Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, RISE)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Last October, the Holy Spirit junior school in Greenhills was told it would lose a teaching post and would have to go from having four junior infant classes to three. This was because a number of parents who had planned to start their children in junior infants in September decided to keep them back a year in light of the scale of the Covid pandemic at the time and the negative impact it had already had on their children's preschool education. For the past five months, the school has managed to shuffle around teaching hours and use the Covid learning and support scheme to keep the fourth junior infants class open and keep the teacher at the school. However, the school has now reached the end of the line. Unless the scheme is extended or some other support is offered, this teacher will be out of a job, the classroom will be closed and the children will be scattered across the remaining three classes. This will have a massively disruptive impact on those children and will push their class sizes above the pupil-teacher ratio for the Delivering Equality of Opportunity in Schools, DEIS, band 1 status, which the school has been assigned.

The school, the parents and the children are pleading for supports now to keep the class open and to keep the teacher in post for the remaining weeks of the school year. They are also pleading for the fourth junior infants class to be supported come September. As matters stand, the three junior infants classes starting September 2022 are fully subscribed and the school has a waiting list of 24 other children looking for places. In addition, the school has already proactively been welcoming in Ukrainian children - refugees from the war - and are expecting more. It makes no sense whatsoever to have a classroom empty and 24 children unable to get school places simply because the school numbers dipped during a particular period in the pandemic. The assurances they seek is that come September they will have four junior infant classes again. If the Minister can give that assurance, surely she would also agree that it would be a folly to lay off a teacher now, close a class and put four classes into three, particularly in view of all the disruption this would cause now and in terms of trying to get the teacher back come September.

I have been contacted by many parents, whose children either go to the school or are seeking to do so, outlining the impact this situation has on them. I will reference what Jessica wrote. She indicated that she is one of the parents who made the extremely difficult decision to delay stood entry for her child due to serious concerns about the impact of Covid and restrictions on the child and their education. She went on to explain that very difficult decision. She wrote that she was not the only parent to take this difficult decision and that as a result of reduced enrolments, the school lost a teaching post. She further wrote that she was unaware of the impact her decision would have but that to penalise the school by reducing teacher numbers was short-sighted on the part of the decision makers involved. She went on to say that failure to address what is happening will cause lasting damage to the education of this cohort of children.

I wrote to the Minister, Deputy Foley, about this matter last October. She replied that the school's enrolment did not reach the enrolment required to maintain the post for the remainder of the year. She indicated that the school submitted an appeal to the primary staffing appeals board, which made a decision on the basis of published appeals criteria. She further indicated that the board operates independently and that its decision is final, that is, “No.” However, the issue is that the grounds for appeal at that time were outdated and did not take into account the fact that we were in a pandemic. The dip in the number of children starting junior infants last September was much higher than normal as a result of the pandemic. It was a once-off and should be treated as such. Neither the school, the parents, the students nor the teacher should be punished as a consequence. They need a commitment that the teacher will be retained now and that the class will be retained come September.

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I thank the Deputy for giving me the opportunity to outline the position regarding staffing in primary schools. I am happy to take this matter on behalf of the Minister.

The key factor for determining the level of staffing resources provided at individual school level is the staffing schedule for the relevant school year and pupil enrolments on the previous 30 September. The staffing schedule is an allocation mechanism that uses enrolment bands to determine the number of classroom teaching posts allocated to a school.

This is a long-standing arrangement for allocating teaching posts to our primary schools in a fair and equitable way based on the respective enrolment. Previous budgets of 2016, 2018 and 2021 improve the staffing schedule by one point on each occasion to its historical lowest level ever of one classroom teacher, on average, to 25 pupils, with lower thresholds applying to Delivering Equality of Opportunity in Schools, DEIS, urban band 1 schools. In addition, there has been a three-point reduction in the retention schedule, which has helped schools that would otherwise be at risk of losing teaching posts.

The staffing arrangements include a provision whereby schools experiencing rapid increases in enrolment can apply for additional permanent mainstream posts on developing grounds using projected enrolment. I understand that this, as the Deputy outlined, is what occurred here. Holy Spirit Junior National School was allocated a temporary teaching post on this basis, as a school that indicated it was expecting an enrolment of 263 pupils in September 2021, which was a projected increase of 25 pupils. The Deputy conceded that there were some children who were going to enrol but did not. The Department received an enrolment return of 246 pupils from this school as at 30 September 2021, which is an increase of eight in the pupil enrolment of the previous year. The enrolment required to retain the post for the remainder of the year was 263 pupils. Therefore, the school was informed, as the Deputy correctly said, that the post was to be suppressed at the end of October last. Therefore, with an enrolment of 246 pupils, which is what it has at present, and 13 mainstream teachers, the school is operating on a mainstream pupil-teacher ratio of 18.9:1. This compares favourably with the general allocation ratio of 20:1 for junior DEIS schools. It is important to point that out.

