Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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The Order of Business is No. 1, statements on the Fourth Report of the Expert Group on Future Skills Needs, to be taken at the conclusion of the Order of Business and to conclude not later than 2 p.m, with the contributions of spokespersons not to exceed 12 minutes, those of all other Senators not to exceed ten minutes, Members may share time and the Minister to be called upon to reply not later than five minutes before the conclusion of the statements.

Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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Before I call Senator Finucane, I remind Senators that I will call the Leader to reply to the Order of Business, as agreed yesterday by motion, not later than 30 minutes after the business is proposed. That means Senators must be brief in their contributions and the Chair will be able to call all Senators offering. The Order of Business only allows Senators to ask a question about the business proposed that day and forthcoming legislation or to request a debate on a particular matter. While the Chair has always allowed latitude to group leaders, lengthy or detailed contributions by other Senators are not in order. I also remind Senators that after I call the Leader to reply, I cannot allow a Senator to interrupt her or to add to his or her original contribution.

Michael Finucane (Fine Gael)
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I have raised the necessity for a radiotherapy unit in the Mid-Western Health Board area on previous occasions. More than €6 million has been collected to fund this resource and it would be budget neutral as far as the State is concerned. The unit would treat both public and private patients. A deputation will meet the Minister for Health and Children next week and I trust he will accede to its demand to establish a radiotherapy unit in the mid-west region.

Prior to Christmas, I raised an issue relating to Filipino nurses. The workers of ten new EU member states will have freedom of access to the economy from 1 May. There is an acute shortage of nurses and I ask the Leader to take up with the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, as a matter of urgency, the case of the husbands of Filipino nurses who accompany them to Ireland so that they can obtain work permits and it will be financially viable for the nurses to remain in the State and address our skills shortage.

Joe O'Toole (Independent)
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Yesterday there was a call for a discussion on Aer Rianta and it is appropriate that should take place now that the heat is gone out of the situation. It is a pity the father of the House, my colleague, Senator Ross, is not present to recognise that industrial relations structures sorted out the difficulties yesterday and we are moving on. It would be appropriate to have a discussion on Aer Rianta and the Minister's transport policy at a time when people are not under serious pressure. The Fine Gael spokesperson was unable to take up a position on the matter in the absence of the information the unions seek. That is all people are looking for.

I asked prior to Christmas for a debate on the proposals on new pension arrangements for the public service, including politicians. I would be interested in the views of Government Members who have a difficulty with the idea of jobs for life and a Government policy, which will have people working until they are 80 or 90 years as long as they stagger in every morning with their Zimmer frames. It would be appropriate to examine this issue before we take the Finance Bill. The INTO is dealing with the issue from the point of view of teachers and we should examine it from the point of view of politicians. This relates to other issues such as attracting people into politics and providing promotional prospects to workers. The issue should be discussed in a non-party way. I would appreciate it if a debate could be held on the public service pension proposals before we are tied into the Finance Bill, which is currently being dreamed up in a corner of the Department of Finance, which has never been our friend.

Joanna Tuffy (Labour)
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I refer to a report in the Irish Examiner today about the distribution of apparent pornographic images of a schoolgirl via mobile phones. The wide availability of pornography needs to be debated in the House. An EU report published last week found that 70% of Internet sales relate to pornography. We should do what we can to limit, control and monitor the availability of pornography. Many people who consider themselves to be good download pornography and one thing we need to do is to educate our young people so that when they consider viewing pornography, they bring their consciences into play and think about what lies behind these images.

Men of all ages view images of young women and very often these involve young, vulnerable women being exploited. People need to think about this and the issue must be addressed in our education system and by the media. Many people involved in the adult pornography industry are also involved in child pornography and trafficking. Their sole motivation is profit and they do not care about the morality of what they do. Many people use pornography but they should consider what is behind it and bring their consciences into play.

Paschal Mooney (Fianna Fail)
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The House will be reassured I do not intend to return to the political disruption of Leitrim. I refer to the legislation published in the past few weeks relating to changes in constituencies for the European elections. It would be helpful if the Leader could outline the process involved in the report of the independent electoral commission on the revision of the constituencies, when the Government intends, as I assume it will, to accept the recommendations, as has been the precedent, and when the legislation will be drafted and come before the House because it has many implications nationally.

