someone in management was aware and decided to use out-of-date equipment. We need to know why and who these people are.
I am interested in the Portlaoise case not because it has been dealt with badly but because I want to know about the rest of the system and how it is run. Can we have a discussion on how the health system is run, without referring to any particular hospital, as if we were a board of directors getting a clear description of how it does its business?
In any small operation in the public service — I am involved in several semi-State bodies — at every board meeting there is an outline of which checks and balances were applied every quarter. An outside auditor is brought in to verify the system. Fail-safe measures in the system are tested to check if they are sufficiently robust and flexible.
These are expected in ordinary operations but it does not seem to be happening in the health service. I am not having a go at the Government or advisers. I just want to know what they are doing. The recent higher remuneration report assessed a particular management group in the Health Service Executive and admitted it did not know what they were doing. That cannot be in anyone's interests. I want a debate on this to ensure moneys are spent properly.
Many commuters living in Dublin and the surrounding counties would be delighted not to have to drive into Dublin city and use park-and-ride facilities instead. However, there are no such facilities on the city's north side, the M1, M2, M3, M4 or M7. People are forced either to drive into the city or leave their cars at pubs and hotels in the outlying areas. Providing park-and-ride facilities is one small thing we could do. The commitment to provide more buses and regular rail routes needs to be re-examined. I accept Iarnród Éireann has significantly improved many routes but much more can be done.
In 2006 the House passed the Planning and Development (Strategic Infrastructure) Act. The proposals made last October for re-opening of the Navan rail line got full clearance last week owing to this legislation. We need to see more of that.
Alex White (Labour)
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On a day when several Ministers are attending a conference on practical transport initiatives to tackle climate change, it is extraordinary that not one of the flagship transport projects referred to by Senators O'Toole and Fitzgerald will be delivered on time. During the debates in the House on the economy and public infrastructure, we must sit through Ministers listing off initiatives and projects, allegedly under way, and the price tag to go with them.
Today's newspapers contain lists of flagship infrastructure projects, essential for the economy and of social benefit to communities, which the Minister for Transport acknowledges will not be delivered on time. He made the extraordinary admission that he was not concerned about the slippage on the project timelines, proclaiming the times given were indicative dates.
Why does the Government give indicative dates if they are not to be taken seriously? Is this a signal to the people that when an indicative date is given for any project, it should be ignored as it counts for nothing? The Minister claims he, like many others, spends two hours every day travelling in the car to Dublin, as if that would make us all feel okay and he would feel the pain of the rest of the community. It is not good enough.
After ten years of prosperity, which the Leader tells us about every second day in his response to the Order of Business——
Alex White (Labour)
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——and all the fantastic achievements he loves to detail to us, how can it be that not one of these flagship projects will be delivered on time? The massive economic and social impact these delays will have must be faced up to. It is a matter for the Government, as Senators O'Toole and Fitzgerald stated earlier.
The constant attempt to off-load responsibility to other agencies, notably in the health services, is extraordinary and says something about our system. Four months ago the House debated the health services. Members said not to blame the Minister for Health and Children for individual problems in hospitals. While I accept the Minister cannot be held individually responsible for such problems, she can and must be held responsible for the system itself.
We were told four months ago there would be changes. There is this constant sense that something is going to happen in the future but never does. Instead, today we have a Kafkaesque report on the health services where no one is responsible, as Senator Fitzgerald rightly said. One has to pinch oneself to see if there is any reality in what the Government says. There must be ministerial and Government accountability and collective Cabinet responsibility on issues such as public transport and health. I repeat my call for a debate on public transport.
I wish to move an amendment to the Order of Business, that No. 15, Protection of Employees (Agency Workers)(No. 2) Bill 2008, First Stage, be taken today.
John Gerard Hanafin (Fianna Fail)
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Will the Leader ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs to congratulate Dmitry Medvedev on his election to the presidency of Russia? For Russians living in Ireland, polls were held in Limerick and Dublin at which Mr. Medvedev got more than 80% of the vote. The OECD questioned the influence of the Russian media on the election results. Whereas the Irish media would have given open, and in some cases not very knowledgeable, views as to what is happening in Russia, Mr. Medvedev achieved an 80% vote among Russians living here, many of them young. It is a country with a great future and I ask the Leader to pass on our congratulations and best wishes for the future to Mr. Medvedev.
Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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I renew my call for a debate on Northern Ireland as it would be timely with Dr. Paisley's announcement to step down. Cometh the hour, cometh the man. Without Dr. Paisley's support and saying "yes", progress in the Northern Ireland process would have stalled. While it was a dramatic conversion for the man, all Members are glad to see devolved government operating well in Northern Ireland. All members would hope Dr. Paisley's successor will continue what he did in the past 12 months.
I am glad the Bill on the Lisbon treaty will soon be published. When will the Taoiseach set the date for the referendum? Yesterday, Senator Regan said much information available on the treaty can be accessed at the European forum and elsewhere. However, the ordinary man on the street knows very little about this treaty. It is essential the Government, without delay, sends out a clear message on what this treaty is all about.
Senators received correspondence today from the nephew of a gentleman who was killed recently in a collision between his car and a train at a manually operated railway crossing near Straide in County Mayo. We should try to get rid of these manually operated crossings. It is essential that automatic barriers be placed in these areas to negate the element of human error. I ask that the Minister investigate this and ask Iarnród Éireann to ensure the safety of passengers and those crossing at these points on a daily basis is of paramount importance. I ask the Minister to act on this as a matter of urgency.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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I support the call by Senator Fitzgerald to the Leader for a debate on the recently published reports on the health system, and particularly the Portlaoise report. In addition, I fully endorse the comments of my colleague Senator Cummins about Dr. Paisley and his call for a debate on the North, which was also mentioned yesterday. I add my voice to these and hope that the Leader can arrange such a debate as early as possible.
I recently referred to the deaths of two white-tailed sea eagles in County Kerry. Unfortunately, it has since been confirmed that they were poisoned. Sadly, a third eagle that was thought to have died of natural causes was also found to have been poisoned. A drug named Trodax was found in the carcasses along with a licensed poison. I accept that these poisons were put out to catch foxes and other vermin before the lambing season, but these birds have been absent from our shores for more than 100 years and are a wonderful tourist attraction. People are coming from far and wide to see them. Indiscriminate poisoning is wrong, dangerous and contrary to law. I appeal to farmers in this regard. I have total sympathy when it comes to foxes and other vermin, but we have now lost three of the 15 sea eagles reintroduced to County Kerry and we do not want to lose any more. They have been absent for too long. I remind the Cathaoirleach and my other colleagues that they are very welcome to come to Killarney to see these eagles. Hundreds of people are coming to see them, and it is hoped the number will soon be in the thousands. I extend that invitation to all Senators again.
When will the Civil Law (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill, which provides for a legal services ombudsman, be taken in the House? I ask the Leader to indicate this.
Labhrás Ó Murchú (Fianna Fail)
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I support the call by Senator Cummins for a debate on Northern Ireland, as was mentioned on the Order of Business yesterday. Over the years we have had some very significant debates on this issue but they were permeated by a sense of hopelessness and helplessness. I wish Dr. Paisley well in his retirement. Over the years I found little to agree with in what he said but in latter times he has shown himself to be a fine leader. Even though we did disagree with him, I always felt he had a moral focus. He believed what he was saying. He was transparent to the extent that one knew what was in his mind. I often feel that public debate would be the richer if everybody could be so transparent.
Many people are stunned by the progress that has been made in Northern Ireland. The peace process has been so successful, and in such a short time, that people are perhaps taking it for granted. As people are jockeying for position in the new set-up in Northern Ireland there is a grave danger that new agendas will be promoted. We must be vigilant about this and keep in touch with what is going on. We must continue the interaction we have had and cultivate the respect that has been developed among all traditions on this island in recent years. We cannot take anything for granted.
A comprehensive debate is important. It would be different from previous debates in that we would be dealing not just with the reality of the current situation but with the huge potential for the future. The Seanad, in particular, must play a central role in this regard.
