Colm Burke (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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59. To ask the Minister for Education and Skills if she will confirm that formal recognition will be given to teachers working in the Cork Life Centre and that funding will be provided by her Department for payment of teachers in the Cork Life Centre; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [50035/22]

Colm Burke (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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I ask that formal recognition be given to teachers working in the Cork Life Centre, that funding be provided by the Department for the payment of teachers at the centre, and that the Minister make a statement on the matter.

Norma Foley (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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As the Deputy is aware, in June of this year, I visited the Cork Life Centre and I was fortunate enough to have the opportunity to meet some of the young people who attend the centre, together with their parents and guardians, as well as members of staff and the management of the centre.

During the meeting, the centre raised the issues of security of employment for its staff and their terms and conditions, including payment rates for the centre's teaching staff. Staff employed in Cork Life Centre, under the co-operation hours arrangements by Cork Education and Training Board, are employed under terms and conditions, including pay scales, in line with arrangements which apply to settings outside the recognised school system. It is not unusual that tutors may hold qualifications that entitle them to recognised teacher status or registration with the Teaching Council, but payment rates and terms and conditions are generally dependent on the setting or sector in which a person is employed.

A commitment was given to examine the circumstances around the payment of teachers at Cork Life Centre. I am committed to honouring that agreement through the review of out-of-school education provision. With the report completed, work has now commenced on the next phase of this process. I am very keen to see progress made on the implementation of the recommendations of the report. In the interim, the level of funding currently provided to Cork Life Centre will continue until such time as the recommendations of the report are implemented. This funding will be in place and will provide ongoing support for the centre.

The Department of Education has provided funding to Cork Life Centre in recent years, with that support increasing significantly since 2018. In 2022, my Department will provide funding of €177,500. This is in addition to the 6,000 co-operation hours, funded by my Department and the Department of Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science.

I also give a commitment that my Department will continue to engage with Cork Life Centre to work towards a framework for sustainability for the centre. Indeed, this is what the review of out-of-school education provision aims to provide for the sector as a whole, including Cork Life Centre. The body of work to advance the implementation of the recommendations is now under way and will be completed as soon as possible. It is envisioned that the implementation of the recommendations of the review will address all of the issues raised by Cork Life Centre.

Colm Burke (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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I accept that major progress has been made on the provision of funding to the centre. The centre lost eight teachers in June who had an average of six years' experience. At any one time there are 55 students in the centre. These are students who have dropped out of school.

I worked with the Blackpool Glen Farranree Community Youth Training Centre where we had full funding. We had more than 50 young people who had dropped out of school, many of whom were referred to us by the Garda Síochána. When a research project was carried out on those children five years after they left the centre, 70% of them were in full-time employment. The Cork Life Centre has made great progress with children who have attended it who do not fit in to the formal educational structure. We must provide funding to it.

I do not say that any of the children attending the centre are involved in any kind of illegal activity. It was interesting to hear from staff from the Children Detention Campus at Oberstown who were before the Committee of Public Accounts recently that the cost of running it is €24 million per annum, which is more than €500,000 per student.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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The Deputy will get a chance to come back in.

Colm Burke (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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Could we give serious consideration to increasing the funding for the centre?

Norma Foley (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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To be clear, the staff employed in the Cork Life Centre, under the co-operation hours arrangement with Cork ETB, are employed under terms and conditions, including the pay scale, in line with arrangements that apply to settings outside the recognised school system. However, as I have made very clear, I have met with the centre and I am very conscious of the work it does. The issues the centre has raised will be addressed via the review of the out-of-school education provision. In the interim, to be clear, the Department has provided significant funding to Cork Life Centre in recent years and, in 2022 alone, significant funding of €177,500 was provided. That is in addition to the 6,000 co-operation hours funded by the Department of Education and the Department of Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science. I am fully committed to driving on the review. It will support centres like Cork Life Centre and others in this sector. We will do that as speedily as possible.

Colm Burke (Cork North Central, Fine Gael)
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I fully understand where the Minister is coming from. My colleague Deputy O'Sullivan has raised the matter with the Minister by way of a Topical Issue debate. Both of us are very concerned about this. We have 55 children there who are being looked after in a very caring way. They are getting education they might not otherwise get. Again, I go back to the facility of which I was chair of the board for some years in Blackpool, which has 50 children at any one time. We had full funding and support. The facility is still there and is a success. I know the structure in the Blackpool Glen Farranree training centre, but it has worked for children who have dropped out of the education system, who are going down the wrong road and who need that support. Don O'Leary, who runs the Cork Life Centre, is the person who did the research project for me as part of his masters degree for UCC. He showed that 70% of the cases coming through the centre were in full-time employment five years later. It is likewise with the Cork Life Centre. There are success stories there and it is important it gets support.

Pádraig O'Sullivan (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail)
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I support Deputy Burke. As he outlined, I debated the issue with the Minister last week during a Topical Issue debate. We acknowledge all the good work that has been done to provide resources, co-operation hours and extra funding for the Cork Life Centre. That is greatly appreciated by all the staff, but again it is important to stress the urgency of the matter at hand. I understand the report is with the implementation team, as the Minister referenced again this evening. I reiterate that the staff in the Cork Life Centre are fully qualified, as I was in the past, but unfortunately they find it very difficult when they seek a bank loan, car loan or mortgage because they are not permanent. For example, many of them have to sign on in the summer. I acknowledge that once upon a time I was that part-time temporary teacher who struggled to get those types of loans, so I can empathise greatly with the staff in the centre.

Norma Foley (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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I thank both Deputies. I acknowledge their commitment and interest. I do not for a moment underestimate the value and importance of the work that takes place in Cork Life Centre and in the other centres that make up this sector. I fully understand that no one setting suits the needs of students and we must provide a variety of settings for them. It is the desire of the Cork Life Centre, and all such centres, that it would have a sustainable future. It is for that reason we are determined to ensure via the review that we have a mechanism that will protect and sustain the sector as a whole, including the Cork Life Centre. I am very conscious of the issues the Deputies have addressed. They are part of this review and they will be worked through as speedily as we can for the benefit of all centres within the sector.