When will the Bill relating to the change in the European constituencies come before the House? Will it be initiated in the Seanad or the Dáil? I am astonished, considering the dominance of the provinces of Ulster, Leinster, Munster, and Connacht in European sport, that a recommendation of the commission has been accepted in the legislation. It is proposed that these historic names will be dispensed with and in future the constituencies will be referred to as Ireland West, Ireland South and Ireland East. It is extraordinary that there has not been a word in the media about this recommendation. This is an indication of the apathy that exists on European matters even though it is an important time as we hold the Presidency.

A debate will take place on the priorities of our European Presidency. Following recent allegations relating to Mr. Sharon and his political future and the Minister for Foreign Affair's meeting with him representing the Presidency, I would be grateful if the Leader would make time available to discuss the Middle East.

Paul Coghlan (Fine Gael)
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I wish to clarify an issue I raised yesterday. What I had in mind was the encroachment of sheep on the 26,000 acres of national park land and the escape therefrom of the Irish red deer herd, which is protected. A number of matters have gone awry recently and I do not refer to English people travelling to the area. Red deer have been hunted and slaughtered so that their antlers can be displayed as trophies.

When will the Industrial Relations (Amendment) Bill 2003 be introduced?

Terry Leyden (Fianna Fail)
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I refer to Senator Tuffy's contribution and the article in the Irish Examiner. The Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources should conduct an immediate examination of the abuse of video phones. Their use is not allowed in public areas and the same should apply in schools and elsewhere. These video phones and most other telephones must now be left in a safe place before one enters this Chamber or many schools and other buildings. This incident has come to the attention of the public but other information has become available because of these video phones being used to abuse people. Some people here might prefer if their images were not taken on the morning after the night before and transmitted around the world.

The video phone is a tremendous innovation and great use can be made of it but the abuse being highlighted in the Irish Examiner is just an example of what is going on at the moment. The Minister should bring regulations forward on the control of the use and abuse of video phones.

John Paul Phelan (Fine Gael)
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I do not think the issue of the national stadium has been discussed in the House. An announcement was made by the IRFU and the FAI yesterday regarding a proposal for the stadium. I urge the Leader to persuade the Minister to come to the House to hear the views of Senators on this issue. I am not aware of a previous debate in the House on this very important matter, which has dragged on for far too long. I am glad to hear yesterday's announcement by the IRFU and FAI, which makes their position quite clear.

We are led to believe the Government's decision on this issue is imminent although we were led to believe this before and no decision was made. Before the Government makes a decision, the Minister should come to the House and discuss the issue with Senators.

John Gerard Hanafin (Fianna Fail)
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I share Senator Tuffy's concern about the abuse of video phones. It is not beyond the capabilities of technology to block all mobile telephones and prevent pornography being transmitted. Companies make huge profits and it would not be unreasonable to ask them to undertake this measure voluntarily in order that we can protect our young people.

John Minihan (Progressive Democrats)
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I support Senator Tuffy's call regarding the use of telephones. The story in the Irish Examiner is not exaggerated. The case referred to has been the talk of Cork for the past fortnight. It is distressing for the families involved and it is appalling that such an image should be passed among adults and schoolchildren. I call on the Leader to ask the Internet Advisory Board to look at this matter and to work in tandem with the telephone companies. We have a serious problem here, particularly among young children and with pay-as-you-go telephones which have no traceability and with which people can download or take pictures and circulate them without being traced. This is of serious concern and must be addressed immediately.

The story has not been jazzed up in any way. It is factual and is the talk of the place. As public representatives, we have a responsibility to address this matter.

Labhrás Ó Murchú (Fianna Fail)
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I was impressed by Senator Tuffy's honest and sincere contribution on the pornography issue. Her concerns are justified because the pornography industry is one of the biggest in the world at present and millions of vulnerable people are being exploited by it. Most worrying of all are the faceless investors who make large sums of money from the industry. Every legislature throughout the world must take a stand on this issue. Pornography is sheer exploitation and is doing terrible damage, particularly to young people who are no longer given the opportunity to enjoy their youth. I fully support Senator Tuffy's call for a debate.

Maurice Hayes (Independent)
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I must declare an interest in pornography. Perhaps I should rephrase that and say I have an interest in its regulation. I am the lay adviser to RegTel, which regulates premium rates telephone lines. In fact, I spent some time yesterday grappling with the problem, which Senator Tuffy and others have so graphically outlined. The protection of young people from exploitation and obscenity is a real problem.