Feargal Quinn (Independent)
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The quarterly national household survey was published yesterday, and it contains good news. The number of people working in Ireland in the final quarter of 2007 was 66,800 greater than in the previous year. We do not hear these figures often enough. There is major success in the economy. Yes, there were drops in construction jobs, but more jobs were created in services. I suggest that not just in these Houses but in the country as a whole we take a much more positive, forward-looking attitude to what is happening rather than talking ourselves into pessimism and recession.
Feargal Quinn (Independent)
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I am impressed with these figures, which we do not often hear.
I met with the US Secretary of Commerce last year, and he said that his responsibility was to create an environment in which entrepreneurs could create jobs. The reason I mention this is that the jobs being created in Ireland are coming from indigenous industries and services. While we have relied to a large extent on foreign direct investment in the past, and we will continue to do so in the future, let us make sure we make our economy attractive to indigenous entrepreneurs, to those who are carrying out research and innovation, and to those who are creating those jobs and ensuring a successful economy in the future. Let us not talk ourselves into pessimism but maintain a certain degree of optimism, because I see a great deal about which to be optimistic in the future.
My family accuse me of being mean. They accuse me of being so careful with my money that I gather up 1-cent pieces that everyone else leaves behind and pay for my newspaper with them. I seem to be the only person who picks up 1-cent pieces.
Feargal Quinn (Independent)
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Maybe Senator Norris does as well, but there are few of us. I call myself frugal or careful rather than mean. Finland decided when it joined the euro that it would not mint one-cent coins.
Feargal Quinn (Independent)
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This seems to make a great deal of sense. I say this against my wishes, but maybe we should consider doing the same. I would prefer if we would all value 1-cent pieces, but if we are not going to succeed in that, let us do as the Finns did and stop minting them.
Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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I wish to raise the issue of the breakdown in community life. We have not had the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs in the House since we came back. Last night when I was walking back to my hotel I encountered eight people urinating on the streets. I stopped and counted as I was going along.
Jerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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It may seem funny but it is not a joke. We are talking about civility and respect. I was appalled at this behaviour. It leads me to a point about Irish society. Today we have major investment in the RAPID, CLÁR and Leader programmes, but we need to have a real debate on community life and how we can enhance this in our country.
I join with Senator O'Toole in requesting a debate on the Health Service Executive, not in any specific area but on its generic remit. This morning in our newspapers we see that Professor Drumm is talking about another cutback of €300 million. A €200 million cutback was imposed last September. To whom is the HSE accountable? What is it doing? Who are all these faceless bureaucrats? Let us have a debate on the role of the HSE and, if necessary, let us call for its disbandment and a return to the old health board system.
11:00 am
Dominic Hannigan (Labour)
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The recent downturn in the construction sector was commented on earlier. Yesterday the Taoiseach said the downturn was one of the reasons for the drop in tax receipts. Senator Quinn mentioned the quarterly household survey that was published recently. That showed that in the last quarter more than 5,500 people have left the construction sector. Everybody knows the residential construction market is cyclical. We now have a trained workforce and it is time we put it to use on public transport infrastructure projects. I was particularly disappointed to learn that no major public transport infrastructure project will be delivered on time. The Minister, Deputy Noel Dempsey, might not be concerned but it appears the fast train to Navan will now resemble the slow boat to China. There must be a programme for the implementation of new public transport infrastructure projects. We have a trained workforce, and let us use it.
David Norris (Independent)
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This week one of my colleagues objected to the use of language by a Member on the Government side of the House because he used the word "slaughter" regarding the situation in Israel. I maintained it was a matter of proportion and I still do. I know something about the use of language and when 125 people, mainly civilians and including four children, are killed by the armed forces of a legitimate government as a matter of policy and in order, according to one Israeli Minister, to send a message to Hamas, it is slaughter and a massacre. That is the appropriate language. It is regrettable that my colleague and friend said that this type of debate provokes unreasonable passions and anti-Israeli feeling "which is ingrained in the minds of some Members of this House".
