Dáil debates

Thursday, 9 March 2023

Ceisteanna ar Pholasaí nó ar Reachtaíocht - Questions on Policy or Legislation

 

12:30 pm

Photo of Pearse DohertyPearse Doherty (Donegal, Sinn Fein)
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It has come as a huge blow to the school communities that the Department of Education has decided to put on hold the construction of 29 new schools that were supposed to go to tender. This is part of a total of 58 schools that were to be constructed and go to tender and are now under review by the Department. The Department has refused to provide a list of the schools that are affected. Some of these schools have been waiting for more than a decade, relying on temporary buildings, in some cases across the road. A school in my own parish, Scoil Chonaill in Bun Beag, has been informed by the Department that it is one of the 58 schools that have been affected. The Department has said the decision was made because of inflation in the construction sector.

The Minister for Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform made commitments during the budget that changes had been made to the public works contract to safeguard project delivery in response to rising construction costs. Just a couple of months after the budget, how is it that all of these schools and children who are supposed to be going into classes that are expected to be delivered are in limbo? Some 29 projects have been cancelled or are on hold and 58 schools are under review. When will the Government give us clarity on this?

12:40 pm

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The Department of Education has a strong record of delivery of school building projects. Again, in 2022, it went way above its targets despite the high inflation, labour shortages and supply chain issues. About 180 school building projects were delivered in 2022, which included accelerated delivery of modular accommodation to support provision for 900 pupils with special educational needs. About 300 school building projects were under construction at the start of this year, most of which will be completed this year or early in 2024, which includes about 40 new school buildings. Regarding the schools the Deputy referred to, advanced discussions are close to completion at an interdepartmental level. This issue will be sorted quickly and those schools will get go-ahead.

Photo of Ivana BacikIvana Bacik (Dublin Bay South, Labour)
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This morning, I was aghast to hear the Minister for Housing, Local Government and Heritage confirm to my colleague, Deputy Duncan Smith, that his Department has no modelling on the projected effect on homelessness rates of lifting the eviction ban. I was further aghast to read a parliamentary question reply to my office this morning, setting out the criteria used to justify lifting the ban in this way at this time. In the four paragraph reply I received, meteorological conditions got nearly two paragraphs and pressure on homeless services got one line to justify the duration of the eviction ban.

It is clear that the Government does not know the effect of the decision it has taken to lift the eviction ban with only three weeks to go until families start to get eviction notices. We are facing a social disaster and a potential tsunami of evictions in this country, with a return to the heartbreaking scenes we had some years ago of children having to sleep on the floor of Garda stations. This is a dreadful scenario and it is clear from the replies we got this morning that the Government has no evidence before it on the basis of which the decision was unexpectedly taken on Tuesday to lift the eviction ban. Will the Government reverse that decision?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The advice from officials in the Department was very strong in stating that continuing the eviction ban would lead to real damage to housing supply and the rental market and would make the situation far worse. That was the evidence and is the proposition that was put to Government.

Photo of Ivana BacikIvana Bacik (Dublin Bay South, Labour)
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There is no model.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Make the situation worse, if you want to, with a short-term sticking plaster effect, or try to deal with the homeless issue through parallel measures, which we are going to-----

Photo of Ivana BacikIvana Bacik (Dublin Bay South, Labour)
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The Government is not doing either.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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We are doing with the tenant in situpurchase, leasing and adjustments to the capital advance leasing facility, CALF, model.

Photo of Ivana BacikIvana Bacik (Dublin Bay South, Labour)
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Seven houses.

Photo of Gary GannonGary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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Ending the eviction ban is simply reprehensible. To end it now, during this time of crisis, while announcing schemes which the Government has no details of or dates for the necessary legislation is an abdication of duty and people will suffer. Renters are bearing the brunt of one of the harshest cost-of-living crises in the history of the State and the Government is going to offer them first refusal on a property which it knows quite well they will not be able to afford. If the Tánaiste's phone rings in four weeks and a family shows up at his clinic, saying they are about to be made homeless, will he actually look that family in the eye? Does he expect me to look that family in the eye and tell them not to worry because they have first refusal to buy? That is a joke. It is cruel and it will cause harm. Until there is legislation and a date for the scheme that has been proposed, I ask the Tánaiste to continue with the eviction ban, because lifting it will hurt people.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy does not have a monopoly on compassion.

