Seanad debates
Tuesday, 20 June 2006
Order of Business.
2:30 pm
John Dardis (Progressive Democrats)
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The Order of Business is Nos. 1 to 4, inclusive. No. 1, European Communities (Amendment) Bill 2006 — Second Stage (resumed), to be taken on the conclusion of the Order of Business and to conclude not later than 4 p.m., the contribution of Senators not to exceed eight minutes each and Senators may share time, the Minister to be called on to reply not later than five minutes before the conclusion of Second Stage; No. 2, International Criminal Court Bill 2003 — Second Stage (resumed), to be taken at 4 p.m. and to conclude not later than 5.30 p.m., the contribution of Senators not to exceed eight minutes each, Senators may share their time and the Minister to be called on to reply not later than five minutes before the conclusion of Second Stage; No. 3, Land and Conveyancing Law Reform Bill 2006 — Order for Second Stage and Second Stage, to be taken from 5.30 p.m. until 7.30 p.m., the contribution of spokespersons not to exceed 15 minutes, and all other Senators not to exceed ten minutes each, and Senators may share their time. In the event that no further speakers are offering, the Minister to be called on to reply not later than five minutes before the conclusion of Second Stage. I am not saying that Second Stage may necessarily conclude and if speakers are still offering we will resume the discussion later; and No. 4, National Economic and Social Development Office Bill 2002 — Committee Stage (resumed), to be taken at 7.30 p.m. and to conclude not later than 8.30 p.m.
Brian Hayes (Fine Gael)
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Will the Government provide time this week, either today or tomorrow, for the Minister for Transport to give a full statement to the House on the situation surrounding the 238 speeding convictions that were thrown out of court in Wicklow last week? We now face an horrendous situation. When the country moved to metric speed limits, as I understand it, it was necessary for a by-law to be established in each local authority area to allow those new metric speed limits to apply. However, the Department of Transport advised local authorities that there was no need to do this at the time.
There is now a lacuna in 29 of the 34 local authority areas. Many other persons will presumably seek in court to make null and void the speeding offences with which they have been charged. What is the position of the accident-prone Minister for Transport on this matter? Will he tell the House if the Government will appeal these cases to the High Court and the Supreme Court? Does the Minister take political responsibility for the advice he gave the various local authorities when the metric system was first introduced? What is the current position?
We have heard nothing from the Minister on this issue since last Friday, although it affects virtually every local authority area. We must get our act together on road safety and ensure the law is properly enforced. Once again the incompetence of the Minister for Transport and virtually every other office holder in the Government comes to the fore. When the former Taoiseach, Mr. Haughey, referred to this as the worst Government in the history of the State, how right he was.
Martin Mansergh (Fianna Fail)
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Who is the Senator quoting? What is his source?
Brian Hayes (Fine Gael)
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The Senator's own newspaper is the source.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Brian Hayes, on the Order of Business.
Brian Hayes (Fine Gael)
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I would not question the nice people who write for such a newspaper.
On a second matter, the Garda Síochána Act passed the Seanad and Dáil in June of last year and has been in place for 12 months. Section 36 of the Act is supposed to allow the establishment of joint policing committees. Not one joint policing committee has been established in that 12-month period despite the fact there was cross-party support for such an initiative and everyone believes it to be a good idea and similar to what is taking place in Northern Ireland in terms of the district partnerships.
The Minister, Deputy McDowell, lectures the Garda representative organisations on the importance of Acts passed by the Oireachtas and the need for those Acts to be enforced with regard to the Garda reserve. However, he is not implementing a vitally important section of the Act establishing joint policing committees. When will we see this happen? Will the Acting Leader organise statements on the matter?
Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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No. 9 on the Order Paper is a Bill in the name of Senator Coghlan and I which arose due to a difficulty arising from the Official Languages Act, particularly with reference to the decision to change the name of the town of Dingle-Daingean Uí Chúis to An Daingean. The House might note that in the meantime Kerry County Council has decided to conduct a plebiscite of the people of that town to establish their views and to facilitate a decision in this regard.
The intention of our Official Languages (Amendment) Bill 2005, which we have chosen to hold back for the present, is to take note of the views of local residents. However, the Minister has stated that this plebiscite will have no legal standing and that he is prepared to ignore it, despite the fact the Official Languages Act, which he used to change the name to An Daingean, allows him to change it back.
The House will be pleased to hear that last week the Dingle GAA club, established for a century, changed its name to Dingle-Daingean Uí Chúis, as did the local regatta club and various other groups in Dingle. I have no doubt what way the people will speak on this issue.
