Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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This case concerns the Metropolitan apartment complex in Kilmainham. It is one of many but this is where, this week, the residents got confirmation of news that they were expecting since January, which is that they could no longer use the underground car park or any of the storage facilities under the complex. The notice came from the fire chief, who had no alternative but to act, as he or she should act in every case where there is a danger and a blatant defect in the building structure, or where some problem is exposed and lives might be at risk if a fire broke out. That is what we presume is behind this notice.

There are 127 apartments and a crèche onsite. Some of the residents to whom I have spoken have suggested there may be other issues but, thus far, the only one that the fire chief has acted on is in regard to the storage space and car parking. It is basically that fire doors and fire stops are missing. We know what happens in the case of an apartment where fire doors do not exist or are left open. Tragically, we saw what happened in New York earlier this year. At that time, the fire chief in Dublin issued a call for people to make sure doors are not left open and are closed in the event of fire. However, if the doors are not there at all, we can imagine the chaos and the tragedies that can occur.

In this case, the apartment dwellers are expected possibly to foot a bill of up to €500,000. Very few apartment complexes would have that set aside in the management company and there are very few residents I know of who would be able to put their hands in their pockets collectively to come up with €500,000 to address this. As has been the case for many of these issues, the call is for the State to step in. It is reckoned that 100,000 apartments of the 170,000 that were built during the Celtic tiger era have major building flaws. The vast majority of those are where builders cut corners, left out fire doors, left out fire stops and exposed future generations to the dangers of fires.

These are not bottom-of-the-market apartments. They are the same as any other apartment in the Kilmainham area, which were selling for nearly €200,000 and are now selling for over €300,000, and I know of other apartment complexes which have been in the media where apartments were sold for €600,000 or €700,000. Yet, a builder, contractor or developer skimped on this vital piece of equipment to protect people's lives.

Because there are so many and it is so widespread, I know the State has looked at this. My colleague Deputy Eoin Ó Broin has written a book on it, which I have read on a number of occasions, Defects: Living With the Legacy of the Celtic Tiger. It is a question of how we address it and how we ensure that people are not living in fear of fire breaking out in their complex. We must ensure that those issues are addressed as quickly as possible and that the State can help them to ensure the cost is not on top of them as it is beyond their capability to pay.

Verona Murphy (Wexford, Independent)
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I call the Minister of State.

Malcolm Noonan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Green Party)
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I offer the Acting Chairman best wishes with her chairmanship. Well done.

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Teachta as ucht an t-ábhar seo a ardú. I thank Deputy Ó Snodaigh for raising this issue. I acknowledge the difficulties the residents of the Metropolitan apartment complex are facing and the stress that is caused when fire safety issues arise in regard to their buildings.

Local authorities have powers of inspection and enforcement under the Fire Services Acts 1981 and 2003. They work with management companies and other stakeholders to ensure that appropriate levels of fire safety are achieved. Those in control of premises have obligations for fire safety in the premises and to comply with enforcement actions taken by fire authorities. As local authorities are independent in exercising these powers, it is not for the Minister to comment on the issues in this particular complex. However, this is not the only development affected by fire safety issues, as the Deputy stated, and there have been many incidences of failures and non-compliance concerns coming to light in apartment buildings built during the building boom. For this reason, the programme for Government sets out a number of commitments in respect of the important policy area of building defects and provides for an examination of defects in housing. These commitments are further supported by actions contained in Housing For All.

In this context, the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, established a working group to examine defects in housing under the chairmanship of Mr. Seamus Neely, former chief executive of Donegal County Council. The plenary working group has been meeting monthly since March 2021, with the exception of August, in addition to sub-group meetings. The group's terms of reference were adopted in May 2021 and are focused on purpose-built apartment buildings, including duplexes, constructed between 1991 and 2013 in Ireland. This particular complex falls into that category. The Minister considers it worthwhile to summarise the terms of reference for the information of the House. These are as follows: to examine defects in housing, having regard to the recommendations in item No. 4, "Addressing the legacy of bad building and poor regulation", in chapter 4 of the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government report, “Safe as Houses? A Report on Building Standards, Building Controls and Consumer Protection”; to establish the nature of significant, widespread fire safety, structural safety and water ingress defects in purpose-built apartment buildings, including duplexes, constructed between 1991 and 2013 in Ireland; to establish the scale of the issue, which will include work to estimate the number of dwellings affected by the defects identified, including those already remediated; to consider a methodology for the categorisation of defects and the prioritisation of remedial action; to suggest mechanisms for resolving defects; to evaluate the potential cost of technical remediation options; and to pursue options on possible financial solutions to effect a resolution, in line with the programme for Government commitment to identify options for those impacted by defects to access low-cost, long-term finance.

