Seanad debates
Thursday, 3 November 2005
Order of Business.
10:30 am
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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The Order of Business is No. 1, a referral motion to the Joint Committee on Justice, Equality, Defence and Women's Rights to consider the report of the independent commission of inquiry into the murder of Seamus Ludlow, and the observations made thereon by former Commissioner Wren and Mr. Justice Barron, and to report back to Seanad Éireann by 31 March 2006, to be taken without debate; No. 2, Railway Safety Bill 2001 — Second Stage, to be taken on the conclusion of the Order of Business until 2 p.m., spokespersons have 15 minutes and other Senators have ten minutes and Members may share time, with the Minister to be called upon to reply not later than ten minutes before the conclusion of Second Stage. There is much interest in this Bill. There are seven or eight Members on this side who wish to speak and it may be the same on the other side of the House, so the debate does not have to end today.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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The Leader said "until2 p.m." and not "to conclude".
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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I know, but if it does not conclude, it will continue on another day.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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Exactly. No. 3, Employees (Provision of Information and Consultation) Bill 2005 — Report and Final Stages, to be taken at 2.30 p.m until 4 p.m. There will be a sos from 2 p.m. until 2.30 p.m.
Brian Hayes (Fine Gael)
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I would like to raise the issue of a new practice that seems to have been introduced in some of our schools, where such schools are now deliberately refusing to accept students with special needs. This story appeared in an article in The Irish Times this week. Some schools are cherry-picking students and refusing to accept special needs students. This is a new form of educational apartheid. When The Irish Times published a league table of schools in the Dublin area, it was quite clear that schools which had up to 30% of students with special needs were located in poorer communities, whereas schools which had less than 1% of students with special needs were schools in affluent areas. The Minister for Education and Science rightly spoke out against this practice in a recent conference, which I welcome. However, the Government and the Department of Education and Science should be absolutely clear that we made it unlawful for schools to introduce entrance exams, and that the new testing arrangements introduced by some schools are also unlawful. The Department needs to be strong on this issue because we have a responsibility in our schools to provide a learning environment for all students of all abilities, of all classes and of all creeds. This is an important aspect of Irish education that should not be lost.
When are we likely to debate the Ferns report? There is considerable interest in this report on all sides of the House. I join with Senator Quinn, who called for a debate yesterday on road safety. It is timely that we debate that matter. This afternoon, the Joint Committee on Justice, Equality, Defence and Women's Rights will receive the report by Mr. Justice Barron into the murder of Mr. Seamus Ludlow. The report will also be published, which I welcome. The report has been with the Government for the past 14 months. I understand that as late as last night, the family of Mr. Ludlow had not been informed that the report was to be published today. If this is the way we are treating victims, then that is abhorrent. We have a responsibility, when matters of such importance are brought to the attention of a committee or a plenary session of this House, to inform the families of those people.
Mary Henry (Independent)
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Will the Leader ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs to come into the House so he can update us on the deteriorating situation in Ethiopia? This is one of our priority countries in Africa. Members of the Oireachtas and former Members were very important in monitoring the election in May yet a satisfactory conclusion has not been reached even in respect of the results of that election. Yesterday a large number of unarmed people were killed in Addis Ababa. Our embassy in Ethiopia has been exemplary in recent months in trying to encourage all those involved in the political process to move forward. I was there a few weeks ago and I cannot but say that I was extremely distressed to read about the truly shocking casualties arriving at the hospitals I visited. We have put a great deal of time and effort into this country and we were very encouraged that progress was being achieved. I would be most grateful if the Leader could arrange a debate.
An issue the Leader raised in the House has come up again, namely, the transfer of prisoners from America, or other parts of the world, to places where they may be tortured. It is extraordinary to see the CIA express worry about this issue. Important members of both the Senate and Congress in America have said that these people are outside the rules of war. Do they have an idea of the danger in which they are placing their own personnel and military by expressing such views? The reason we have rules and the Geneva Convention is that everyone is protected. To hear people say this was truly dreadful. I first raised this issue when we debated the Transfer of Execution of Sentences Bill, which must have been nearly two years ago. Senator Norris and many others have raised the matter. However, we have not received a satisfactory answer as to what is happening in Shannon. If the Leader has any thoughts on what we can do about this issue, I would be most grateful to hear them. As the House has constantly expressed its concern about this issue, it must continue to do so in view of the voices being raised in America saying this is perfectly all right.