Photo of Gary GannonGary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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I did not say I had a monopoly. I asked a question. Answer the question.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputies imply this all of the time. The issue is we want to look people in the eye and say that we are taking decisions based on evidence and taking right decisions to help people.

Photo of Gary GannonGary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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What evidence?

Photo of Ivana BacikIvana Bacik (Dublin Bay South, Labour)
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What evidence?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The supply situation would be made far worse if the ban was continued.

Photo of Gary GannonGary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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Show us the evidence.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I am talking through the Chair. The Deputy asked a question.

Photo of Gary GannonGary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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People's lives are on the line.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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He either wants an answer or he does not want an answer.

Photo of Gary GannonGary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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Do not waffle.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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That is it. I am not responding to that nonsense.

Photo of Gary GannonGary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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That is it; sit down; you have nothing to say.

Photo of Gino KennyGino Kenny (Dublin Mid West, People Before Profit Alliance)
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A number of days ago, I received a very difficult email from a mother who experienced bereavement of her baby girl, Izzy, who was stillborn. Pregnancy after loss is deeply profound. In this email, Celine states that her healthcare professionals, had they known prior of her stillbirth, would have provided a much better assessment and aftercare for the trauma she experienced. Celine proposes that a specific sticker can be placed on the chart of the bereaved mother. Celine says this would make an enormous difference to the aftercare of herself and her child. She begs, in the email, for this to be introduced in most maternity hospitals in Ireland. As a person who did not really know about this subject, I think it is quite rudimentary for something to be put on somebody's file, whether it is a paper file or a digital file, that this mother has experienced bereavement.

Photo of Stephen DonnellyStephen Donnelly (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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The bereavement services have been getting better. There has been much investment of funding in them and, much more importantly, healthcare professionals in maternity hospitals have expanded bereavement services. I have met families who have lost children and have benefited from the bereavement services. If the Deputy wants to give me the details of the suggestion he raised, I will be happy to bring it back to the national women and infants health programme, NWIHP, which is probably the relevant group, to ask it to take a look at it. We will certainly take it on board.

Photo of Matt ShanahanMatt Shanahan (Waterford, Independent)
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Yesterday, as the Oireachtas Friends of Science, we had the pleasure of engaging with the winners of the BT Young Scientist and Technology Exhibition, Shane O'Connor and Liam Carew, on their deep research into the relationship between exercise and student resilience in schools. Essentially, they found that a DEIS school they looked at which implemented half an hour of informal activity three days a week, including basketball, badminton and tag football, was brought from the bottom quadrant to the top quadrant in the survey results and research findings. Children felt they were being more included, that it was improving school culture and that they had better relationships with their teachers. I know they are engaging with the Minister, Deputy Foley, but there is definitely a policy which could be implemented on this in all our schools because there is a significant fall-off in exercise, particularly in the junior and senior cycles, among kids not involved in school sports formally.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I met Shane and Liam during the young scientist exhibition, which I visit every year and which I enjoyed immensely. I think we could do with a similar programme in Leinster House and the Oireachtas. It might improve our resilience, mental agility and performance all around.

Photo of Verona MurphyVerona Murphy (Wexford, Independent)
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The sooner, the better.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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In a more serious vein, I agree 100% that there is a strong relationship between physical exercise, general fitness and performance generally in life. We are fortunate we have such a high quality of young people who participate in the young scientist exhibition and, more generally, in other fields of research that can inform the way forward. That research is important. I know, in the context of the new primary school curriculum, that this issue will get far higher priority.

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary, Independent)
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I want to be associated with the good wishes to Liam and Shane too. They are from the Abbey School in Tipp. They performed very well yesterday, as usual.

The removal of community welfare officers, first from villages and now from towns, is a retrograde step. While we have excellent staff in Intreo offices throughout Tipperary who work hard, the removal of community welfare officers during a severe cost-of-living crisis is an issue. When he was Tánaiste, the Taoiseach said that people could go to community welfare officers. They cannot find them now. The Government has introduced a dedicated phone line so people can phone the local officers, who used to have clinics maybe twice or three times a week, but they cannot get through on that phone either.

It looks like it is to hell or to Connacht for people who want assistance from the community welfare officers. They cannot find them because the phone line is not being answered and they cannot get through. Those in the Intreo offices are doing hard work. The community welfare officers did brilliant work over the decades in which I have been involved in public life, and they still want to do it, but there is a game of hide-and-seek now, with the Government having hidden them away in some back offices. It does not want them to give out money to people. Does it want people to starve, perish and be miserable? It really is bridge-type policies it is introducing.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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This change has been under way for some years. A more integrated service is being provided for any individuals who find themselves in difficulties. While I can get the figures, my understanding is that the numbers for participation and those who applied and were given assistance under this scheme increased last year.