There are real technical problems. There is currently an attempt to introduce a PIN system but, as Senator Minihan has said, it is very difficult to catch the people who are using pay-as-you-go telephones. Another problem is that the vast bulk of this stuff originates outside the State or outside the European Union. However, I welcome the call for a debate. It would be a healthy thing to have it.

When the Minister for Transport comes to the House will he be able to tell us the position regarding air marshals in planes? We all know that we need security but what reasonable alternatives have been canvassed and what would be the position of Irish carriers?

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I call for a debate on human rights during our EU Presidency. Amnesty International has asked Ireland to place emphasis on human rights during the course of the Presidency and I call for a debate on the matter in the House.

Today, Mr. Chris Patten, the External Relations Commissioner is arriving in Bogota, Colombia and is demanding that the Colombian Government conform to the Human Rights Convention of the EU.

Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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That matter is not relevant to the Order of Business.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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Colombia has the worst record on human rights in the hemisphere.

Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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It may be in order to raise that matter during a debate but not on the Order of Business.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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I want Members to know that Mr. Niall Andrews MEP, and I will be travelling to Colombia next week to meet the prisoners.

Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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The Senator should resume her seat.

Mary White (Fianna Fail)
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These men have not been found guilty of the offence with which they have been charged and should be released immediately.

Camillus Glynn (Fianna Fail)
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I strongly support the remarks of Senators Tuffy and Ó Murchú on the important matters they raised. I ask the Leader to arrange a debate on mobile telephone charges. The contrast between charges in this country and those in other EU states is an outrage and a scandal. I strongly support the remarks of Senator Coghlan regarding people who are indiscriminately shooting some of our wild species. Those people will shoot anything that moves, including our song birds. They should not be let within the bawl of an ass of this country, let alone given a gun.

I ask the Leader, in co-operation with Senators MacSharry and Kenneally, to have amending legislation brought forward on the operation of jet-skis and ski boats. We all know what happened in Cobh when a young boy lost his life. I do not wish to be a kill-joy but some users of these craft do not seem to realise that there are other lake users. Something must be done as the law is inadequate. Local authorities have a pivotal role to play and I ask the Leader and Senators MacSharry and Kenneally to liaise with the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government in bringing forward amending legislation as a matter of urgency.

Ulick Burke (Fine Gael)
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Will the Leader request the Minister for Health and Children to review his position regarding the Hanly report? The British Health Secretary recently made a statement which contradicts the view of our Minister that major centres of excellence are the best way to deliver an adequate health service. He said that biggest is not best and, having realised the mistake they made in the delivery of health services in Britain, the best way to deliver such services is through well equipped and well staffed local hospitals. It is a pity our Minister plans to expend great resources on spin doctors to sell the Hanly report when it is clear that method of delivering health services is a failure. Why should we adopt a system that we now know is a failure? The Leader should ask the Minister to immediately review his position on the Hanly report.

Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)
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I support the comments of my colleague Senator Ulick Burke on the Hanly report. The Leader should ask the Minister for Health and Children to clarify the position regarding Beaumont Hospital. Recently a young man lay in Mayo General Hospital for three weeks before he could be moved to Beaumont Hospital. This is not the first time this has happened at Beaumont Hospital. That young man would still be in Mayo General Hospital were it not for RTE highlighting the case. It is outrageous that Beaumont Hospital has no helicopter landing facilities. We need a full debate on this matter.

Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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The acting leader of the Opposition, Senator Finucane, spoke about the programme on television, which I saw, about the €6 million that has been gathered for a radiotherapy unit in the mid-west region. It is easy to see both points of view. While the money has been gathered, it is contrary to Government policy on the provision of such units. I hope the meeting today with the Minister for Health and Children, Deputy Martin, goes well. Perhaps they will reach some amicable resolution to this issue. It is difficult because so much money has been contributed freely and voluntarily. I recognise the Senator's long-standing interest in the matter.

The issue of the spouses of Filipino nurses has been resolved and Senator Finucane played his part. He also made a point about the accession countries. We should not wait for another impasse but plan ahead to ensure the husbands and wives of nurses will be allowed to take up work here. This should be permissible because the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Deputy McDowell, made clear in a radio interview this morning that those coming from all accession countries will be most welcome here. However, this position should be regularised in time.

Senator O'Toole mentioned Aer Rianta on which we could have a useful discussion. He also sought a debate on the new pension arrangements for the public service. While we know we should have such a debate on that matter and how it will affect people, there are many who wish to work who do not necessarily use Zimmer frames. Even if they do, it merely signifies that something has happened to them. I found it somewhat grating and I will say so to Senator O'Toole when I meet him. The Government is providing for people to work after the defined retirement age if they wish to do so. This is a positive aspect of the measure.