Brendan Ryan (Labour)
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In regard to what Senator Brian Hayes wants debated, it is worth recording that this country has the second highest level of income inequality in the OECD and is only surpassed by the United States. In the United States a debate is beginning in newspapers as diverse in their ideologies as The Washington Post and The Wall Street Journal about the implications of inequality. Hurricane Katrina brought it to people's attention. I would like the Leader to arrange a debate on inequality in Ireland, although there is no urgency because we will not solve it overnight. There is a huge issue of people being stuck, of social mobility and of class mobility declining in the United States and we do not want that to happen here, although I do not want to suggest for one second that the Government is endeavouring to turn us into such a rigid, class-based society.
On the matter raised by Senator Henry, this morning's edition of The Guardian suggests that prisoners are being interrogated for the United States in countries which are members of the European Union or are, at least in a couple of cases, aspiring to be members. If the EU does not guarantee that the standard of human rights it claims to uphold is being upheld in the teeth of pressure from the United States, then the whole concept of the EU as a space of freedom, democracy and human rights is gone. If even 30 prisoners in eastern Europe are regarded as not being covered by the rules by which the EU claims to be covered, then we are in serious trouble.
Will the Leader arrange an urgent debate on telecommunications? We now have the extraordinary situation where our privatised — disastrously, in my view — major telecommunications provider is apparently to be taken over by a Swiss state company. We have the situation where the Corrib gas field is, to a significant extent, owned by the Norwegian Government. I do not have any ideological baggage about privatisation but what is quite clear in this case is that it has been a monumental disaster. The reason broadband uptake is so bad is that Eircom cannot make money out of it and is endeavouring to hold on to its monopoly. We are coming to the stage where the question of returning the telecommunications network to public ownership is long overdue. If we do not return it to public ownership, we will end up building a parallel, publicly owned telecommunications network because Eircom clearly will not do the job.
Tom Morrissey (Progressive Democrats)
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I did not have an opportunity to participate in yesterday's Order of Business and raise the issue of transport. I would like to add my support to the debate which will take place in the next few weeks. The Government has set out its aspirations in regard to what it——
Tom Morrissey (Progressive Democrats)
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——requires of a modern economy over the next ten years. It is important the various operators are brought in to discuss how they will sequence the developments with which they have been charged. The sequencing and timing will be important. If the various operators are not brought into the discussions, we may well have replication of transport modes in the same territory. For example, the Dawson Street area is a public transport corridor for buses which carry thousands of people daily. If a Luas is to go down that route followed by an underground metro, there will be three public transport corridors in the one area. We must look at alternative routes. One of the reasons for the delay in the delivery of Luas was the diversion of utilities. We must consider whether it is necessary since it delayed the delivery of Luas to a great extent.
Little consideration has been given to the fact there is a road network which shows that all roads do not necessarily have to lead to Dublin. We now have a Dundalk to Nenagh axis and a Carrick-on-Shannon to Rosslare axis, which is very welcome.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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As the Senator said, we will be having a debate when he can raise all those matters.
Tom Morrissey (Progressive Democrats)
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As regards the Atlantic corridor, it is most important to put a timeframe on the completion of the Athenry to Ennis section to ensure the future viability of Shannon.
Michael Finucane (Fine Gael)
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The National Safety Council is a very well respected body and it is worth bearing in mind that last year, the Irish Insurance Federation gave it funding of €1.2 million and gave the same amount in 2001. Last year insurance companies made almost €400 million in profits and I regard the amount of money they gave to the National Safety Council as derisory. Last year the Government gave the council €4 million, at least €1 million of which was towards the metrification of signs.
In regard to the Government's safety strategy, it seems to be poor on delivery but good on promises.