It is not ingrained in my mind. I am the only person in this House who has lived in Israel for substantial periods over the last 30 years. I know the country very well and I have always supported its right to exist. However, I am very concerned when an Israeli Minister uses the word shoah because I know what the word means to the Israelis and the Jews. People like myself are attacked when we use words such as apartheid to describe the fact that certain roads are reserved for Jewish citizens of Israel and people, even Israeli citizens, can be taken to court and jailed for taking Palestinians on them. That is apartheid. Ghettos exist and if an Israeli Minister can use the word shoah, I will use the word apartheid.
Amnesty International, Trócaire and Oxfam have combined to issue a statement today about the blockade by Israel. They say the conditions in Gaza are the worst in 40 years and that they constitute collective punishment. That is a war crime under the terms of the Geneva Conventions. Yesterday, I received a communication from the chairman of the Royal Institute of the Architects of Ireland, RIAI, housing committee who is on a visit to Israel and Palestine and is totally neutral. He went with some Palestinian people to make a protest at the wall, as he had gone to other events with Israelis. He said:
The protest against the wall was festive and accompanied by music.... At the security fence a symbolic coffin was put in place and the man who had carried it turned to leave at which point, and without any provocation whatsoever, [this occurred inside Palestine] the Israeli Army who were observing the protest opened fire hitting the man and subsequently hitting several other people with some form of plastic bullet, the injured people were taken away by ambulances. The army then advanced through a fence in front of the wall and from concealment in fields to the west (I think) of the village road, all the time firing plastic bullets, and tear gas as they advanced. We were shocked and terrified ..... At least two live rounds appear to have been fired. The army continued firing and advancing on us....
That is appalling. They were then allowed to go back to their buses but this was an unprovoked attack by the Israeli army, with rubber bullets and live ammunition, on a peaceful demonstration within the state of Palestine. The reason I and others raise these issues is that they involve the official army of the state against unarmed civilians. We must use this type of language because the people in Palestine and Gaza are defenceless.
I am not attacking the people of Israel, whom I love and among whom I lived for many years. The restaurant we regularly went to for celebrations, Savion, at the triangle near the president's house——
Pat Moylan (Fianna Fail)
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There is nothing in the Order of Business about restaurants.
David Norris (Independent)
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——was bombed. I was nearly killed in a bomb attack outside a pizzeria in the centre of Jerusalem. I am aware of these incidents and I condemn them unreservedly. However, I will not be intimidated against saying what I think about human rights.
Ivor Callely (Fianna Fail)
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I rise to support my good friend and colleague, Senator Norris. While I do not have the same command of the English language or the same knowledge about the Israeli situation as he outlined, I wholeheartedly support the view he expressed on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, particularly the deteriorating position in Gaza. It must stop. In light of what has been said on the other side of the House, it is appropriate that this side of the House would sing in harmony in demanding that we be listened to and that appropriate action is taken by all the players to ensure the deteriorating situation in Gaza is halted. My understanding, like that of Senator Norris, is that the situation is the worst that has been witnessed in Gaza in the past 40 years. Hopefully, the Leader will echo our remarks to the Minister for Foreign Affairs and they will be conveyed along the appropriate channels.
Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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I support the call by Senator Cummins for the automation of all unmanned level crossings throughout the country. Last week the tragic death took place of Mr. P. J. McGowan of Straide, County Mayo, at an unmanned level crossing. I have previously called for the automation of these level crossings. The majority of them are in the west and Iarnród Éireann should bring them to automated standard, particularly when it is putting new trains on a line.
A number of the projects in Transport 21 will be behind schedule. I recently looked at a map on which the National Roads Authority has published its programme for 2008. There are no national primary routes or any works in the NRA programme planned for Counties Mayo, Sligo, Leitrim, Donegal, Cavan, Monaghan, Longford and most of Roscommon in 2008. This House should have an urgent debate on the Transport 21 programme which is falling far behind schedule. The counties I mentioned are in the BMW region and, as I have said on a number of occasions previously, the BMW region is not getting its fair share of the funding which was proposed a number of years ago. This country got €8 billion under the former Taoiseach, Albert Reynolds, specifically for the poorer regions of the country but this is proof that they are not getting their fair share. I ask the Leader to arrange a debate on this issue.