We would like to know — I am sure Senator Coghlan shares my view — whether the Government will accept the views of the local people. A detailed plebiscite will take place in October, involving a seven-stage process in which people will be asked whether they accept the dátheangach version of the name of the town, Dingle-Daingean Uí Chúis. If that is the case, will the Government accept that this is the way forward? I look forward to hearing the Government's view, which would be helpful to Senator Coghlan and me in deciding whether to proceed with the Bill.
That is all I will say as I do not want to open up the debate. The information sought is important and it is not unreasonable to ask for it. I know the Taoiseach and Government would not be unreasonable in this regard but there is one person in Government who is extraordinarily unreasonable.
Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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I welcome, as we all should, the decision announced by the Government at the weekend to invest millions of euro in research and development in third and fourth level education. I also welcomed it when it was announced in a broad sweep at the time of the budget. However, it is difficult to relate it to the group standing outside Leinster House today representing a 16 year old school with 250 pupils, which cannot get a school site or approval from the Department of Education and Science.
Education must begin at the first step of the ladder. If a successful and well-run school which is conducting its business properly, such as Gaelscoil Sáirséal in the Cathaoirleach's county of Limerick, cannot get support on these kinds of issues, there is no point going to the top deck. The Minister should explain to the House how we will have a run all the way through, so a viable school will get the support to which it is entitled.
Joanna Tuffy (Labour)
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Yesterday was the 61st birthday of Aung San Suu Kyi, the leader of the National League for Democracy in Burma and Nobel peace prize winner. She has been detained under house arrest by the Burmese military for the past three years and has been detained for nearly 11 years overall by the same regime. Can the Acting Leader inquire as to whether there is anything this House can do to put pressure on the relevant authorities to have Aung San Suu Kyi released? She is being detained because she has the popular support of the people of Burma. We have the benefit of living in a democratic country and the Leader of this House is a woman. We, as Members of the Seanad, could make representations to the Burmese authorities and also to the United Nations to help bring about her release.
Today's Irish Examiner has a front page report on a study carried out by Trinity College's anti-bullying centre. It measures the levels of bullying in primary schools and the figures are alarmingly high. The study covered over 2,000 pupils in a number of counties, the nationwide study is yet to be conducted, and it found that almost one in five girls and more than one in three boys have been physically attacked in the past three months. Approximately 20% of girls and 30% of boys have been bullied in this period. The report suggests that new forms of bullying are emerging, for example one in ten pupils has been victim of bullying by text message over the past three months. This is an important issue as, if it starts at primary school level, it could be very difficult to eradicate. We have brought in reforms to deal with issues such as bullying in the workplace, the Defence Forces and so on. It is important that we deal with bullying at its roots especially in the case of young children and take whatever actions are necessary to address the issue. The Department of Education and Science formed a task force to report on the issue which made recommendations earlier this year, however, Mr. Stephen Minton, who carried out the study with Trinity College was pessimistic about these recommendations and is reported as saying many would remain unaddressed. I hope this is not the case and I would like the Minister for Education and Science to debate the issue in this House at her earliest convenience.
I support Senator Brian Hayes's comments on the joint policing committees and I point out that Oireachtas Members will be entitled to sit on these committees which is important because we have a national and local viewpoint. To give credit where it is due, Senator Terry Leyden was the first person to question the fact that Oireachtas Members were originally not included and amendments in this House ensured they would be. This is a very important initiative by the Minister and he must ensure it is implemented nationwide as soon as possible.
Labhrás Ó Murchú (Fianna Fail)
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It is time to invite the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív, to discuss in this House language equality legislation and the official working status of the Irish language in Europe. These two developments have given a huge boost to the promotion of Irish and had unanimous support throughout the Oireachtas. Polls have indicated there is great goodwill among the public towards these issues also.
There are many elements to the language equality legislation such as drawing up the programme for the provision of a bilingual service by over 600 agencies throughout the country and the filing of biannual reports. Obviously we cannot have Seán Ó Curraín anseo, but it would be worthwhile for the Minister to discuss these issues with us because some time has elapsed. On the point raised by Senator O'Toole, I do not know if he realises he is doing such a good public relations job for An Daingean. It will be the best known location in the world as a result of the debate.
Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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In case the Senator is ever looking for it, it is approximately eight miles from Tullamore.
Geraldine FeeneyLabhrás Ó Murchú (Fianna Fail)
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I had a call from the New York Times asking how the matter was progressing and what the views in the country were. I do not think the people of An Daingean or Daingean Uí Chúis need have any worries from now on because the destination is so well known throughout the world.