It would be important to get the facts and the details on the participation levels relating to the scheme. I can send them on to the Deputy.

12:50 pm

Photo of Mattie McGrathMattie McGrath (Tipperary, Independent)
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Codswallop.

Photo of Catherine ConnollyCatherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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Baineann mo cheist le hionad lae in Áras Mhic Dara i gcroílár na Gaeltachta atá dúnta le breis agus trí bliana anois gan chúis nó le cúiseanna atá ag athrú an t-am uilig. Deirtear gurb é easpa foirne, easpa spáis nó HIQA an chúis ach is é an príomhrud ná go bhfuil sé dúnta. Is scannal amach agus amach é. I am asking about the day centre in Carraroe i gcroílár na Gaeltachta, which, inexplicably, remains closed. Covid-19 was given as the reason for in the beginning, but it is three years later and the centre remains closed. I have drawn this closure, and the damage it is doing to people who cannot attend the centre, to the Tánaiste's attention repeatedly and with utter frustration.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Níl sé sin sásúil in aon chor, go háirithe nuair atá an-chuid ionadaithe lae ar fud na tíre oscailte anois. Níl sé sásúil in aon chor go bhfuil ceann i gcroílár na Gaeltachta dúnta. Déanfaidh mé an cheist a fhiosrú leis an Aire chun iarracht a dhéanamh an scéal a réiteach. Níl sé sásúil in aon chor.

Photo of Brendan SmithBrendan Smith (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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Tánaiste, for many years there has been an unfair and unacceptable divergence in the rates of subvention made to different private nursing homes. This affects small nursing homes in rural areas in constituencies such as that which I represent, Cavan-Monaghan. The Department of Health, the HSE, and the National Treatment Purchase Fund have not listened to the very reasoned claims of smaller scale nursing home providers. These nursing homes need additional financial support without further delay. Decision-makers should be cognisant of the exit of a substantial number of smaller scale providers and the fact that more control of this sector is now being exercised by major companies, some of which are international. If that trend continues, we can be sure that those big companies will develop larger nursing homes in the bigger towns and that rural communities and smaller towns will lose nursing home facilities. That would be most regrettable. The typical family run nursing home is an essential healthcare provider and must be protected for the long-term good of the sector and, most importantly, the patients involved.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy for raising this issue. I appreciate the points he made. We will discuss it at Government level, with the Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Mary Butler, and with all of those involved. It is fair to say that the entire situation is changing and evolving. Covid-19 had a huge impact on the nursing home sector. The level of State intervention and supports was both unprecedented and significant. The economics of nursing homes are also changing. We want to advance home care to a greater degree. The length of stays in nursing homes is shortening, which is a good thing in some respects because it means that people are staying at home for longer. However, that then has an impact on the economics. Contracts being developed between acute hospitals and nursing homes in order to deal with people's recovery after hip operations, convalescence and so on. We need to create a model that is high quality and affirmed by HIQA from that perspective. It must also be economically sustainable and be capable of dealing with the growth in demand. The fact that people are living much longer than they used to also has implications.

Photo of Colm BurkeColm Burke (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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Next week is national brain awareness week. I take this opportunity to raise need for neurorehabilitation facilities in the nine community healthcare organisation, CHO, areas. My understanding is that funding for this year has been set aside for the facilities in CHOs 2 and 4. When will the programme in this regard be rolled out in those two areas? When will neurorehabilitation teams be put in place in the other five CHO areas? The expectation is that there would be a saving of 42,000 bed days if we had a neurorehabilitation team in each of the CHO areas. A person spends an average of 13.6 days in hospital as a result of not having access to teams in their areas.

Photo of Stephen DonnellyStephen Donnelly (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy. This is something that Deputy Christopher O'Sullivan and I discussed when we met the neurorehabilitation advocates this morning in the audiovisual room. We have some really positive news on this matter.

In last year's budget, we started a significant roll-out of community-based neurorehabilitation services by providing for 23 neurorehabilitation nurses to begin with. New training and education places are being put in place.

