Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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107. To ask the Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection if her attention has been drawn to cases whereby persons currently in receipt of the pandemic unemployment payment are offered short-term, temporary work; if they will be allowed return to the payment following the completion of this work; if not, if they will they be required to apply for jobseeker’s allowance; if her attention has been drawn to the fact that the latter may act as a disincentive; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35268/21]

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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I am also asking the Minister a question on the pandemic unemployment payment where persons are currently in receipt of that payment and are offered short-term temporary work. This is especially the case in the music industry, where a gig may happen and they will go back to work on it. Will such people be allowed to return to the payment following the completion of that work or, if not, will they be required to apply for jobseeker's allowance?

Will the Minister also comment on whether she would consider that this would be a disincentive for people in that industry?

Heather Humphreys (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
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The pandemic unemployment payment or PUP was an emergency measure introduced in the exceptional circumstances of Covid-19 to help cushion the financial impact on people temporarily laid-off work as a direct result of public health measures mandated by the Government. It has been an important support for hundreds of thousands of workers and their families through Covid-19. To date, over €8 billion has been paid out on the PUP to nearly 900,000 recipients.

As part of the national economic recovery plan, the Government announced the extension of the pandemic unemployment payment until February 2022, meaning that a payment that was originally intended to be in place for just 12 weeks will run for almost two years.

In light of the Government decision to defer the lifting of certain public health restrictions on 5 July, I have announced that the PUP scheme will remain open for new applications until 8 July 2021, which is a week later than previously announced. This will ensure staff who may have returned to work this week in anticipation of indoor hospitality reopening on 5 July will have the opportunity to re-apply for the PUP if they need to.

From 8 July people who are laid off should apply online for a standard jobseeker's payment, including the increases for adult and child dependants, as appropriate. In most cases, given people were granted paid social insurance contributions while in receipt of the PUP, people who take up employment from PUP will qualify for jobseeker's benefit in the event that they need to claim a jobseeker's payment in the future.

Given its exceptional nature, there will undoubtedly be some cases where the transition from PUP into employment or onto another welfare payment will give rise to some questions. However, I am pleased to say that our experience has shown that people are willing to return to work as restrictions are eased. This confirms research by the Economic and Social Research Institute, ESRI, that indicates that the vast majority of people choose to take up work rather than remain on welfare even in situations where the financial benefit of working is low or in some cases even when it is negative.

Additional information not given on the floor of the House

I also note that in a recent budget perspectives paper the ESRI pointed out that for most people income from employment will exceed the value of the PUP payment. I would also advise the Deputy that where an employee closes their pandemic unemployment payment to return to work but has been temporarily placed on a shorter working week they may be entitled to a jobseeker’s payment or short-time work support. As has been the case throughout the pandemic, the position with regard to the PUP will be kept under review as the public health advice evolves.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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I thank the Minister. I am referring in particular to the music industry and to the large cohort of people who work in that sector in the sound, power and production areas.

Where they may be offered gigs throughout the summer, there might be two or three days of work, and that is through other Government supports for live music events through the Department of the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin. People taking up that work know it will be for only two or three days. They know their industry is not open fully. Will they be able to return onto the PUP at the end of that two-day or three-day gig they might get or a series of gigs throughout the summer? We know that that industry will not open up fully for some time. For example, I know of a sound engineer down in Wicklow who is at the top of his game and in high demand, but there is no work out there for him at the moment. If he gets offered a couple of days' work, he has to weigh up whether he will be back on jobseeker's at the end of that work. It is important he keeps his talent active and keeps his craft and his skills alive, but he has to weigh up the benefits of taking on that work.

Heather Humphreys (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
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I wish to make it clear in the House again, because sometimes there is misinformation relating to artists and musicians, that I do not expect artists or musicians to retrain or to reskill. I wish to make that clear because I have been misquoted here before, not by the Deputy but by others. All my Department is doing is making people on the PUP aware of the various supports available to them. The Deputy mentioned people on the PUP. I have worked very closely with them. They can earn up to €960 over an eight-week period and still maintain their payments. I am also working very closely with the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, on a basic income guarantee scheme for artists. That is something we want to introduce. We have worked with the sector. There is the part-time job incentive scheme for people who come off the PUP, so maybe the people to whom the Deputy refers could look at that scheme. There are a number of schemes available, but I cannot introduce sector-specific social welfare schemes. I will just be straight up about that. It is not possible. In fairness, though, the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, has put a lot of supports and a lot of investment into the music and entertainment sector.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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I accept that the Minister cannot introduce sector-specific schemes, but there are sectors that we know cannot reopen or can reopen only in very limited circumstances because of crowd control measures or social distancing. As the Minister has pointed out, there has been unprecedented support for welfare payments and employment supports across the past 15 months and I think everybody recognises that, but we have to look at these cases and allow for flexibility where we want these people to return to work and they want to return to work. This is their job. It is what they love doing. They want to be out there entertaining and putting on these shows. I am not just talking about the artists or the person on the stage; behind every lighting rig and every sound desk is a highly qualified, skilled engineer working away. We want to allow them to work. We do not want them to have to take two gigs during the summer and then go back onto a lesser payment because their industry is not open. We have to address that.

Heather Humphreys (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)
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We also have to be fair about these schemes and look at all the people who have been on the standard jobseeker's payment since before the pandemic. As I said, I cannot have sector-specific social welfare payments. That has always been the case. To be fair, the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin, has worked very closely with this sector and a good deal of supports have been made available through the Government. I am happy to engage with the sector, as always, but I have been very clear that I cannot have a specific support that looks at just one sector and not at another. Anything we do in social welfare is across the board. These payments have been available for a year and a half, as I said, and they will continue until next February, which will be almost two years from their introduction.