As part of its deliberations, the working group is consulting with a wide range of relevant stakeholders. Included in the stakeholder engagement was a series of online surveys between 31 January and 14 March 2022 seeking the experiences of homeowners, landlords, directors of owners' management companies and property management agents. These submissions are currently being analysed.

The insights gained through engagement with stakeholders, as well as the outcome of the online consultation, will inform the ongoing deliberations of the working group and support the delivery on its extensive terms of reference and finalisation of its report to the Minister, Deputy O'Brien. The Minister, Deputy O'Brien, is satisfied that the group is working effectively and efficiently on this complex matter and looks forward to a report later this year. I assure the Deputy that once the Minister receives the report of the working group, full consideration will be given to its contents.

Aengus Ó Snodaigh (Dublin South Central, Sinn Fein)
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Tá sé tábhachtach go leanann an grúpa seo ag obair agus go mbeidh sé chomh tapa agus is féidir. It is important that this happens as quickly as possible because there is a cost in the event of some of these complexes, as happened in Priory Hall, having to be closed. To vacate a complex such as this or others, where there is a fire defect, is a huge cost on residents or tenants, given the scarcity of accommodation in the city as it is.

In some cases, the management company, residents or owners may be able to pursue the developer, but many of those developers and their companies disappeared with the collapse of the Celtic tiger. It then falls on the residents or owners to foot the funding and most will not be able to.

It then falls on the State which, in some cases, had a duty to ensure these properties were built properly. In some cases, the council knew of issues and never addressed them. In other cases, fire certificates were issued in advance of any inspection or without any inspection at all. The committee will deal with those issues and report on them but there is an urgency.

There is a big difference between this and mica. In terms of mica or pyrite, one sees the damage as one lives it. In these cases, the only time one will find out if there is a defect is when a fire breaks out or when a fire officer comes in and issues a certificate to close or vacate one's premises. That is what we do not want and that is why there is an urgency. I know it is a big undertaking, given the scale of the estimate of 100,000 homes with defects that need remedial action quickly.

Malcolm Noonan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Green Party)
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I assure the Deputy and the House of this Government's commitment in respect of the important policy area of building defects, which is reflected both in the programme for Government and in Housing for All. This Government is committed to dealing with the issue of defects in housing. In this regard, we will continue to drive regulation in the construction sector and more sustainable methods of construction to ensure the mistakes of the past are not repeated.

I am of the view that the issues in addressing defects in apartments requires detailed consideration and the working group the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, has established is the most appropriate forum for considering the complex range of issues involved, as the Deputy has outlined. I have already mentioned the working group's focus on significant widespread fire safety, structural safety and water ingress defects in purpose-built apartment buildings, including duplexes constructed between 1991 and 2013.

While I appreciate this work may not be proceeding as fast as some stakeholders may wish, it is important we give the working group sufficient time to undertake the work as set out in its broad-ranging terms of reference. The Minister, Deputy O'Brien, looks forward to receiving the report of the working group when it has concluded its deliberations.

The Deputy is correct in the sense that some of these defects are not as visible as we would have found with pyrite or mica. Nonetheless, they are equally distressing to the families and residents who have bought properties in good faith. In that regard, the working group report will be critically important in plotting a way forward to try to resolve the many issues. They could be quite significant throughout many of the properties that were built during the Celtic tiger. The Minister, Deputy O'Brien, is deeply committed to trying to resolve these with all of the stakeholders.