On the Deputy's specific question about Cork, one of the two new teams that are being put in place will be in Cork University Hospital, CUH. It will be attached to the major trauma centre. This will be very useful in terms of continuity of care and integrated care. The new trauma centre will be a state-of-the-art facility. Our objective is to have multidisciplinary neurorehabilitation teams in all of the CHO areas. These will then be wrapped into the regional health areas as they come together.

What I want to say to Deputy Colm Burke and other Deputies - I know colleagues right across the House have a very strong interest in this - is what we are doing this year is just the start. We have had three teams in place for a while, and the 23 nurses who will come into post this year are important. However, this is only one step in the process. Our plan is that we will have proper community-based rehabilitation services in respect of a range of diseases such as multiple sclerosis, MS, Parkinson's and many others.

Photo of Dessie EllisDessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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Will the Tánaiste indicate the status of the Dog Breeding Establishments (Amendment) Act? Will he also indicate if unannounced inspections of dog breeding establishments will be included in the proposed legislative amendments? If so, can he tell us whether these inspections will be carried out by proper authorities such as the Irish Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Animals?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I will come back to the Deputy on the timeline relating to the Act. The intention is to have a regulatory framework that ensures the highest standards and levels of accountability and that facilitates inspections.

Photo of Imelda MunsterImelda Munster (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I raise the issue of Irish Water officials refusing requests from local authority officials and elected representatives to attend their meetings in order that they might answer questions on serious issues such as lack of supply, long-term boil water notices and discolouration, to name but a few. The only reason Irish Water is being asked to attend is because it is not answering questions and is not giving clarity at all, even at its clinics. In the past few months, councillors in Louth, Mayo, Galway, Cork, Tipperary and elsewhere requested that representatives of Irish Water come before them. They have all lambasted Irish Water for its lack of accountability. This time next year, full responsibility for water services is transferred to Irish Water, there will be no accountability whatsoever because local authorities will have no input. Does the Tánaiste agree that Irish Water should continue to refuse requests to attend local authority meetings in order to discuss serious issues relating to supply, etc.? Is he happy with what is happening? How does he plan to rectify matters?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Irish Water has received significant resources to invest in water supply across the country. That is something the Government has committed to. There is always a balance. It all depends on the context. For example, I do not believe that representatives of Irish Water should attend council meetings. I do not see the purpose of that, but they should meet local authorities through the relevant committee. There should be consultation with officials and elected representatives, but this should be done at more work-like meetings as opposed to council meetings, where people just get up and launch attacks and no one is any the wiser when it is all over. There should be more engagement. I engaged with Irish Water on a very controversial issue some years back. I found the consultation very useful. An independent mediator was appointed to deal with various water schemes that have now all been completed and that have brought great benefits. Originally, those schemes were opposed because of issues relating to construction and so on.

Photo of Imelda MunsterImelda Munster (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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That is not happening which is why I raised it.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I am just saying that when it happens it can work and I found it to be very useful on that occasion. I would welcome that. Irish Water should engage.

Photo of David StantonDavid Stanton (Cork East, Fine Gael)
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The Tánaiste appreciates the great potential that would follow from the establishment of an Irish division of the Unified Patent Court. Such a development would lead to job creation, benefit to SMEs, boost Ireland's innovative performance and contribute up to €1.66 billion to our GDP. We need to pass legislation to allow for a referendum before this can happen. Where is this legislation? Is it intended to hold a referendum on this matter next November at the same time as the other referenda that have been promised?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I agree with Deputy Stanton that it would make sense to passing legislation and then hold a referendum on the Unified Patent Court. I do not have the exact timelines in respect of this matter. I am always cautious about holding two or three referendums on the same day.

People have different views on that, however. You sometimes need a singular view or theme on a given issue in order that there will be a proper debate on referendum relating to it and that said referendum will be successful. We are holding referendums in November, but there is no reason that would could not hold a referendum on this matter in early 2024. We could just take it on, notwithstanding concerns about whether it would pass or whether people understand the complexities relating to the Unified Patent Court. We will just have to get used to holding referenda.