Paschal Donohoe (Fine Gael)
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I concur with my colleagues in seeking a debate on public transport and particularly Transport 21. Two further points should be raised in that regard. First, not only has the Minister for Transport not met the targets, which are now referred to as indicative timings, in the past, he is also refusing to set new targets for many of the projects that have been delayed. Of the five projects that will not be delivered this year, the Minister is proposing to set new targets for only two of them. Second, the metro north is probably the largest of these projects and will run through my constituency. The Minister is refusing to give a guarantee that it will have adequate capacity to cope with the number of commuters who will use it. Basically, he is saying that he is willing to spend up to €6 billion of taxpayers' money and not learn from the mistakes that were made on projects such as the M50. I cannot think of any greater evasion of ministerial responsibility than a refusal to set clear deadlines and objectives for the future spending of billions of our money.
The Dublin transport authority is the body that will be put in place to manage the spending on and delivery of many of the projects we are discussing this morning. We will not and cannot allow the Dublin transport authority become to transport what the Health Service Executive is to health.
Paschal Donohoe (Fine Gael)
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It cannot become a body upon which the Government dumps all responsibility and blame when it cannot deliver its targets and is seeking to evade ministerial accountability.
Paschal Donohoe (Fine Gael)
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In the debate on the Dublin transport authority in this House, my party will seek to ensure that three conditions are met in creation of the new body. First, political accountability cannot be diluted by the setting up of that body. Second, there must be clear lines of accountability and responsibility in the new organisation. Third, we cannot be in the position whereby in a year's time we are all sitting here having a discussion about the faceless bureaucrats of the Dublin transport authority who are spending billions of euro of our money to improve the quality of life of the people whom we are here to serve. I ask that during the debate on this vital issue we make sure we do not repeat the mistakes of the past.
Paul Bradford (Fine Gael)
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I support the call by Senator Buttimer for a debate on community values and civic responsibility. That is a very urgent debate, in my view. On a weekly, if not daily, basis we are raising the issues of law and order, murders, stabbings and all sorts of terrible deeds. These are all part of the same equation however, namely, the breakdown in civic responsibility, in a sense of community and in the values which we enjoyed in this country. A number of Members, including Senators O'Toole, Norris and myself will be 21 years in the Oireachtas in a few months' time. Over that period, there has been a huge transformation in society. One of the strong negatives is the decline in personal and civic responsibility and in the sense of community and shared values, which was a strong Irish trait for many generations. Interestingly, this has coincided with a significant drop in religious practice, a fall in vocations and a drop in the numbers of priests, nuns and brothers in the country. We have also seen a major attack on society and standards and values. All of these issues should form part of the debate, which should not be exclusive to this House. I welcome the call for such a debate.
I support Senator Cummin's comments regarding the need for an early notification from the Taoiseach of a date for the European referendum on the Lisbon treaty. It is interesting that an enormous number of people in the country are discussing the forthcoming United States election. It is on the front page of almost every newspaper, on the television every second night and groups of people in pubs and clubs are discussing an election in which we have no say, good, bad or indifferent. We have an election coming our way in a few months' time which is of much greater long-term significance to this House and the Irish people than the election in the American presidential election, namely the referendum on the Lisbon treaty. We must engage the public. An early announcement from the Taoiseach and a substantial debate in both Houses of the Oireachtas, as well as the various committees, would be helpful and necessary if we want to engage the people in an election where they actually have a say as opposed to the November election in the United States where, despite all our bleating, we have no say whatsoever.
Rónán Mullen (Independent)
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I second Senator Alex White's proposal on an amendment to the Order of Business. The announcement that there will be progress on the development of a child detention centre at Lusk is very welcome. We have heard much talk about juvenile crime and juvenile offenders, particularly in the context of the tragic deaths of two Polish men in Drimnagh recently, which horrified us all. There is an important issue here regarding how we treat child offenders. It is desirable that we do not detain child offenders in the same place as adult offenders. That is why the new detention centre at Lusk is very welcome as it will basically treat the detention of young offenders as a child care issue.
