Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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4. To ask the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment when subminimum pay rates for young workers will be abolished; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [50574/25]

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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In the run-up to last year's general election, the Government promised to abolish subminimum wage rates for young workers. When will it do it? Will this turn into another broken promise to workers and young people, alongside a week's sick pay and the promise of a living wage?

Peter Burke (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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I am not aware of making any such promise. I want to be very clear on that. The National Minimum Wage Acts allow for lower or subminimum rates of the minimum wage for employees aged 20 years and younger. Those aged less than 18 years can be paid 70% of the full minimum wage rate, while those aged 18 and 19 years can be paid 80% and 90%, respectively, of the full rate. As the Deputy is aware, the Low Pay Commission recommended the abolition of subminimum rates in March 2024. The commission highlighted in its report that this is a very complex issue. It said the Government will need to give its findings and recommendations detailed consideration and deliberation and highlighted the potential need for the Government to take its own legal advice on the matter.

It is important to acknowledge the challenges the enterprise sector has faced over the past number of years. We know that the use of subminimum youth rates is largely concentrated in the accommodation, food and retail sectors, and these sectors have reported facing considerable cost pressures. As part of the measures designed to bolster business resilience and support competitiveness, earlier this year the Government agreed to defer a decision on the subminimum rates until 2029. The decision should be considered in the context of the recent significant increases in the minimum wage which show that the Government continues to commit to fair wages for the lowest paid workers in our economy, but also in the context of the Government's introduction of a range of measures to assist workers, including a statutory sick pay scheme, the right to request remote working and other supports.

It is also important to highlight the very real progress we have made in raising the national minimum wage over recent years. Since 2020, the national minimum wage has increased by 33.7%, from €10.10 to today's rate of €13.50. In 2024, there was a significant uplift of 12%, or €1.40, in the minimum wage. This year, the minimum wage increased by 80 cent, an increase of over 6%. These increases were well ahead of inflation and projected wage growth in the economy and have brought about substantial and real wage growth for the lowest paid workers in our economy.

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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Did I hear the Minister correctly? Did he say he will not do it until 2029? Is that what he said?

Peter Burke (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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This is not an over and back exchange. The Deputy can make his contribution.

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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It is an over and back exchange. That is the nature of the format. The Minister said the rate would not be changed until 2029 or he would consider it at that stage. I ask him to clarify that. It is incredible. We introduced a Bill to get rid of this legalised superexploitation of young people in 2022, which was passed on Second Stage. It would have gotten rid of the rate in 2023, with a timed amendment. The Government said at the time that it had to wait for a report from the Low Pay Commission. The report came out in 2024 and was absolutely clear and unanimous that the Government should get rid of the superexploitation.

At that stage, I remember at a committee meeting the Government said it would produce an economic impact report. Last September, the committee was told it would take six to nine months, but there is still no sign of the new economic impact report. The Government is kicking the can down the road. The Minister is now saying that this will now be changed in 2029, and will not even give a commitment to do it. A 19-year-old cannot pay 90% of their rent to their landlord. An 18-year-old cannot pay 80% of their grocery bill. A 17-year-old cannot pay 70% of the price of petrol. It is scandalous.

Peter Burke (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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The Government's commitment is to defer the decision to 2029. We will publish the data behind that shortly. It should be noted what the commission actually said on subminimum rates. It is not exactly what the Deputy quoted. It stated:

The Low Pay Commission recommends that sub-minimum wage rates for employees who are 18 and 19 years of age should be abolished no sooner than 1 January 2025.

Contrary to what the Deputy said at the very outset, I did not make any commitment to abolish the subminimum rates. It is important to be aware that approximately 5% of 19-year-olds receive subminimum rates. The majority of workers in those cohorts are above the level of the minimum wage. Critically, the increases of recent years have been ahead of wage growth in the economy and ahead of inflation. That is combined with support from the statutory sick pay scheme, an increase in the minimum wage, banning zero-hour contracts, the introduction of legislation on tips and the introduction of auto-enrolment from 1 January.

In another question, the Deputy asks about increasing the minimum wage to €17, an increase of approximately 30%, which is six times the growth rate of wages and our economy. When combined with auto-enrolment and other increases, it would leave this country without any jobs. Deputy Murphy does not have an iota of what it takes to run the enterprise economy. He does not know what it means to employ people. He does not know the value of the 2.81 million people who are going to work in our country every single day. The policies the Deputy brings forward would close down the enterprise economy.

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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The Minister's bluster will not disguise what is a viciously anti-worker and anti-young person policy. The Minister is saying that 19-year-olds, 18-year-olds and 17-year-olds do not deserve to get the minimum wage - the inadequate minimum wage - in the middle of a cost-of-living crisis. The Minister is saying that people who go to work and do the same work as the workers next door to them, who happen to be a little bit older, are not entitled to the minimum wage. Some 15,000 young people are affected by this. The Minister is telling them there is no chance of getting the minimum wage until 2029. That is scandalous.

I will repeat the point. People who are 19 years of age cannot pay 90% of their rent. People who are 18 years of age cannot pay 80% of the grocery bill. People who are 17 years of age cannot pay 70% of the price of petrol. The Minister thinks it is okay for employers to superexploit young people by paying them less than the minimum wage. The Fine Gael agenda has been exposed. It is an absolutely disgusting policy.

Peter Burke (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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I am proud of the role the Government has played in improving the rights of employees. The Deputy spoke about rhetoric. Every decision he puts across to us is binary. He does not consider the potential impact such decisions would have on education pathways for young people and the unintended consequences. He does not consider training. He referred to 19-year-olds and 18-year-olds. I can tell him right now that 5% of 19-year-olds are on subminimum rates. That shows us the opportunity in our economy and the pathways currently available. Everything has to be taken in the round. I can demonstrate to the Deputy that there was a 12% increase in the minimum wage rate last year, ahead of wage growth and inflation. Subminimum rates also increased last year. We plan to continue the trajectory of improving conditions for workers. I also have a responsibility to make sure those jobs are there. A corner shop in a small village may be struggling with costs, but the Deputy wants to increase its wage costs to €17 per hour.

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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This question is about subminimum rates.

Peter Burke (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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That is what the Deputy's proposal will do. Let us be clear about it. He would close down every small business in the country if he had his way and he was running the country.

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, Solidarity)
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If they cannot afford to pay the minimum wage, they should not be in business.

Peter Burke (Longford-Westmeath, Fine Gael)
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The Deputy does not have any balance. He does not know what it means to keep good high-value jobs in our economy.