The UK is already moving in this direction and is positively encouraging older people back to the workforce. Speaking as one who, while I hope it will not be the case, could need a Zimmer frame in a few years I did not like the Senator's remark. We all know elderly people and how valiantly they try to make their way in the world. They do their best to go about their daily lives, going shopping and socialising in spite of the fact that many of them have disabilities.

Senator Tuffy asked for a debate on the widespread availability of pornography. I met Ms Audrey Conlon, chairwoman of the Internet Advisory Board to discuss the preparation of a Bill. I said on "The Marion Finucane Show" that Senator Daly and I were preparing such a Bill, which is now very timely. We all want the world to be free and the Internet is a wonderful tool. However, it has huge dangers as it has no country boundaries and covers the world. While in some aspects this is terrific, when ill used it is a huge cause of crime. Large companies should use their money to introduce some locking devices. I know the adage that parents should keep their children away from such sites. However, children may have computers in their bedrooms. While it is good to see them literate in that way, there are considerable dangers as their minds are not formed and they do not have the discerning ability or critical faculties to enable them to sift. While it is possible to turn off a television in a sitting room, it is not so easy with a computer in a child's bedroom. We will seek a debate on that matter.

In response to Senator Mooney, I have been told that the Bill relating to the European Parliament constituencies will be taken in the Dáil in mid-February. It will be dealt with in this Seanad term. We all grew up with and know about the historical delineation of the provinces into Cúige Chonnacht, Cúige Uladh, Cúige Laighean and Cúige Mumhan. However, nobody said a word when the constituencies were changed to Ireland West, Ireland South and Ireland East. We are also considering when we can schedule a debate on the Middle East.

I understood the remarks Senator Coghlan made yesterday about the sheep, the red deer and the national park in Killarney. We will take the Industrial Relations (Amendment) Bill 2003 in about two weeks. Senator Leyden agreed with the comments of Senator Tuffy. Senator John Paul Phelan asked for a debate on the national stadium, which has never been debated here. This might be a useful matter to debate on the Adjournment.

Senator Hanafin mentioned that there should be a mechanism for companies that are making such huge sums of money to block mobile telephones and prevent pornography being transmitted. Senator Minihan also mentioned the Internet and I met the chairwoman of the Internet Advisory Board. The story from Cork is true and it is time to address the laxity that exists in this matter. We need to be conscious of the sensibilities of young girls and vulnerable people wherever they are and the way they are being attacked. Senator Ó Murchú agreed with this and referred to it as sheer exploitation. Senator Maurice Hayes also spoke about this matter, which is in the realm of the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform. The Senator also asked whether we would see the introduction of air marshals. I believe that would also be a useful matter to debate on the Adjournment.

I agree with Senator White in calling for a debate on human rights because we said we would keep a close eye on such matters during our Presidency. I also wish her well with her visit next week. Senator Glynn also mentioned the Internet scandal and phone charges. He referred to the indiscriminate shooting of wildlife and called for legislation covering jet-skis. We should ask the Minister to come to the House and speak to us about this matter. This matter might also be suitable for a debate on the Adjournment.

I saw the recent statement by the British Health Secretary, which Senator Ulick Burke mentioned in the context of the Hanly report. However, the UK is a huge country and Ireland is much smaller. The recommendations of the Hanly report will be implemented and the board has been appointed. The Minister is putting his back into this matter and I believe the outcome will be very good. While excellence is required at all levels, local, county, etc, patients should go to the big centres for the treatment of major complaints. Senator Paddy Burke mentioned the horrendous case of the man from Castlebar who was trying to get into Beaumont Hospital. His parents were distraught about the matter.

A Chathaoirligh, must the Order of Business be completed within half an hour, including the time for those who speak from the floor and my reply?

Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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No. The Leader is called upon to reply 30 minutes after the Order of Business has been announced.

Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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I misunderstood. I was of the opinion that we only had 30 minutes for the entire Order of Business and I was rushing to get through my reply.

Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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When the Leader announces the Order of Business, there are 30 minutes in which Members may pose questions or raise matters before she is called upon to reply.

Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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That is fine. I thought the Cathaoirleach was looking at me in a severe manner.

Rory Kiely (Fianna Fail)
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I might have been admiring the Leader.

Mary O'Rourke (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Cathaoirleach.