Michael Finucane (Fine Gael)
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Only four of the 69 penalty point offences announced by the former Minister for Transport, Deputy Brennan, have been implemented. I would like the new Minister to come to the House to outline his plans on road safety and see whether they are different from those of the former Minister, so that we do not have this ongoing carnage on our roads.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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In regard to Senator Ryan, we will have to go back over the files on the Fine Gael-Labour coalition and the demolition of Irish Shipping, the dropping of the Athlone-Mullingar route and the fact it did not support the regional airport in Knock.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Ryan is becoming irritating.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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That is not relevant to the Order of Business.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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The Cathaoirleach has great patience. I would like to know what he knows about these matters.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator should confine himself to the Order of Business.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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The regional health forums will be established this autumn. In accordance with a newsletter circulated to all public representatives——
Fergal Browne (Fine Gael)
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We will probably read about them again.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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No. Senator Leyden cannot refer to publications.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Even though it is a good newsletter.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator cannot display the newsletter.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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If the Senator will not obey the Chair, he should resume his seat.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Pending the establishment of the health forums, the Leader should schedule regular debates on health.
Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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Issues such as hospital waiting lists.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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That would give us an opportunity to discuss different health issues.
The Leader is a former Minister for Public Enterprise. Will she intervene regarding the proposed strike at An Post? I appeal to the Communications Workers Union in this regard——
Michael Finucane (Fine Gael)
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What about a vote of no confidence in the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources?
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I appreciate the dispute has been referred to the national implementation body but if the strike takes place, it could sound the death knell for small post offices. Given the proposal by the Minister for Social and Family Affairs to make payments electronically-——
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator has been given great latitude. To be fair to other Members, he must conclude.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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We should play a role. We cannot stand by while a strike takes place.
Michael Finucane (Fine Gael)
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The Senator should get his Christmas cards out early.
David Norris (Independent)
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I strongly support Senator Henry's comments regarding so-called "extraordinary rendition". The phrase is sinister and it shows a slide in linguistic terms to use such euphemisms. It also calls into question the way in which the American Administration uses words such as "liberty", "freedom" and "democracy". It has devalued them to a point where they are absolutely meaningless. The Leader raised this matter on the Adjournment and she described the Government's response as "waffle". I can only agree with her. Senator Henry, the Leader and I have asked questions about this issue and we have been met with obfuscation.
The Gulfstream aeroplane passed through Shannon Airport repeatedly and it was involved in criminal activities such as the kidnapping and rendering of citizens to third countries for the purposes of torture. The excuse offered was that an unnamed official in the US Administration said the aeroplane was empty but that ignores the fact that part of American policy is plausible deniability. In other words, one should tell a lie in circumstances where one thinks one can get away with it. Even if the aeroplane was empty, that would be no excuse for refuelling and servicing it.
Would the Government have approved of the refuelling and servicing of empty cattle trains which it knew would be and had been used to transport Jewish people to Auschwitz? The principle is exactly the same. This issue needs to be investigated. A prima facie case can be made that a crime has been and continues to be committed under international law. Irish citizens have repeatedly given this information to the police at Shannon who have done absolutely nothing about it. Ireland is one of a number of countries that has been reported to a United Nations sub-committee to be investigated for complicity in this practice. This practice will backfire and it is the responsibly of this Parliament to make sure the appropriate people are made accountable.
Could the Leader arrange a debate on medical education? I have been contacted by a number of constituents who indicated their children had the required high number of points to enter medical school this year but they were disadvantaged. They were told there were no places in medical schools even though students from outside the European Union with lower grades were accepted as a money making exercise. Our first responsibility is to provide a medical education to our own students who have the appropriate qualifications.
I agree with Senator Morrissey. We should not attack somebody on this side of the House who raises intelligent questions about the Transport 21 plan. It is an important and exciting initiative but it needs to be monitored and Senator Morrissey is perfectly right to say so. I attended the launch of the document.
Timmy DooleyDavid Norris (Independent)
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I spoke to one of the people who will have a central role in its implementation about the timescale for the metro. He said the geology of Dublin is different and unique. If such arguments are trotted out again by senior people, we will be in trouble.
Michael Brennan (Progressive Democrats)
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Will the Leader ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government to clarify why a number of local authorities are making the establishment of management committees to administer private housing estates a condition of planning permission? This is causing a great deal of concern as householders must pay an annual charge to private management committees. However, they are questioning their legality, particularly as a condition of planning permission.
