Seanad debates

Wednesday, 20 June 2012

3:00 pm

Photo of Feargal QuinnFeargal Quinn (Independent)

The point we are making is not merely about whether we should have a second House but about whether that debate should take place in the constitutional convention. It seems to make sense that it should.

I offer a second example, one that was quite dramatic and which a number of us will remember. I forget how many years ago it happened but a proposal had gone through the Dáil that public opinion polls should not be published for the three weeks before an election. It passed through the Dáil and that House went into recess. That evening, in this House, we carried it on to Committee Stage. The then Senator, now Deputy Shane Ross, had a proposal which pointed out the ludicrous situation whereby there would be no public opinion polls for the three weeks prior to an election, not until the midnight before the election took place. Can Members picture how idiotic that would be? Suddenly, on the morning of the election, the television cameras, the radio stations and all the newspapers would carry the news that there had been a big swing, for or against. It was the most ridiculous thing but this had not been noticed in the other House.

This is only a reminder of the value of having a second look at every piece of legislation. That is the reason this matter should be discussed in the constitutional convention and not merely discussed as a question of Seanad reform. If there is going to be Seanad reform, the very aspect the constitutional conventional will look at is how we can make it a more healthy body, one that will be more efficient, that will work better.

The point that will crop up very early on, and the constitutional convention is surely the place for it, is how we should elect the Members. Senator Norris has spoken on this today and there is little doubt that the Independent Members can speak on this. I understand that in the first 14 years of the original Senate, from 1922 to 1936, there were no Whips. This played a very valuable role because all Senators were, in effect, individual independent Members. Looking back, one of the best uses of this House was during the years 1994 to 1997, when the Government of the day did not have a majority in this House. Those of us who were here then, five Independent Members, held the balance of power. It was great fun. The Leader will remember that time, too, because the Government had to be nice to us in regard to any item it wished to get passed. It had to have at least three of the five of us to agree. I am sure that on occasions we made mistakes but it was a very healthy Seanad and a very healthy Government. It achieved a very great deal and on that basis it balanced out.

I mention that because the case I make is not about how we reform the Seanad - if we do so. I am sure it must and will be reformed. My point is that it is essential that there be a second House, whatever it is called. It is essential that we do not have a constitutional convention that studies the Constitution while knowing that as soon as that convention is over the Government intends to make a change that will bring about at least 70 changes to the Constitution. It seems ridiculous. If we are going to have a debate in the form of a constitutional convention it must include a debate on the institution of the Seanad because the abolition of the House would change things so very much that it would become a laughing stock. It would not make sense to have that convention and ignore what is coming immediately afterwards. This needs very serious consideration but the solution is simple.

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