Holly Cairns (Cork South West, Social Democrats)
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85. To ask the Minister for Education and Skills the steps she is taking to increase the number of places in secondary schools for young people with autism in County Cork. [4782/23]

Holly Cairns (Cork South West, Social Democrats)
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We need more secondary school places for children with disabilities in Cork South-West. In particular, there are insufficient specialised units for young people with autism, or autistic young people. The lack of proper spaces and adequate supports is a breach of their rights under the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities and it is a source of considerable concern for families. What assurances can the Minister of State give them that she will provide sufficient school places?

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Deputy for her question. There is real representation from Cork in the Chamber this morning. It shows the level of commitment but also of concern from the county and city on the part of the public representatives in respect of special education. It is important to stress that 92% of special classes are to support autism in general terms. That would apply to Cork as well. It is interesting to look at the research from Cork conducted during 2020 and 2021. The Department and the NCSE had been using a prevalence rate for autism of 1.55% since 2014. The research from Cork from 2020 and 2021 put that at 3.38%, a significant growth. That is something the Department and the NCSE are trying to mitigate in terms of forward planning. It is not just that there are more children but also that more children are being diagnosed with autism and they need to be catered for.

I mentioned earlier to the Deputy's Cork colleagues that there are 15 special schools in Cork at the moment catering for 970 children, some of whom have autism. There will be an increased need for autism classes at primary level, especially among young children. Part of that is because the prevalence rate has increased. There are 23 early intervention classes in Cork, therefore, and 15 special schools, as I mentioned. Overall in Cork there are 299 special classes at primary level and 42 of those are new. There are 121 at post-primary level, 23 of which are new. That is 420 special classes in total of which 65 are new.

Holly Cairns (Cork South West, Social Democrats)
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Respectfully, all of those figures mean nothing to families who cannot find a place or an appropriate place. The Minister of State says there are 15 special schools in County Cork. That is wonderful but there is not one special school in all of Cork South-West although it is one of the biggest constituencies in the country. The inadequacy of education and healthcare supports for children with disabilities is one of the issues I raise most frequently. I have repeatedly called for the provision of resources for national and secondary schools in Cork South-West and across Ireland and for the Government to finally provide appropriate education for children and young people. There are examples of best practice to be found in schools across my constituency and, I am sure, in others - principals, staff, parents and students themselves all working to help to create incredibly inclusive and progressive environments. It is important to highlight that they are improving but I am working with many parents who have had to keep their children in primary school for an additional, unnecessary year or have had to travel over an hour away due to a lack of local places. This is just the reality faced by so many families in Ireland at the moment.

What is being done for these families? What is the urgent response?

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
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I appreciate that the statistics are in the abstract and do not talk to individual families. Behind all of those statistics are individual families and individual appropriate placements. I allude to them simply to show the Deputy the progress that has been made but not to take away from the fact that a huge amount still needs to be done, particularly around post-primary education. That is why we have written to all post-primary schools and the Department and NCSE met the main post-primary school management bodies last week to share a list of schools that could potentially open new special classes in September 2023. I know that the NCSE is directly engaging with those schools to establish special classes. Over the last three years there has been an increase in special classes in Cork. It is about collaboration. We have the section 37A measure in legislation if we need to trigger it, as well as the section 67 designation of an individual child. However, we try to collaborate with the schools prior to having to instigate those mechanisms.

Holly Cairns (Cork South West, Social Democrats)
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I thank the Minister of State for her reply but I am just not convinced from her answer that she fully grasps the scale of the urgency of the issue. The Minister of State highlighted there that there is more of a problem with secondary school places but that does not make any sense. We know how many people are coming through the primary school system so I do not understand how forward planning cannot be done to ensure there are places for those students. Schools need more resources, as does the NCSE given the difficulty in contacting it and the slowness of its replies. I also want to repeat my call for a special school in Cork South-West. Families have come together to form a campaign and seek this in recognition of their children's needs. ASD and other units attached to existing schools are essential and these families have pointed out the need for special services. We are a stage where our awareness of diverse needs and the State's obligations mean that all areas of the country need units in schools and special schools to offer tailored supports. What is the Minister of State's message to the campaigners for a special school in Cork South-West?

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
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This is something the Department is aware of. Other colleagues, including Deputy Stanton, have requested another special school in Cork as well. I mentioned earlier some of the initiatives that are being taken around forward planning because I am not convinced that it was done adequately in the past. That has been acknowledged and that was obvious because there were gaps. That is why that work is being done but it will take a while before it delivers to exact standards, as it should. Having said that, there is serious engagement with the NCSE, the Department and schools, not just in County Cork but throughout the country, to ensure we have sufficient placements. Again, we have written to the post-primary schools and the primary schools are also aware of it. They know the legislation is there but we want to try to collaborate with them before we have to try to instigate that legislation.