Dáil debates

Wednesday, 6 April 2022

Saincheisteanna Tráthúla - Topical Issue Debate

Insurance Coverage

8:40 pm

Photo of Michael McNamaraMichael McNamara (Clare, Independent)
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Before commencing, I note that a number of additional beds are to be provided in hospitals across the country. Limerick has consistently had the most overcrowded hospital and is not included. It is not acceptable.

Photo of Catherine ConnollyCatherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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We are on the third Topical Issue matter.

Photo of Michael McNamaraMichael McNamara (Clare, Independent)
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I thank the Leas-Cheann Comhairle and will move on to the Topical Issue debate. I wish to raise the fair at Spancil Hill. I am sure everyone in the House knows it is on 23 June. It is an important cultural institution in Ireland. It is obviously an important horse fair both nationally and internationally. It goes beyond that and is now a cultural icon. It was recently included in Ireland's national inventory of intangible cultural heritage. Like much of our intangible cultural heritage, it is not only intangible but is endangered and will not be around for much longer unless the Government takes action to protect it because it cannot now get insurance. Insurance is a significant obstacle for any event. Occupier's liability is an issue for every organisation in the country, whether they are sporting bodies such as GAA clubs, farmers or any other entity, premises or event in the country that needs insurance.

The fair at Spancil Hill was founded by royal charter, by King Charles, in 1621. It was 400 years old last year, but the fair did not take place in 2020 or 2021 because of Covid. It faces an even bigger threat from the state of the insurance industry in Ireland right now. The inability to get insurance is threatening it. There is a voluntary committee, none of whom could be called royalists, which revived the fair at Spancil Hill in 1989. It was made famous by the song. The committee simply cannot run the fair without getting insurance, which it cannot get since the British company that used to provide it exited the market. Another famous horse fair in Ireland, at Ballinasloe, is in a position to proceed because it is held in the fair green, which is owned by Galway County Council and is covered by its insurance policy. The Spancil Hill fair is held on a farm, which is private property, and has been since the royal charter was granted in 1621. It cannot be held because of insurance.

I ask the Minister of State to look into this matter, and not just for Spancil Hill. There is a little time to save Spancil Hill, but it is a broader issue. I wrote to the Minister of State's predecessor, Michael D'Arcy, when I was not a Deputy, suggesting some legislative change may be appropriate. He spoke about the cost of insurance working group, which was established in 2016 and reported. Almost all the key recommendations have been addressed, including the personal injuries guidelines, which were controversial but were approved by the Judiciary on 6 March 2021, which is a full year ago now. Most of the measures recommended have been enacted, yet Spancil Hill cannot get insurance. It is not unique. It is a substantial obstacle to various events throughout the country. We need to make sure these events take place. The fair at Spancil Hill is iconic, but there are other community groups organising various festivals and events. It will be the first summer back for many of them, like Spancil Hill, which has been in abeyance for two years, and they may not be able to get insurance. I hope the Minister of State has some succour to offer.

Photo of Seán FlemingSeán Fleming (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy for Clare, Michael McNamara, for raising this issue. It only came to my attention today after receipt of the information about the Topical Issue debate. I thank the Deputy for highlighting it.

To address a few general points, I understand what the Deputy says about the historic nature of the Spancil Hill fair in Clare. The community is involved and a voluntary committee runs it. It was established by charter 400 years ago. There is a long history attached to this. I know it did not take place in the last two years because of Covid and once before that because of foot and mouth disease. It is part of our national inventory of intangible cultural heritage and plays a key role in the local community, not only from an economic perspective but also, more importantly, because it enriches the social dimension of life in the area and wider region.

Accordingly, I do not take the challenges regarding the accessibility affordability of insurance for such community-based events lightly.

In this case, it seems to me that it is not the price that is at issue but that the fair cannot get insurance. I want to be clear in my understanding of where the Deputy is coming from. He mentioned a number of the legislative initiatives and policy changes taken by the Government in the last year and a half to deal with the insurance industry and the availability of insurance. The Deputy will understand that the Government and Department cannot directly interfere in the provision of pricing of insurance products, nor do we have the power to direct a particular insurance company to provide cover to specific businesses or community groups. Notwithstanding this, as the Deputy mentioned, the Government has an action plan for insurance reform. A number of its actions have already been implemented, including personal injury assessments by the Judiciary. The Personal Injuries Assessment Board, PIAB, is now dealing with this matter and there are test cases in the courts at the moment. This is taking some time. As a result, the number of settlements the insurance industry would normally make in the normal course of events has fallen off dramatically while some of these cases are being dealt with.