I support Senator Leyden's call on the Leader to use her good offices to ensure no postal strike takes place.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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Despite the pronouncements of the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs on the An Daingean-Dingle matter, the Transport 21 document clearly refers to Dingle.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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As the Leader is a conduit between the House and the Government, will she assure the House that this is official Government policy? This document was only published on Tuesday. I take it that is the up-to-date position and I look forward to hearing the Leader's reply.
The UK has 32,000 convenience stores and small shops. The Guardian reported yesterday that they are closing at the rate of 2,000 per annum and they are being gobbled up by the large multiples. A motion on the Order Paper states our communities "should be protected from predatory pricing by major multiples in order to seek choice and diversity in the food sector where multiples and local shops can compete on a level playing pitch". All Government Members will subscribe to that sentiment, as we do, and I would like the Leader's confirmation in this regard, given that the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment will bring the groceries order before Cabinet next Tuesday.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator is a good fellow to know things.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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Members should be conscious that a motion was passed regarding the allocation of time for the Order of Business.
11:00 am
Jim Walsh (Fianna Fail)
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I support Senator Brennan's comments regarding the decision of a number of local authorities to impose a planning condition requiring householders on private estates to establish a management committee, which results in charges of between €5,000 and €6,000 per annum. The Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government is checking whether there is a legal basis for this and local authorities may find themselves liable in this regard.
It was also reported that a local authority is charging a fee of €100 to applicants for social housing even though only a small percentage of them can hope to avail of such housing. Another local authority was taken to court regarding a tenant purchase. People had been failed administratively over a number of decades and not provided with contracts for their tenancies. As a consequence, local government is not functioning as envisaged. Will the Leader arrange for the Minister to come to the House for a debate on the empowerment of local democracy? The corporate policy groups provided for in legislation during the last session have not materialised. It is timely that we should have a debate on the empowerment of local councillors and the strengthening of local government.
Feargal Quinn (Independent)
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We should have the debate on transport very soon. Senator Norris referred to his enthusiasm for the metro while Senator Morrissey referred to a Dundalk to Nenagh axis. I travelled from Belfast and discovered that one cannot buy petrol or go to a toilet south of the Border without leaving the motorway. This decision by the National Roads Authority must be examined. Once one travels north of the Border, where petrol is more expensive, one can always purchase petrol without leaving the motorway. It is a decision I do not understand.
Yesterday a report stated that nursing homes are inspected only if they are private. I am not sure this is correct and would like the Leader to investigate. We do not need another debate on nursing homes but, if true, this is a serious situation.
Camillus Glynn (Fianna Fail)
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On the matter referred to by Senators Quinn and Leyden, the introduction of regional health fora should be done sooner rather than later. Some months ago, I received a letter stating this would take place in the near future. Nothing has happened. Regarding recent events in certain nursing homes and public institutions, the visiting committees of former health boards was an important watchdog. Regretfully, these no longer exist because we do not have representative fora.
On the matter referred to by Senator Norris, I asked the Leader about the number of doctors being trained. I am aware a report has been submitted to Government. It takes seven years to train a general practitioner so what happens in the meantime? In my political life of 26 years, this is the first time people are approaching me seeking a place on a doctor's panel. That a report has been submitted to Government is positive, but in the meantime how will people receive treatment? I ask the Leader to invite the Tánaiste and Minister for Health and Children to the House as a matter of urgency.
Mary WhiteCamillus Glynn (Fianna Fail)
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I call for debates on health every other day and this is one that must be prioritised because people cannot access a general practitioner.
Fergal Browne (Fine Gael)
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The long-awaited MRSA audit is due this afternoon, one and a half months behind schedule. I seek an early debate next week on that issue. It will be a major problem in the future and under the Health Act 1947 there is an onus on the health services to confine infectious diseases. We could be facing a major litigation battle if we do not act soon. The Government is not taking the issue as seriously as it should.