Mary White
John Paul Phelan (Fine Gael)
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I agree with Senator Brian Hayes on the points he raised concerning the dismissal of a number of proceedings during the past couple of weeks in Wicklow in respect of speeding fines. It would be appropriate, given the number of anomalies in the speed limit system, if the Minister for Transport were to come into the House to discuss the fiasco that has emerged during the past ten days or so.
I agree also with Senator Brian Hayes in respect of the local policing committees. The Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform has been forthright in his views, as usual, regarding the Garda representative associations and the implementation of the Garda reserve. I support the Garda reserve but on the issue of policing committees the Minister has been found wanting. These committees should be set up as soon as possible.
I wish to bring to the attention of the Deputy Leader and the House, the plight of the group from a gaelscoil in Limerick whose members are outside the gates of Leinster House today. While we all welcome the weekend announcement by the Government of additional funding for third and fourth level education, it is disgraceful in this day and age that this school and others do not have adequate school buildings, despite advances in that area.
The Deputy Leader may have more success in contacting his party leader, the Tánaiste, regarding the workers in the former Comerama plant in Castlecomer, County Kilkenny. In December 2002, at a meeting I attended along with all other Oireachtas Members from Carlow-Kilkenny, including those from Fianna Fáil, the Tánaiste gave a commitment that the workers would be covered by the new redundancy payments legislation which was going through the House at that time. The workers and their families took a particular course of action which saw the closing down of that factory before the end of 2002 because they were given a commitment by the Tánaiste. That commitment has been reneged upon and those people are down almost €1 million in redundancy payments.
That is a very significant sum for any group. It is certainly significant in the town of Castlecomer which has had much unemployment in recent years since the closure of the coalmines and many other local businesses. I have raised this matter at every opportunity when various other Bills were going through the House. I resent the attitude of the Tánaiste. By her remarks and her failure to honour her commitment she is calling me a liar. I know what I heard at that meeting as do the other Oireachtas Members who were present. I wish the Tánaiste would honour the commitment she gave to the workers on that occasion.
Ann Ormonde (Fianna Fail)
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I welcome the Government decision in respect of significant funding for research and development. It will be a great boost for education and training and the business world. For too long we have been in a vacuum in establishing links. This is a golden opportunity to open up all the institutes and to enable third level students to move on to postgraduate research and development. It is a great boost on which I congratulate the Government.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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I support the views expressed by Senator O'Toole on the Official Languages (Amendment) Bill 2005 which is No. 9 on the Order Paper. As Members of the Oireachtas we pride ourselves on our support for, and the value of, democracy. Kerry County Council's proposal for a plebiscite in October is the essence of democracy.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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The people of the area will be asked to have their say. It behoves us all, including the Minister, to respect the wishes of the people in this matter.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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Dingle has for centuries been known as Gaeilge as Daingean Uí Chúis and nothing else. The proposal and the plebiscite is for Dingle — Daingean Uí Chúis. Nothing could be better. I look forward to hearing the views of the Deputy Leader on the matter. I ask him to utilise his relations with the Minister in this regard. If the Minister comes before us, as Senator Ó Murchú has proposed, perhaps he will discuss this matter as well.
Last week on the Order of Business I referred to what I called "State paintings". These are the paintings taken out of the Great Southern Hotels which are now in the ownership of the Dublin Airport Authority. They were removed for valuation with a view to their disposal. The value put on them by de Vere's, an eminent house in this city, is a very reasonable €100,000.
Some of the paintings were with CIE before a previous Government decision to hive them off. Will the Deputy Leader ensure that other State institutions have the first call on them? The valuation has been established by an expert, and this can be respected. The amount involved is not unreasonable. It is very important, and in the best interests of the State, that these paintings remain in State ownership. This is particularly because of the contributions by the State, through grants, towards the original purchase of the paintings.
Maurice Hayes (Independent)
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Will the Deputy Leader pursue with the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources, Deputy Noel Dempsey, questions which have been raised by both Senator McHugh and myself regarding progress on the removal of roaming charges for mobile phones on the island? The Taoiseach may be reporting on the matter to the National Forum on Europe next Thursday. It is an important issue for people living along the Border.
I will offer a cautionary tale to Senators Ó Murchú and O'Toole. There was a controversy over whether Derry should be called Londonderry or Derry, and some thought it may be called, by means of compromise, Londonderry-Derry. It is now jokingly known as "Stroke City", which is a fate I would not wish on Dingle. For the innocent people of the north west, the word "stroke" has only one primary meaning. In the case of Dingle, a back translation might be "Dingle — Baile na Seafta".
Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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There will be no stroking. It will be all one word.
3:00 pm
Ulick Burke (Fine Gael)
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The dramatic increase in bullying at school referred to by Senator Tuffy cannot go unnoticed. The response of the Minister and the Department of Education and Science to the task force report of early 2006 is totally inadequate. The provision of a learning support classroom for bullies in schools is a total failure on the part of the Minister to respond nationally to the developing situation.
Currently, 30 schools in the country have this facility, inadequate as it is. Some 720 national schools throughout the country have had no response whatever to this problem. In the 33 schools outside Dublin where the survey was done, with approximately 2,350 students, a third of girls and 44% of boys were either verbally or physically abused. A scenario is developing which needs urgent attention. The failure of the Minister to give the attention should be taken to task.
It is important action is taken, as Senator Tuffy stated. If students lose out in the early stages of education, they lose out altogether. If children are bullied at primary school level, they will carry the traits of it into second level and beyond. Other research into the tragic deaths that have occurred of young people around the country has shown that suicide can be traced back to bullying in school which resulted in a loss of confidence. I urge the Deputy Leader to make immediate contact with the Minister to ask her to implement the recommendations of this year's task force report on a national basis as a matter of urgency. This matter is too serious for it to be allowed to continue with only a pilot scheme in place.
John Gerard Hanafin (Fianna Fail)
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I would welcome a debate on bullying which would be most useful. This is a serious problem that requires urgent attention. However, I hope we would approach it in a logical, reasonable and objective manner. Any other approach would be most unhelpful.
I also note that the European Parliament has given funding for embryonic stem cell research and I request a debate on this issue. Embryonic stem cells have a pluripotency by their very nature; in other words they must multiply and divide because of the baby's life cycle. Up to now, scientists have been unable to prevent this happening, and if they were able to do so, it would possibly cause other problems. It is beyond me how funding consistently goes to this research which is proving so unproductive.
Frank Feighan (Fine Gael)
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Last week I highlighted the fact that up to 100 drug dealers living in Spain appear to be untouchable. Resources must be put in place to deal with this issue and legislation must be enacted on a Europe-wide basis so that we can deal with these people. More drugs than ever are now coming into the country.
Last weekend the killing occurred of a small-time player in the drugs industry. This was the 29th such killing so far this year. We are facing a major crisis in the Garda. We need extra gardaí. Currently a great deal of overtime is available to gardaí but they are close to burnout as they are dealing with these serious crimes every day. These young men and women are putting themselves in dangerous situations on a daily basis and they cannot carry on like that. They need more help and assistance. I call for a debate on the increasing levels of gun and drug crime and how best we can approach this serious and escalating matter in a united way.
John Dardis (Progressive Democrats)
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The Leader of the Opposition, Senator Brian Hayes, and Senator John Paul Phelan, raised the issue of speed limits and those people who appear to be escaping sentencing in court. In one case the recorded speed of a defendant was an astonishing 200 km/h. I am not fully familiar with the detail of whether the Department advised that it was not required of the local authorities to implement the by-laws, because from my experience as a local authority member, the local authority always introduced by-laws where changes were taking place.
I fully agree that this is not acceptable. I also agree that the law must be regularised to ensure that people who are in breach of speeding restrictions are subject to penalty. I think that is what we all want. There have been many debates in the House on road safety where we have pointed out the dangers of excessive speed. I will bring the matter to the attention of the Minister for Transport and ask him if he will come into the House to debate it in detail.
Senator Brian Hayes, together with Senators Tuffy and John Paul Phelan, also raised the Garda Síochána Act and joint policing committees. I do not know what is the position but I will bring the matter to the Minister's atttention. There can be a difference between a Bill and what is enacted. Just because a section forms part of a Bill may not necessarily mean its provisions are enacted.
John Dardis (Progressive Democrats)
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I understand it is proposed to commence the section but that is a slightly different matter from having it in the Act. I will bring the matter to the attention of the Minister. I agree that the committees should be established. We had a similar situation in regard to the health boards. Those committees are now being set up and the same should apply in this case. A valuable contribution can be made by both local and national public representatives in terms of guiding the Garda in regard to policing priorities. It will be a useful process.
Senators O'Toole, Ó Murchú, Coghlan and Maurice Hayes referred to the Official Languages (Amendment) Bill 2005, in the names of Senators O'Toole and Coghlan, with particular reference to the case of Dingle-Daingean Uí Chúis. Due regard should be given to the results of any plebiscite that is conducted because it will be an important statement of the wishes of local people. However, there could potentially be chaos if this were to be done for every town. There must be some degree of consistency. Within Gaeltacht areas, nevertheless, if people exercise their franchise and there is a conclusive verdict, it should be accepted and implemented.