I want to know — this should be the subject of a debate in this House — why it is still proposed that there would be detention of young offenders of 16 and 17 years in the proposed Thornton Hall complex. When we detain young offenders with older offenders we provide stepping stones in the wrong direction. People who currently have experience of St. Patrick's Institution, which is on the Mountjoy Prison site, will affirm that younger offenders there are almost aspiring to be with the older offenders and the older cohort is aspiring to be in Mountjoy. I ask for quick and speedy progress on the Lusk detention centre in order to make unnecessary the detention of young persons in the proposed Thornton Hall complex. I call for an approach to child offending that believes in the potential of rehabilitating young offenders who are still at a formative stage in their lives.
I wish to briefly refer to an issue covered in some newspapers today, namely the sale of bogus mass cards. This is a matter which is not just of concern to people of faith. Irrespective of whether people have faith, we all like to show solidarity with the bereaved at times. People may not know that mass cards very often contribute to priests on the missions who have very low incomes and are doing great work. The sale of bogus mass cards in shops means that masses are not being said at all and the money is going into the hands of profiteers. This is not just a private matter which is of interest to the Church. It is an issue of solidarity and I hope when the Charities Bill comes before this House that there will be support across the House for a measure that would target something that is claiming to have a charitable purpose but which is a bogus arrangement. That loophole should be closed and I hope it will not just be people of faith, or of one particular faith, who will support any such amendment.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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Senators Fitzgerald, O'Toole, Alex White, Coghlan and Buttimer all expressed their serious views and concerns on the new reports which were published yesterday on the health service and the HSE in general. It is my intention that we will have a lengthy debate on the matter in the House at the earliest opportunity. Now that the reports have been published, I will try to confirm a date, subject to the Minister's diary commitments.
Senators Fitzgerald, O'Toole, Alex White, Burke and Donohoe all called for a debate on Transport 21 and the delivery of projects. Newspapers report today that some projects are running a little late.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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The big difference is that when Fianna Fáil is in power, they are taking place. When Senator Alex White's party was in power, nothing was taking place.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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I must put the record straight. It is refreshing to hear Senator Quinn being positive because I thought I was living on another planet with all the whinging, crying, moaning and groaning that was going on.
Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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Planet Bertie. The Leader is on planet Bertie.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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——that 66,800 new jobs would be created in the last quarter of the year——
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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——compared to the last quarter of 2006 and that it would go unnoticed and unappreciated by Members of the House. I congratulate Senator Quinn who has led by example. He is a captain of industry and people like him gave us the Celtic tiger, part 1.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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I must point out to younger Senators that all major projects are reliant on the balance sheet of the economy and the Exchequer, year on year. Anyone who knows anything about the construction industry knows that not one job in 100 years will come in on time. Delays are related to weather and various other issues but the younger Members will learn as they go along.
Paschal Donohoe (Fine Gael)
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The Leader is being patronising now.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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All of the projects are taking place.
Pat Moylan (Fianna Fail)
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The Leader on the Order of Business, please.
Paudie CoffeyJerry Buttimer (Fine Gael)
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We might be young but we are not fools.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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They are all taking place and I must point out to Senator Hannigan that the Navan rail line is taking place. I congratulate a fellow constituent of mine and Senator Hannigan, the Minister for Transport, Deputy Noel Dempsey, on making this happen in our constituency.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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I inform Senators Alex White, Mullen and Hanafin that I am accepting the amendment to the Order of Business and welcome it with no objections. I know it is intended that it will be taken during Private Members' business next week. Positive things happen from time to time and the Leader is open to good suggestions. He will acknowledge when they are good but when they are not he will point out the inaccuracies that occur from time to time.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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The Leader will look into his own heart.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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I join Senator Hanafin in congratulating the new President of Russia, who won the general election last Sunday.
Michael McCarthyDonie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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I wish to respond to Senators Cummins, Ó Murchú and Bradford on a debate on Northern Ireland. I know some Members were at committee meetings but I informed the House yesterday that the Taoiseach will be present for that debate, which will take place on the first sitting day that falls as close as possible to the tenth anniversary of the Good Friday Agreement.