Marc MacSharry (Fianna Fail)
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I ask the Leader, as I have done many times over the last three years, to invite the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government to the House to debate local government funding. At this time, many local authorities are drafting estimates and unless we have a debate in the Houses of the Oireachtas and take appropriate steps we will see exorbitant increases in commercial rates. I am concerned that many small businesses will find it more difficult each year to pay 50% of the costs for services enjoyed by all. I seek this debate at the earliest convenience.
Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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Value for money in respect of tribunals of inquiry was another aspiration of Government. The Government has decided the reduction of fees to lawyers at tribunals will be postponed until June next year. We are asked to believe €39 billion will be spent over the next ten years yet a promise made by the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on numerous occasions cannot be honoured. He should be asked to explain to this House why the fees are not being reduced as a matter of urgency.
Maurice Cummins (Fine Gael)
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Perhaps the Leader can invite the Minister for Education and Science to explain why repeat students are charged €236 when it costs €90 to sit the leaving certificate for the first time. Several hard-pressed parents seek an answer to this discrepancy.
Eamon Scanlon (Fianna Fail)
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I support Senator Leyden's call to bring An Post and the Communications Workers Union together. The losers are the postmen and postwomen in rural Ireland and the people serviced by these workers. The British and French postal service are hovering like vultures, ready to cherry-pick the market in the greater urban areas. The major losers will be those who live on boreens throughout the country. As a gesture of goodwill, can An Post pay the Sustaining Progress increment to pensioners who have been waiting since 2001?
Eamon Scanlon (Fianna Fail)
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Young workers may be able to survive without the increases but pensioners have no time to wait for An Post and the CWU to engage.
Joe McHugh (Fine Gael)
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Figary Water Sports Development Company Limited is a private company in Donegal involved in the development of a marina in Fahan, north Donegal since 1998. Some €4 million of its money has been invested to date. Since 1998 it has lobbied for Government assistance or cross-Border funding. Two issues are outstanding and I believe solutions can be found through departmental intervention. These issues involve a bond and rental payment prior to 1998. Efforts should be made to contact the Department to resolve this because the project is ideal. While various projects in Donegal are awaiting funding, this one is proactive, community-based and involves yachts and sailing clubs. There is great potential for the economic and social infrastructure of Donegal. I ask for the Leader's intervention on this issue with the Department of Communications, Marine and Natural Resources.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Hayes raised the new practice of cherry-picking students of second level schools. Though there may be an entrance examination for the school, another examination is set so the school can thoroughly examine their entrants. This practice is despicable. The article in The Irish Times was interesting because it was to the point. A student may have potential but not academic honours. That student should be catered for and teachers are available for such exigencies. Some schools seek to develop a class culture whereby only an elite will attend. In turn, students at these schools will achieve the best results. It is a terrible educational path and we are due a visit from the Minister for Education and Science, which I will endeavour to arrange.
Senator Brian Hayes referred to the Ferns report and the debate on this will take place in two weeks. Senator Hayes also referred to a debate on the road safety report. The Senator also questioned if the Ludlow family knew this report would issue. I will verify this though I am sure the family did know. I cannot conceive of the family not being aware of the report on a loved one going to committee and being issued. I will make inquiries on this matter.
Senator Henry sought an update on the situation in Ethiopia from the Minister for Foreign Affairs. She also raised a question about the transfer of prisoners legislation, but it is said that such prisoners are outside the rules of war at Shannon Airport. I fail to see why, however, and stonewalling was what I received in the reply. Everybody has endeavoured through various conduits to obtain a proper answer about what is happening there, but none of us has been able to do so. I just do not know what is happening and I am at the end of my tether. I thought the Adjournment debate might yield some useful answers, but it did not.
Senator Ryan spoke about inequality in Ireland and said that some of the prisoners are being helped by aspirant EU countries. He also sought a debate on telecommunications. The difficulty is that Eircom will not unbundle the local loop, which is the last half mile. The company has been at that for the past seven years, but will not unbundle the local loop. It is like a mantra but I do not see why it cannot do so. It will have to do it because the regulator is going to pounce any day now. Eircom thinks it should not have to unbundle the loop, but it will have to under European law.