John Dardis (Progressive Democrats)
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I will bring this matter to the attention of the Minister. I will not comment on the point made by Senator Maurice Hayes about Derry-Londonderry, or "Stroke City".
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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It is outside the Acting Leader's jurisdiction.
John Dardis (Progressive Democrats)
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Senators O'Toole, Ormonde and John Paul Phelan raised the matter of the billions of euro being earmarked for research and development under the new national programme. This is to be welcomed as a key component in ensuring the State can maintain its competitiveness internationally. It is an area that has been neglected in the past, even within the private sector, and funding has been inadequate by international standards.
I am not familiar with the details of the school to which Senator O'Toole referred. However, I am aware there has been enormous progress nationally in the provision of school buildings and sites. Perhaps it is a question of taking one's place in the queue and not trying to gazump——
Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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This school has been waiting for 16 years.
John Dardis (Progressive Democrats)
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——others by protesting outside the gates of Leinster House. However, I am not familiar with the circumstances of this particular school.
Senator Tuffy raised the case of Aung San Suu Kyi. Her plight has been addressed at meetings of the Oireachtas Committees on European Affairs and Foreign Affairs. The Minister for Foreign Affairs has been consistent in his support for her and in petitioning the Burmese authorities for her release from custody. The EU regards this as a suitable matter for sanctions within the broader context of human rights abuses in general within Burma. It is unacceptable that the leader of an opposition party should be under house arrest. The democratic principle should apply there as it does in this State.
Senators Tuffy, Hanafin and Ulick Burke raised the serious issue of bullying. The findings of the Trinity College study on the incidence of bullying in primary schools are worrying and must be acted upon. I will bring to the attention of the Minister the need to implement the recommendations of the departmental task force. It is important to note, however, that school authorities and parents also have a responsibility in this area. The State has an important role to play but it does not bear exclusive responsibility. I am aware of schools, at both primary and secondary level, where innovative and effective programmes have been put in place to deal with bullying. For those schools that are minded to do so, there is much they can do themselves to tackle the problem.
Senator Ó Murchú spoke about language equality legislation and the implementation of the successful all-party motion of this House in regard to the recognition of the Irish language at European level. I will ask the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy Ó Cuív, to come to the House and debate this issue.
I am unfamiliar with the case of the Comerama workers in Castlecomer to which Senator John Paul Phelan referred, but I will bring it to the attention of the Tánaiste and Minister for Health and Children, Deputy Harney. I do not accept that the Tánaiste ever accused Senator Phelan or anybody else of being a liar, as he suggested. This matter relates to the Tánaiste's previous Ministry but I am sure she will speak to the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, Deputy Martin, in an attempt to resolve this matter.
Senator Coghlan spoke about what he refers to as "State paintings", an issue I read about in the newspapers at the weekend. Regardless of whether the paintings are in the custody of the DAA or CIE, if they are public property, they should remain in public ownership. It is quite appropriate to send them to de Vere's for valuation, for insurance purposes, if nothing else. However, I fully accept that where provenance can be proven and the paintings are definitely State property, they should remain in public ownership. There may be some private paintings on display in those places, but that is a separate issue.
Senator Maurice Hayes referred to roaming charges for mobile telephones, which has been raised by several other Senators. I will endeavour to find out if the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources can come to the House to clarify the situation.
Senator Hanafin referred to bullying. He also raised the matter of embryonic stem cell research and the recent decision by the EU to allow such research to take place. My understanding of the issue is that the EU has allowed funding for research in those jurisdictions which allow such research to take place. It is up to each jurisdiction to decide for itself whether it will allow such practices. There is a live moral debate surrounding this issue. It has been suggested that as much can be achieved with adult stem cells as with those from an embryo, although I do not know if that is true. It is clear that the potential benefits of stem cell research are enormous, whether conducted on adult or embryonic cells. However, the destruction of embryos is something that most Irish people would find abhorrent. The issue is a complex one.
Senator Feighan raised the issue of drug dealing, as he has done on numerous occasions in the past. We are all horrified by the number of gang-related killings that have taken place recently. The Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform and the Garda Commissioner have been to the Coolock area to determine what can be done. The situation is very serious and it appears that human life is of very little value to some of those involved. They acquire guns and if somebody offends them, that is sufficient reason for them to take away a life. That cannot be condoned by anybody. The question of the control of guns must be addressed. I will endeavour to organise a comprehensive debate in the House on this serious matter.