I welcome the publication of the Twenty-eighth Amendment of the Constitution Bill 2008. This will come to the House and for those Senators who this morning called for a debate on the Lisbon treaty, this Bill will provide an opportunity to express their opinions.
Some Senators, including the Leas-Chathaoirleach, Senator Burke, expressed concerns relating to safety at unmanned level crossings in light of the recent fatality that occurred. We all wish to pass on our condolences to the family concerned. A member of my family presided over level crossings for more than 40 years so I understand it is a serious commitment that requires attention seven days a week. I congratulate all those who have kept the level crossings of Ireland safe through the years and will pass the Senators' views on to the Minister.
Senator Coghlan highlighted for the House the tragedy of tourist attractions in the beautiful town of Killarney. Killarney is a shining example for the rest of Ireland of the tourism product that can be provided and I agree with the Senator on anything that can be done to assist with creating tourist attractions for places like Killarney. I will enquire to see when the legal services Bill will come to the House.
Senator Feargal Quinn gave a shining example of how important one cent coins are. Those of us old enough will know how hard it was to get them in the first place and I think Senator Norris agreed with this. If one does not mind one's pennies one will not have the pounds, as they used to say. This issue shows how we have progressed over the years.
Senators Buttimer and Bradford called for a debate on community life and I listened attentively to Senator Bradford's comments as he has huge experience and has spent almost 21 years in these Houses. I congratulate him on the service he has given because I know he is a young man with many years ahead of him. He expressed sentiments this morning on a serious matter and this House must have a lengthy debate on where society is going, how we have achieved what we have today and what our forefathers gave us. There is a considerable drift away from the type of upbringing we had and the younger generation must now meet a different challenge that starts at home and in school. I have no difficulty in setting aside time for this matter.
Senator Hannigan expressed his concern at the drop in income to the national Exchequer of €517 million for the first two months of this year. I am an optimistic person but if I had been asked about this in October, November or December I would have been pessimistic. However, one can now buy a three bedroom, semi-detached house within 50 miles of Dublin for €199,500; this is incredible value and now is the time to buy.
Dominic Hannigan (Labour)
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People who buy such houses will spend two hours trying to get to Dublin.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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Castlepollard is part of the Senator's constituency, just as it is part of mine.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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I want to tell the Senator the good news. Using the M50 every morning it takes me one hour and 35 minutes to travel here, leaving at 8 a.m. These houses are for sale in Castlepollard, the beautiful lake district of our constituency. The Senator should feel free to recommend to his colleagues where value for money can be found only 50 miles from the capital city of Dublin.
Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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The Leader must use Mr. O'Leary's taxi to get here in that amount of time.
Pat Moylan (Fianna Fail)
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Please let the Leader reply to the Order of Business without interruption.
John Paul Phelan (Fine Gael)
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He is not replying to the Order of Business.
Donie Cassidy (Fianna Fail)
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There are more places in Ireland than Dublin and Kerry. I share the concerns of Senators Norris and Callely regarding the worst conditions in 40 years in Gaza. I hope something can be done to stop that conflict that has gone on for a very long time.
Senator Mullen referred to a juvenile detention centre in Lusk and I will pass his views on to the Minister. I know the Senator works closely with the Catholic Church and the bishops of Ireland and I will also pass on his serious concerns relating to mass cards to the Minister. Over the past five years I was Chairman of the Committee on Enterprise and Small Business and travelled to many countries with Ministers of State, Ministers and, on three occasions, on trade missions with the Taoiseach. The Ireland of saints and scholars is not merely a throwaway one-liner; it took centuries to create that association and nobody has been a better ambassador for our country than our missionaries. If the funding from mass cards is to be forwarded to missionaries and masses are being said for the dearly departed, we should do everything we can to continue the good work that has gone on for decades.
Pat Moylan (Fianna Fail)
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Senator White has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That No. 15 be taken before No. 1". The Leader indicated that he is prepared to accept the amendment. Is the amendment being pressed?