The Deputy highlights what I would describe as some of the pinch points in respect of insurance throughout the country. These were exacerbated by Brexit because many of the insurance policies issued here had been done through London. We had a hard Brexit on the insurance industry the day that Brexit occurred. This has led to difficulties and to insurance not being available in many cases now.

Overhauling the legislation will deal with the cost of insurance and the claims the Deputy correctly outlined. However, while that does not provide insurance, it might deal with the cost of insurance. There are only a few of these fairs and similar types of event. In the past year, I have found that if those groups come together and go to a broker, they can, collectively, get a good premium from an insurance company. Rather than each individual fair or street event going individually to an insurance company, if they pool together through some association of fairs, they can increase their purchasing power and the willingness of the insurance industry to take them on will increase.

In my next contribution, I will talk more about the pinch points and show that there may be an option to follow. This is not a commitment from the Department because we are not involved in the insurance industry. If we can provide any advice or direction, we will be happy to do so.

8:50 pm

Photo of Michael McNamaraMichael McNamara (Clare, Independent)
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The Minister of State is a master of suspense. I am looking forward to hearing what his proposal is. I would very much welcome any proposal he would have to make, as would the committee in Spancel Hill and the broader community.

This event is organised by a committee and enjoys broad, popular support. It is a big event run with the co-operation of the surrounding community, as well as the Garda. It has not given rise to any trouble so it comes as a big surprise to me, as it will to many others, that it is danger because of insurance. This may be the result Brexit.

We also spoke earlier in the week about childcare. One of the major costs childcare providers face continues to be an increase in the cost of insurance. There is an issue around occupiers' liability insurance in Ireland. If the reforms called for by the cost of insurance working group are carried out and they are not having the desired impact - the Minister of State and I agree they are being carried out – the Government will have to look at the matter again. Governments have a tendency to say there is nothing they can do, it is a matter for the markets, etc., but there was a time in this State when the Dáil could legislate. It was by legislation that the VHI was introduced because the Government of the day - that was a Fine Gael Government whereas we now have a Fianna Fáil-Fine Gael Government - decided that we needed State intervention in the health insurance market in Ireland. We may be close to the time when we need State intervention in occupiers’ liability insurance. This is one example. It is an important example. It very much illustrates what is being lost in Ireland by the cost of insurance. This is an important part of our culture and patrimony that is being lost. Equally, there are childcare facilities that are being lost and many facilities across various sectors are under threat because of the inability to obtain insurance.

Photo of Seán FlemingSeán Fleming (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail)
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My understanding - and I stress the word “understanding” - is that although Clare County Council oversees the fair and supports it with financial assistance, the fair itself falls out outside the scope of the Casual Trading Act 1995 due to its historical charter status. As a result, it cannot avail of group insurance schemes operated by the market, active support teams and the Irish Organisation of Market and Street Traders, IOMST, and, therefore, its organisers must seek insurance on a stand-alone event. In that context, it is similar to other such events as the Smithfield Horse Fair and Ballinasloe Fair.

As regards dealing with pinch points, we had issues in a couple of industries. The Deputy mentioned childcare. Two years ago, after Brexit, there was a serious issue with availably of insurance for that sector. One company is providing such insurance on the basis that the childcare industry came together collectively to have group purchasing power with a large premium. It has secured insurance. I spoke directly to the only company that provides insurance for childcare and reductions in its premiums are coming because of the improved standards and uniform approach taken by the sector.

On a related industry, point-to-point pony clubs and hunts could not get insurance last Christmas. We got that matter sorted, again by a large group of hunts, pony clubs and point-to-point races coming together. Collectively, through two different brokers, they increased competition and got insurance. There is scope to do that here, although I am not making any commitment whatever. It is not my role to get involve in that. However, I ask the Deputy to contact my office and we will talk to Insurance Ireland and Brokers Ireland to see if they can help. I stress again that this a market issue. We will not have a role but if we can point people in a helpful direction, we will be happy to do so.

Photo of Catherine ConnollyCatherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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Before moving on to the next Topical Issue matter, we will deal with messages from select committees.