Pádraig O'Sullivan (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail)
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11. To ask the Taoiseach and Minister for Defence if he will provide an update on the implementation of the working time directive in the Defence Forces; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [14185/23]

John Brady (Wicklow, Sinn Fein)
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34. To ask the Taoiseach and Minister for Defence if he will provide an update on plans to implement the working time directive for the Defence Forces; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [14314/23]

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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43. To ask the Taoiseach and Minister for Defence his plans to ensure the Defence Forces conform with the working time directive as per the recommendations in the Report of the Commission on the Future of the Defence Forces; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [13684/23]

Pádraig O'Sullivan (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail)
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I would like the Minister to provide an update on the implementation of the working time directive in the Defence Forces and make a statement on the matter.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 11, 34 and 43 together.

As I have already advised, the Defence Forces are currently excluded from the provisions of the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997, which transposed the EU working time directive into Irish law. I assure the Deputies that the Government remains fully committed to ensuring the provisions of the working time directive are applied, where appropriate, to the Defence Forces. This is in line with a Government commitment to remove the blanket exemption in the Organisation of Working Time Act for both the Defence Forces and An Garda Síochána.

The Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment is responsible for preparing the legislation and my officials are working with that Department. The removal of the blanket exemption in the Organisation of Working Time Act for the Defence Forces is a complex matter given the nature of some military activities. A significant amount of work already undertaken by military management has determined that a high percentage of the normal everyday work of the Defence Forces is in compliance with the working time directive.

Recent European case law has been clear that certain activities, due to their specific nature, can be considered outside the scope of the directive. The provisions of this ruling have duly informed the proposed management position, which has as its guiding principle the fundamental requirement to ensure that appropriate rights and protections concerning health and safety are afforded to serving members, while also ensuring the Defence Forces can continue to fulfil their essential State functions.

A robust time and attendance system is also essential in ensuring the provisions of the working time directive are properly afforded to serving members of the Defence Forces, and bringing this work forward is a priority.

Dialogue with the representative associations on the proposed management position is continuing through a subcommittee of the conciliation and arbitration scheme, and I am aware that a number of issues raised by the associations are actively being examined by both civilian and military management, respectively. It would, therefore, be inappropriate at stage for me to comment further while the process is ongoing.

A final management position on the implementation of the directive is expected to be submitted to me very shortly for my consideration and approval once this dialogue is concluded. Thereafter, my Department will work with Department of Enterprise Trade and Employment officials to get the legislative work done. That is the agenda.

Pádraig O'Sullivan (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister. I had the pleasure of joining him on a tour of the barracks in Cork recently. As Deputy Troy said earlier, his visits to barracks and naval bases around the country are welcome. They will give him a firm understanding of the issues facing the Defence Forces.

The Minister will be aware that one of the main issues facing the Defence Forces' representative organisations is the working time directive. The Commission on the Defence Forces recommended the expeditious removal of the blanket exclusion of the Defence Forces from the Organisation of Working Time Act, subject to the application of the derogations permitted by the directive. Will it happen as expeditiously as has been recommended by the commission?

The Minister may be aware that there is concern among some personnel that derogations from the directive sought by military management might be so vast as to render the application of the directive pointless. Can the Minister assure us this will not be the case?

John Brady (Wicklow, Sinn Fein)
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Earlier on, the Minister stated the process associated with the working time directive must not be allowed to drag on. We already know that it is. According to the Government's high-level implementation plan concerning the commission report, which was published 13 months ago, the heads of Bill concerning the working time directive were to be introduced within six months. It is now eight months since the high-level implementation plan was published and there are no heads of Bill. The Minister is saying there are still discussions going on. He might tell us when the heads will be produced. If not, the process will inevitably be allowed to drag on.

The critical point concerns the exemptions. The Minister might touch on what exemptions are being considered. Does he believe operations that can be rostered for within the Defence Forces should be exempted in implementing the working time directive?

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
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The Minister is relatively new to his Department; however, if he had been sitting here for defence questions regularly, he would have noted the question under discussion has been recurring for a long period. Retention and recruitment probably comprise the most fundamental issue facing the Minister. It is a matter of having a proper cohort of people, set out in our plans, to ensure the defence of the country is maintained.

One of the concerns of all our Defence Forces personnel is the working time directive. The legislation will not be that of the Minister for Defence; it will be a matter for the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment. Is that legislation being advanced in parallel with the ongoing negotiations? I, like others, would want to be very clear. If what emerges has so many exemptions that they really gut the implementation of the directive for Defence Forces personnel, there will be considerable disappointment, with consequences for recruitment and the maintenance of staff.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Since coming into office, I have identified this issue as one on which I want to see progress. The heads of the Bill cannot be drafted until the discussions are completed within the confines of the subcommittee of the conciliation and arbitration scheme.

That means discussing with the representative organisations and hearing their concerns, and that is ongoing. It makes sense for us to facilitate those discussions but I do not believe they can go on and on. It is an important aspect of recruitment and retention. We must work on a range of levels to make the environment within the Defence Forces one where people have a quality work experience and a breadth and depth of experience that attracts people to join the Army, Naval Service and Air Corps for a long and fruitful career. This is the ultimate objective and relates to culture and dignity in the workplace, pay and the organisation of working time directive. That is the fundamental issue and it is at the heart of my approach to this.