Dáil debates

Thursday, 2 June 2022

Ceisteanna ar Sonraíodh Uain Dóibh - Priority Questions

Childcare Services

9:20 am

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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5. To ask the Minister for Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth the status of the State agency for early learning and care and school-age childcare. [28273/22]

9:30 am

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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No matter where one is on the political spectrum, one has to accept that be it in housing, direct provision or bin collection, the outsourcing of essential services to the market only leads to higher profits, lower wages and high costs for citizens. This is particularly true for childhood, early learning and childcare. This is tied into the cost of living crisis. Families are struggling and more often than not, it is the mother who has to stay at home and cannot afford the cost of childcare and this question is related to that. I hope this disparity is on the Minister's mind.

Photo of Roderic O'GormanRoderic O'Gorman (Dublin West, Green Party)
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I thank the Deputy for his question. Since I have become Minister, my focus in the area of early years has been on increased public investment going hand in hand with increased public management of the system. Part of that relates to the report I received on 29 March, namely, the Review of Early Learning and Care (ELC) and School Age Childcare (SAC) Operating Model in Ireland. The Government agreed with that report, which stated that a dedicated State agency is the optimal operating model for the ELC and SAC sector for the years ahead.

It is envisaged that this dedicated agency will undertake the functions currently carried out by Pobal's early years programmes and the city and county childcare committees, as well as operational functions currently undertaken by my Department. My Department has now commenced a further phase of detailed analysis and open planning, consultation and engagement with sectoral stakeholders to determine how the recommendation arising from the review can best be implemented. This phase will include a detailed design of a new operating model, an examination of all legal requirements, transition and continuity planning, risk management, and an examination of associated costings.

My Department is committed to ongoing consultation with stakeholders throughout this phase and engagement in this regard has already commenced. Officials from my Department have met all organisations comprising the existing operating model and with other key stakeholders to brief them on the review and to provide them with an opportunity to share their initial feedback and views.

A dedicated State agency will assist in the development of a more streamlined structure to better support the delivery of ELC and SAC, and will facilitate my Department in implementing and progressing the significant reform agenda envisaged under the policy articulated in First 5: A Whole-of-Government Strategy for Babies, Young Children and their Families 2019-2028. The next steps on this project will include the completion of a detailed design of the new operational model, as well as a policy on the future role of the national voluntary childcare organisations, NVCOs. There also will be extensive consultation with key Departments and with ELC and SAC stakeholders. I look forward to bringing a further report to the Government next year following the completion of this next phase of what is a significant and transformative reform project.

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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A 2021 survey by the United Nations Children's Fund, UNICEF, titled, Where do rich countries stand on childcare?, found that families of average income in Ireland are spending up to one half of a two-person earning household to put two children in childcare. Researchers found that a couple with an average income would have to spend between a third and a half of one salary to pay for two children in childcare. The maths becomes very simple then, particularly when other costs, particularly in rural counties when one includes where people have to spend two euros per litre on petrol or diesel. Sinn Féin recently introduced the Employment Equality (Pay Transparency) Bill 2022, which will attempt to address the gender gap in pay by giving workers the ability to understand the going rates for those workers. That is a small step compared to the revolution we need to see in accessibility for women in the workforce with proper childcare, whether it is ELC or SAC.

When will the consultation process which the Minister has mentioned finish and when will the design of policy and the review with stakeholders be completed?

Photo of Roderic O'GormanRoderic O'Gorman (Dublin West, Green Party)
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I want to create a world-class childcare system that is affordable for parents, which provides quality in care and education to children and which pays staff well. We all recognise that childcare fees should not be a burden for families and we want every parent to be able to access childcare without worrying about what it is going to cost them. That is why I am moving forward with a whole range of far-reaching reforms in the early years sector, which are informed by the recommendations of the expert group, to develop the new funding model. This will see much greater State management of the sector but will also see much greater State investment. The goal and outcome of this will be to deliver cost reductions for parents.

Core funding also represents a new departure for the State and we have just discussed it there with Deputy Verona Murphy. Core funding, in particular, will deliver on that imperative of paying our early years staff and educators, who are 98% female, better in order that they can continue in this profession and to deliver that very important quality care for children.

Photo of Pa DalyPa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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When does the Minister expect that the living wage he has mentioned will be obligatory for the childcare providers? It is encouraging that there will be less reliance on private operators because we are far too reliant on those, as with many outsourced agencies.

Does the Minister believe that the consultation process and the design of policy will be completed by the end of this year or by the end of the term of the Government?

Photo of Roderic O'GormanRoderic O'Gorman (Dublin West, Green Party)
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There are two separate things here. The review of the operating model will be completed by the end of this year and I will come back to the Deputy with a specific date on that.

On the living wage, a joint labour committee, JLC, has been set up, bringing together employees, employee representatives and employers. They have put forward a proposal on that entry grade pay of €13 per hour and that is out for consultation at the moment. My understanding that there are further negotiations ongoing about higher rates for a greater degree of experience, such as for graduate staff etc.

A JLC process is obviously independent of Government and I do not have control over that but we have indicated core funding to support the outcome of a JLC and this funding will kick in from September, assuming that we have that agreement on better rates of pay.