The staffing process includes, as the Deputy said, an appeals mechanism for schools to submit a staffing appeal under certain published criteria. The school appealed the suppression of the post to the primary staffing appeals board, which refused the appeal on the basis that the grounds of the appeal did not warrant the allocation of an additional post under the published staffing arrangements. The primary staffing appeals board operates independently of the Department and its decision is final. I know the Deputy is aware of all that.

It is important to say that there has to be a fair, equitable, transparent and clear type of staffing schedule. When we are talking about schools, we cannot have one rule for one school and another rule for another school. That is the issue that has happened here. The school staffing for the current school year was finalised in October following the completion of the staffing appeals process. The school is not, as the Deputy knows, due to lose a teaching post next week. I have taken into account what the Deputy said, however, about using up the class scheme etc. All types of schools have to be treated equally, irrespective of location. My understanding of this school is that because there had been a projected number of children who were due to attend the school and then did not attend, we have, at the moment, sufficient teachers. This is 13 mainstream teachers, for a pupil-teacher ratio of 18.9:1, when then normal junior DEIS school would be 20:1. The Department is therefore satisfied that it has sufficient staffing under the circumstances.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Is there a copy of the Minister of State’s response?

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I can get one to the Leas-Cheann Comhairle.

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, RISE)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I appreciate that the Minister of State has the response from the Department and is reading it out, but it is just the same response that we got in October 2021 basically, which is just a sticking to the rigid bureaucratic rules of “these are the numbers, etc.” It is not taking into account the reason that they fell short was because of the pandemic. The school staff then took the decision to try to use some resources available to them to try to maintain the four junior infant classes that they started off with, which was honourable. What the Department continues, it seems, to say to them is that at this stage in the school year, it will force four classes into three and it will not allow them to have four classes next year. This is despite the fact that from September 2022 the numbers are clearly there in terms of the waiting list of 24 for junior infants. I have email after email from parents who are heartbroken because they are unable to get into the school starting in September because, precisely, the fourth teacher is not being provided. The principal wrote to the Minister, Deputy Foley, and I believe the Taoiseach as well, in relation to the rule that was decided, saying that while it is understood that rules must be fair and transparent, they were going through a very unpredictable and extraordinary time and so fairness needed to be reinterpreted. That is an absolutely reasonable position. They went on to explain that the school needed 254 pupils to retain the 14th teacher at the end of September 2021. We did not reach that number in September, but due in some part to the crisis in Ukraine, we now have 252 pupils. We appeal now for the extension of the schemes so we can keep the substitute teacher until the end of June.

This is very simple. We have lived through extraordinary times. All sorts of rules that have been in place have been bent and broken and so on. Simple asks are being appealed for here, that the teacher is retained for the rest of the year for the fourth class and that the resources are put in place so that the fourth class can be in place in September.

Josepha Madigan (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

First of all, the key world in relation to this particular school is “temporary”. The extra staff member that was given was only ever on the basis that it was a temporary measure. It was never meant to be permanent. It was very strictly and categorically told to the school that it would be in a position to retain this staff member only if it actually had the projected number of children, which it then transpired it did not. The Deputy made some points, not without merit, and some of them particularly around the pandemic and taking Ukrainian children, but the difficulty is that there are 4,000 schools also looking for teaching staff at various different particular times during the year. There has to be some sort of system that is fair and equitable for all of these schools.

The Department is satisfied with the fact that there are 246 pupils and 18 mainstream teachers at a pupil-teacher ratio of 18:1. This is satisfactory at present. As the Deputy mentioned earlier, in September should there be a change in circumstances and an increase in enrolment, then the situation can be reviewed again. That applies across the board for all teachers and, indeed, for special needs assistants, SNAs, under my particular remit, who can apply for exceptional reviews and schools can apply for exceptional reviews. We are, at present, in a very unpredictable situation vis-à-visthe education sector in its entirety when we are talking about the influx of Ukrainian children coming into the education sector. The schools and the staff have already been under significant stress in relation to Covid. I want to thank those schools that have come forward to help with Ukrainians. However, this is something that can be reviewed at a later stage. It is important to stress that at the moment it has a current staffing allocation that is satisfactory to the Department.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We still have three Topical Issues left. With everyone's help, we might gain a minute or two, because we have to stop at 10 a.m. I will ask everyone for a little help.