1:00 pm

Photo of Christopher O'SullivanChristopher O'Sullivan (Cork South West, Fianna Fail)
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At the risk of making the Minister for Health repeat himself, I also want to ask about community neurorehabilitation. The Neurological Alliance of Ireland, NAI, and a number of clinical leads in stroke, neurology, dementia care and neurorehabilitation have just spent the past hour and a half in the audiovisual room advocating for community neurorehabilitation. They did so does so because of the proven benefits the latter has for people who are recovering from brain injury or stroke and for the benefits it has for the patients with Parkinson's disease or multiple sclerosis. The Minister kindly gave of his time this morning to meet me and representatives of the NAI. He is fully behind the model of care in the community in respect of neurological issues. When will community neurological care be rolled out into the other health regions throughout Ireland? Funding has been sanctioned for the appointment in the Cork area of three advanced nurses specialising in Parkinson's and Huntington's. When will these positions be filled?

Photo of Stephen DonnellyStephen Donnelly (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I acknowledge the ongoing advocacy of the Deputy and others in respect of this work. The 23 posts have been sanctioned, so the HSE is hiring people. I will revert to the Deputy with an expected timeline. As already stated, the team for CHO 4 will be based at the major trauma centre in CUH. As well as the team going into CHO 2, a further two community rehabilitation teams will be going into CHOs 6 and 7. These will be based in the Bray Civic Centre and the Peamount Healthcare Centre. When these teams are all in place, we will have full national coverage. In the context of the expected hiring dates and the service being available to people in Cork, I will revert to the Deputy.

Photo of Mark WardMark Ward (Dublin Mid West, Sinn Fein)
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The decision to end the eviction ban just shows how out of touch the Government is with the reality of the housing crisis. What has been done is inhumane and has put unnecessary pressure on thousands of families across the State. I refer to the case of a young mother in my area and her two young children who, through no fault of their own, presented as homeless to South Dublin County Council. They were told that there was no room in emergency accommodation and that they would have to self-accommodate. There were no rooms in any of the local hotels, however. The response I got from South Dublin County Council in respect of this matter states:

There are no other options available to offer your constituent. If emergency accommodation is not available in the county or there are no vacancies in the hotel system, your constituent should present to their local Garda station for a safe place to stay.

The Tánaiste did not answer the question posed by Deputy Doherty earlier. Will he answer my question? In the context of the next mother - and there will be one because of the lifting of the eviction ban - who presents in this regard, what advice does the Tánaiste have to offer with regard to where she and her children should go?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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We are engaging with the local authorities in respect of their responses in such situations. Deputy Doherty said that the family got sorted. I would like to know how they got sorted.

Photo of Pearse DohertyPearse Doherty (Donegal, Sinn Fein)
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Deputy Ward sorted it.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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No one individual sorts it. If something gets sorted, it is because of the provision made through some scheme or other. That is all I am saying. The complete story would help. I have no issue with talking with the Deputy about the matter.

(Interruptions).

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy Ward asked the question.

Photo of Mark WardMark Ward (Dublin Mid West, Sinn Fein)
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I asked about the next mother.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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We did not get the complete story. My point is that we can resolve these issues. We do not want to see anyone homeless. That is the reason we took the decision. Ultimately, retaining the ban would damage the situation more. That is the only reason we took the decision, which we did not like taking. This was a very difficult decision to take. When we are told that the situation will become much worse if we continue with the ban, we have to listen to that advice.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
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I call Deputy Verona Murphy.

Photo of Verona MurphyVerona Murphy (Wexford, Independent)
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A serious issue has arisen in Wexford. Unfortunately, the Minister for Health stated on local radio yesterday that following the fire at Wexford General Hospital, the emergency department is going to reopen tomorrow. This information was subsequently posted on Facebook by a number of people, including me. Many people contacted me to sate that it is not true. I received letter from the manager of the hospital, Linda O'Leary, to say that the emergency department will not be reopening tomorrow. All I am asking for now is clarity. I have already agreed with the Minister that we will work together as a political team in order to ensure that the emergency department will reopen in a timely fashion. We evacuated the hospital in jig time, very professionally and without incident, thank God. I do not want this matter to turn into a political battle. We need clarity. We do not need the department to be downgraded to a minor injuries clinic; we need it to reopen.

Photo of Stephen DonnellyStephen Donnelly (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy. This is a serious issue. I am working with the HSE to get clarification. I will revert to Deputy Murphy as soon as I have it. I expect that clarification in the next few hours.

