Catherine Murphy (Kildare North, Social Democrats)
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4. To ask the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport his plans to expand the DART+ programme beyond the plans announced in view of the fact that significant commuter populations are already living outside the geographical areas that will be provided for; if costings have been undertaken in respect of doubling rail lines west of Maynooth, County Kildare and south of Bray, County Wicklow, to increase frequency of services; and his plans to include Sallins and Naas, County Kildare in plans to further expand the electric rail network. [35958/20]

Catherine Murphy (Kildare North, Social Democrats)
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The DART expansion is very welcome, but I am trying to find out whether there are plans beyond that because there are significant populations beyond the area that is due to be expanded. Indeed, they are not just along that line; they are along the Kildare line as well. For example, the combined population of Naas, Newbridge, Sallins and other towns is in excess of 60,000, which puts pressure on the N7. A more sustainable type of transport is required. Has this been costed?

Eamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party)
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As the Deputy stated, DART+ represents the key current investment programme in commuter rail services in the greater Dublin area, and will likely be the largest ever investment in our rail network in the history of the State. It is important to set out what it will deliver. It will double the capacity of the network in the greater Dublin area; it will mean approximately 70% of all journeys on the entire national rail network will be on electrified track and it will enable sustainable, transport-orientated development at key locations along the network. These are all hugely ambitious and important outcomes and I know the Deputy recognises and welcomes the benefits DART+ will bring to the greater Dublin area, and I am glad that she supports it.

DART + has its origins in the transport strategy for the greater Dublin area, which sets out the geographic scope of the programme and the high-level strategic rationale. The development of transport strategies is a fundamentally important part of how we can improve transport in Ireland. They allow us develop an evidence-based and plan-led approach to transport infrastructure and transport services and, importantly, integrate with land-use planning to shape the location of housing and commercial development.

I think we can agree on two further points. First, we need to deliver on the strategies and not just develop them, and that means delivering the likes of DART+. Second, we need to keep requirements under review and, where necessary, consider whether additional projects and programmes are needed. That means we should push ahead with delivering DART+ as set out, while consulting people as is currently under way, and refining issues that may be raised during those consultations. We also need to think about whether additional projects and programmes might need to be considered, and that is where the review of the transport strategy for the greater Dublin area and, indeed, the review of the national development plan, NDP, have a role to play.

I look forward to seeing DART+ progress and, likewise, I look forward to the review processes in respect of both the strategy and the NDP, where some of the additional measures that the Deputy has mentioned could be considered.

Catherine Murphy (Kildare North, Social Democrats)
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I will provide an example. Kilcock is not as far from the city centre as Balbriggan, and there can be a mindset in relation to counties and geography. The population there is growing. The turning circle is 450 m away from that town, and it would seem obvious that the doubling of the line there is going to be a prerequisite to ultimately delivering the electrification project.

There is a more difficult scenario in Greystones from an engineering perspective, but there is a sizeable population in the area It is about thinking beyond the announcement, which is very welcome, and I concur that public consultation is required on the detail, particularly in respect of bridge lifts and how they are carried out. I am absolutely supportive of the project. It needs to be even more ambitious than it currently is. It is the next phase that I am trying to expand on.

Eamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party)
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In the public consultation there have already been a number of submissions suggesting, as the Deputy has, the double tracking to Kilcock, and there may well be merit in that suggestion because it is a very large and growing town, with a large part of the population that commutes, and will still commute, even in post-Covid times. As the Deputy mentioned, a similar expansion of the section from Bray to Greystones has more complexities because of the geography, the tunnel and the coastal aspect. There may be mechanisms, for example, using short sections of double track, or others that could be used. We could increase the frequency to have a DART running every 20 minutes, using some of those interim measures.

There is a wider review that needs to be done of that entire route because of the need for coastal defences against sea erosion. That is a bigger issue for the southern route from Greystones, but the whole line requires significant review, arising, first and foremost, out of the coastal defence issues.

Catherine Murphy (Kildare North, Social Democrats)
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The strategic housing development at Woodbrook in Shankill will suck up some of the increased capacity. I understand the intention is to increase capacity but not frequency.

In regard to costs, people living in Kilcock, for example, seeing that there is a much better service from Maynooth, will choose to drive there to access public transport. That puts pressure on car parking spaces and involves making part of the journey in a less sustainable way. The totality of costs must be looked at and that should include, for instance, the cost of providing surface space for car parking. That space must be provided when people are required to travel to access a service. The totality of costs needs to be considered when looking at the cost of doubling the line.

Eamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party)
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Another issue that arises in looking at the totality of costs is that we really need to change our entire housing, planning and transport systems at the same time as we are doing these DART+ projects. I hope to do the same in Cork, Galway, Waterford and Limerick. We want to move towards transport-led development that would see new housing being built within a walk or short cycle of the major public transport infrastructure in which we are going to invest. One of the main reasons we are making that investment is the benefits it will give in terms of improved quality of life, shorter commuting times, more sustainable, lower-emissions transport, better local environments and an improved public realm. The reality is that we have been going in completely the other direction. Half of new housing in the State in recent years was built in the counties surrounding Dublin and not located close to public transport nodes or other sustainable transport options. At the same time as we undertake the DART+ project and start implementing the other investments, the local authorities need to start reviewing their development plans in order to ensure that, instead of new development spreading out everywhere, we start building closer to the public transport nodes we are going to implement. It is in this context that investment in an upgrade to the Kilcock service could make real sense.