Donnchadh Ó Laoghaire (Cork South Central, Sinn Fein)
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2. To ask the Minister for Education and Skills the steps she has taken to achieve pay equality and pension entitlements for school secretaries in accordance with the commitments given by Government. [35283/21]

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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I ask the Minister the steps she has taken to achieve pay equality and pension entitlements for school secretaries, in accordance with the commitments given by Government.

Norma Foley (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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As someone who comes from the school sector, I am keenly aware of the vital role played by school secretaries in the running of our schools. In recognition of this role, I have put special arrangements in place for the coming school year whereby schools will be funded to employ a replacement secretary or caretaker in the event that staff who are at very high risk of contracting serious illness from Covid cannot work on the school premises. I have also extended the employee assistance service to all school staff including secretaries and caretakers.

The majority of primary and voluntary secondary schools receive assistance to provide for secretarial, caretaking and cleaning services under grant schemes. Where a school employs a staff member to support these functions those staff are employees of individual schools and responsibility for terms of employment rests with the school.

On foot of a chairman’s note to the Lansdowne Road agreement, the Department implemented the 2015 recommendations of an independent arbitrator. The arbitrator recommended a cumulative pay increase of 10% between 2016 and 2019, and that a minimum hourly pay rate of €13 be phased in over that period. This arbitration agreement covered the period up to 31 December 2019 and has been fully implemented and increased funding was provided by my Department. The arbitration agreement was designed to be of greatest benefit to lower-paid secretaries and caretakers. For example, a secretary or caretaker who was paid the then minimum wage of €8.65 per hour in 2015 prior to the arbitration has, from 1 January 2019, been paid €13 per hour, which is a 50% increase in that individual’s hourly pay.

Fórsa trade union has tabled a follow-on claim from the 2015 agreement. Officials from the Department, the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform and school management bodies have been engaging with Fórsa on the claim. On 27 October 2020, under the auspices of the Workplace Relations Commission, WRC, an understanding was agreed on a pathway to progress the issues. Several key strands have been identified, and a phased approach is being taken to the development of proposals. The parties continue to engage under the auspices of the WRC with the next meeting scheduled for 30 July and I support at all times meaningful engagement on this issue by all parties.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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We are heading into another summer when very many school secretaries will have to go on jobseeker’s allowance again. A commitment in this regard is contained in the programme for Government. This commitment was made by the Minister’s party when it was in opposition and by the Tánaiste last October. I welcome the engagement but school secretaries and their representatives are frustrated by the pace of progress regarding these matters. What is the timeline in this regard? How quickly will this engagement conclude? When can school secretaries expect these issues to be addressed and to get a fair deal and their entitlements?

Norma Foley (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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As I have outlined and said consistently, I am very conscious of the excellent and pivotal work contributed to school communities by schools secretaries and caretakers. I have been very clear on this. I am also very clear, as I am sure is the Deputy, that there is a process of engagement via the WRC. I also acknowledge that since October 2020 the process has moved apace and there has been significant engagement and meetings have been held between the parties under the auspices of the WRC. There have also been bilateral engagements in that regard. Therefore, there is a clear commitment to progress these complex issues that form part of the pay claim.

I also acknowledge that detailed work is being carried out between the parties in phase 1 of the talks. To consider the remaining elements of the claim, further data are required. These data are now forthcoming as the Department recently completed a necessary data gathering process across the primary and post-primary sector. The returns from this exercise are now being analysed and this work will help to inform the next approaches to be taken regarding these issues. It remains the intention of all parties to reach agreement on the regularisation of pay, conditions of employment and pension provision, which is, as the Deputy said, set out in the roadmap document.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Go raibh maith agat, a Aire. It is important to state there are issues of equality and fairness and regarding the rights of workers. In addition, there are also real issues of potential hardship. Therefore, time is important and of the essence. I reiterate the frustration - and it is frustration - felt by school secretaries and their representatives regarding the rate and speed of progress, or lack thereof. I ask again what the Minister sees as being a realistic timeframe. How quickly can these negotiations and discussions be concluded? I know that extensive work has been done on collecting data, which concluded on 21 May. We are now in July so this work concluded six weeks ago. Time is of the essence. I ask again, therefore, what is the realistic timeframe, with complete focus on this issue, to get a resolution.

Norma Foley (Kerry, Fianna Fail)
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I acknowledge again that there has been significant progress. I reiterate that since October there has been consistent engagement via the WRC, and this includes bilateral engagements. The engagement has been very fruitful in that it has been consistently helpful to the process to chart a way forward. As outlined previously, the Deputy is quite correct that a significant body of data was requested. It was gathered by the Department, which was a significant undertaking. These data are now available. The process will be progressed at speed. It is a necessary element of the work. Everybody would wish that the process could be concluded with the click of fingers, but this is not possible given that several parties are involved via the WRC. It is very important that all parties are given the time and latitude to bring to the table what needs to be brought to the table, and to bring the information required to progress matters.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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I remind members watching proceedings on screens that the questions are moving on. I will skip over the next question because the Deputy is not here.