Senator Morrissey has unbridled enthusiasm for the Transport 21 plan, while Senator Norris is invigorated about it. We will be having a debate on that plan and I expect to see both Senators in full voice on that occasion. Senator Morrissey made the point, which I think is fair, that various operators should co-operate. He does not want different modes of transport running on the one street. Senator Tuffy is in the happy position, as she told us yesterday, that she will have four modes of transport in Lucan.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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I composed a poem about it yesterday —"Oh to be in Lucan now that transport's here". Senator Tuffy will have access to the metro, Luas and heavy rail as well as bus corridors.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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She will certainly whizz about, will she not? I hope she gets through her convention, but that is another day's work.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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The Leader should speak about today's Order of Business.
Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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Selection conventions can be difficult for many people.
Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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Order please. I call the Leader to reply on today's Order of Business.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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Exactly. They are only trying to wind me up, a Chathaoirligh. I rely on you to maintain order.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Finucane referred to the National Safety Council in the context of road accidents. I will try to arrange a debate on road safety next week. Senator Quinn has also been seeking such a debate for some time. Senator Finucane also said that the Insurance Federation of Ireland is patting itself on the back about how much it has given. In light of the huge profits involved, however, the sum is quite derisory, as the Senator said.
Senator Leyden wants an ongoing debate on health pending the establishment of the relevant fora. He also wants action to be taken to avert the threatened strike at An Post, even though the matter has gone before the national implementation body.
Senator Norris mentioned the waffling responses concerning US flights into and out of Shannon. He said the flights constituted a breach of international law. He also referred to medical education and the Transport 21 initiative and we will have a good debate on those matters. I hope that everybody who has raised these matters will be here to debate them when they come before the House.
Senator Brennan raised the issue of management committees in local authorities. It has become a feature of planning in some local authorities that management committees are established to run new housing estates. Such business plans must also provide parking facilities. Although planning applications can be well thought out and structured, the new provisos are becoming penal for planners. It is wrong to make the establishment of a management committee a feature of planning applications. I personally think it is not legal to do so.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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I will ask the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government to attend the House to address those issues. Yesterday, I received a letter about this matter, which is how I became aware of it.
Senator Coghlan spoke about convenience stores falling by the wayside in Britain. The Senator knows everything about the groceries order, but he noses around all the time.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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I thought Senator O'Rourke was the informant.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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I did not tell the Senator anything about the groceries order. However, Senator Coghlan raised a valid point about Dingle — that on future road maps the town will appear as Dingle, not An Daingean. That was clever.
Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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I take it that is the Government's position.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Jim Walsh referred to the proposed local authority corporate policy groups. It is a great name, but we do not know what it means. He stated that only private nursing homes are being inspected. It is as if there is a veneer of incompetency because I would not believe entirely in public nursing homes.
Senator Glynn raised the issue of health fora, but I understood that matter had already been raised on an Adjournment motion last week or the week before.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Glynn and Senator Henry also raised a question concerning doctors' training. As I understand it, the entrance parameters will be widened considerably come the next academic year. The Senators asked what people will do in the interim, but one cannot produce doctors in one year. They are not available in such a short time because their training lasts seven years. I hope we will have a debate on the matter soon, however.
Senator Browne sought a debate on the MRSA report, which is due to be published this afternoon.
Senator MacSharry raised the matter of local government funding. The Small Firms Association and IBEC are up in arms about this. Small businesses in particular are finding it difficult to cope with business rates. I have come across that issue on several occasions. Do local authorities require the bevy of programme managers, area assistants and all the rest that they have? There is a huge amount of staffing, yet one cannot find the relevant person when one telephones because they have gone to another seminar.
Senator Cummins said the proposed reduction of legal fees has been put off until next June. I do not know what influences were brought to bear in that matter, but I noticed it and was quite upset about it. The Senator also asked why the repeat fee for the leaving certificate examination was €236, while the initial fee is €90. As students have had an initial whack at the leaving certificate, it costs that much to repeat it.
Senator Scanlon raised the dispute at An Post and asked that money due under Sustaining Progress be paid to the company's pensioners. We would all agree with that because they are not a party to this dispute.
Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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Senator McHugh referred to a company that is developing a marina in Inishowen. There are two issues involved: first, the company has invested €4 million, and, second, the issue concerns the bond and rental payment. Those matters are delaying the development of the marina.