Photo of Michael CollinsMichael Collins (Cork South West, Independent)
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This issue has already been raised several times. However, it is important. Next week is national brain awareness week. There are 800,000 people in Ireland who have neurological issues. I welcome Tony Wilkinson and his wife, who are in the Gallery. Mr. Wilkinson has done Trojan work for the people of this country in the context of Parkinson’s disease. In the implementation framework relating to the national neurorehabilitation strategy for the period 2019 to 2021, a dedicated neurorehabilitation team was recommended to support patients with stroke acquired brain injury and Parkinson’s disease, multiple sclerosis and other neurological conditions. As yet, this team has not been put in place. There is a related issue in that there have been supply issues in respect of the drug Rivotril in the past year. This has caused great anxiety, especially among patients with neurological disorders. Is the Tánaiste in a position to assure me that there will be a constant supply of Rivotril for all patients? When will the community neurorehabilitation team be put in place to support these patients?

Photo of Stephen DonnellyStephen Donnelly (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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If the Deputy sends me a not on the specific medication, I will get him a detailed response from the Health Products Regulatory Authority.

With regard to the neurorehabilitation teams, there will be nine of them throughout the country, one of which will be located in CUH. I will revert to the House with an expected timeline for hiring. The HSE is engaged in a process of hiring those neurorehabilitation nurses and creating an integrated care pathway for people in Cork.

Photo of Richard BrutonRichard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)
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I congratulate the Minister for Health and the Government on the waiting list initiative that will see almost 375,000 interventions to support people. I was particularly pleased with what has been said regarding the 20 specialties, a three-month waiting list, new patient pathways to keep people out of acute care and a four-month waiting list for scoliosis. On the 11,000 additional interventions for orthodontics, child and adolescent mental health services, therapies, psychology and counselling for children, why will there not be a similar waiting list report showing the impact of these 11,000 patients on the waiting list? This is an area of acute concern, and we need these therapies to be delivered in a timely manner to children with needs. We should be able to see the impact on the waiting lists in the same way that we can in respect of other categories.

Photo of Stephen DonnellyStephen Donnelly (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)
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I fully agree. We report on the oral health and community based waiting lists. The categories about which we spoke yesterday are the acute categories that are reported by the National Treatment Purchase Fund. We have allocated €5 million specifically for the backlog relating to orthodontic treatment. Far too many children are waiting to be seen. That numbers on that list went up, and we are determined to bring them back down. We will be reporting on progress made.

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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The Tánaiste was in Ballyseedy last weekend. No doubt he heard the documentary makers and historians say that the Dáil record which recorded the results of the court of inquiry established by one of his predecessors should be changed. The Tánaiste stated that what happened in Ballyseedy was premeditated murder. He knows that the account to the effect that the prisoners involved were clearing a mine is false. He met some of the victims' family members and told one of them that in time the Dáil record should be amended. However, he also said that we should not rush it. One hundred years have passed. In order to achieve proper truth and reconciliation, will the Tánaiste accept here and now that the account that was read into the Dáil record is false and should be corrected?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The Deputy's narrative is not entirely correct. I did a media interview. The Fuller family were very clear. The late Stephen Fuller was very clear that he did not want subsequent generations to be infected and poisoned by the savagery that occurred during the Civil War, particularly in Kerry.

That is why it took nearly six decades before he did his interview in respect of Ballyseedy.

1:10 pm

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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I am sure the Tánaiste wants the truth.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I was honoured. He told the truth. We on this side of the House do not need lectures about Ballyseedy. I ask the Deputy not to try to lecture me on it. As someone who is interested in history and historical record, I am ware that there was an attempt to cover up what happened at Ballyseedy. That came right to the floor of the House. The record, in some respects, should be left to stand as part of the historical narrative relating to Ballyseedy.

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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Does the Tánaiste accept the narrative is a cover-up?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I said all of this in my speech at Ballyseedy. It is all public.

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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Does the Tánaiste accept it here?

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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The important point is the idea that we should, 100 years on, impose our view of what happened back then. That is the mistake that is always made in respect of history. Back then, everybody, including people in the Executive and the Army, knew that what happened was wrong. My point is the record is a historical narrative in itself that should be left as it stands because it is part of an infamous attempt to cover up what happened.

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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Whatever you call it, the Tánaiste accepts that it was wrong.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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I have said all that. My point is that there were many atrocities during the Civil War. Let us be straight about that.

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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These were prisoners, though.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
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There were many atrocities on both sides. The brother of the late Sean Lemass met a terrible death in the Civil War. However, Lemass chose to go forward. That is the challenge. We get advice and so on. We should reflect on the best way to deal with this. There will be an event later in the year to commemorate all of those who lost their lives in the Civil War.