Gary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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I thank the Minister for taking the opportunity not only to be here tonight but for re-arranging the session we were supposed to have last week.

We all agree the restrictions have been hard on many people and many different sectors. They have had unintended consequences which have placed particular difficulties on how people go about their lives.

Keeping schools open has been particularly important for everybody in the Chamber and in society. With the level 5 restrictions in place, Dublin Bus is only operating at 25% capacity. It creates undue hardship on service users in Dublin and on school children who are trying to get a bus to and home from school.The capacity is simply not there to deal with the level of demand needed.

While I am raising the issue with the Minister tonight, I am sure I am not the first one to do so through parliamentary questions and otherwise.

It is important that we work to rectify the problems.

I have in front of me a case study report from a school in my constituency, St. Declan's College in Cabra. The report gives a sense of what is happening for pupils in the school and the difficulties they are experiencing. Students have been left waiting for up to two and a half hours in the evening before a bus arrives with sufficient capacity to take them home. Those children are not getting home until close to 6 p.m., having waited in the cold, and must then eat their dinner and do their homework. Some students have to walk 1 or 2 miles further down the road to see whether there is an emptier bus that they can board. Students have reported as many as 15 buses passing by as they stand waiting. Some bus drivers allow passengers to get off their bus but do not allow the schoolchildren to board. There is an obvious and very real safety risk that comes with having schoolchildren standing at the side of the road in wet, cold and inclement conditions. The situation in the morning is equally as bad as in the evening, which is resulting in children arriving to school late and missing their first class, with all the consequences that go with that. I am interested to hear how the Minister intends to rectify this problem.

Eamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party)
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The Covid-19 health emergency has had a profound impact on the public transport sector due to the fall in passenger numbers and associated drop in fare revenues. The Government has committed to ensuring essential transport services are protected and supported for the duration of the level 5 restrictions. The continued operation of public transport is vital and, as such, it is designated among the essential services that have carried on through the crisis. I thank both the public and commercial operators and their staff for their ongoing work in providing this vital service.

A number of measures have been introduced across the system, guided by public health advice, to ensure the continued operation of services through the pandemic, including enhanced cleaning regimes and social distancing measures throughout the network. The Government's living with Covid plan clearly sets out capacity guidance for public transport at each of the five risk levels. The plan also provides guidance for the public on using public transport at the different risk levels, including a stipulation that wearing face coverings is mandatory and encouraging use of off-peak services and sustainable active travel options where feasible.

Due to the rising incidence of Covid-19 infections, for a period of six weeks from midnight on 21 October, the Government introduced level 5 restrictions for the whole country. At the current level of risk, public transport operators are restricted to using only 25% of the passenger-carrying capacity on their vehicles. The plan's guidance on working from home where possible and the closure of social, leisure and other facilities have reduced the demand for public transport well below normal levels. The advice is aimed at ensuring public transport is safeguarded for those who need it, including front-line workers and, critically, students. The move to 25% capacity utilisation on public transport is one of a suite of measures introduced under level 5 following recommendations from the National Public Health Emergency Team, NPHET.

Issues arising from the reduction in capacity presented on some services at the commencement of level 5, especially on early morning bus services in the Dublin region. Both my Department and the National Transport Authority, NTA, are closely monitoring public transport demand and will continue to be guided by public health advice. Since the move to level 5, the NTA and the bus operators in Dublin, Dublin Bus and Go-Ahead Ireland, have reallocated a number of vehicles and drivers across the network to enhance the capacity in areas that are experiencing capacity issues. Approximately 43 buses have been redeployed by Dublin Bus since 22 October to mitigate the impact of the capacity restrictions and reduce the number of passengers being left at stops. Where possible, these vehicles are being deployed during peak demand times, particularly for school travel. These measures are assisting in reducing passengers waiting at stops. Currently, all available vehicles are in use. While the reallocation will ease the situation, it remains the case that there will be instances of people having to wait for another bus. The advice is, as I said, to try to avail of other modes of transport, if possible, and to bear in mind that journeys may take longer at this time.

The NTA is monitoring very closely the effects of the reduction in capacity, in conjunction with the public transport operators. They will continue to take direction on this matter from the relevant Government emergency planning bodies, including the Department of Health and NPHET. Any actions being undertaken by the NTA and the public transport operators will be guided by those agencies and the advice of the Chief Medical Officer.

We are very aware that this is a real issue for people, especially in Dublin and, in particular, for students. It was especially bad in the first few days of the level 5 restrictions but it improved slightly in the second week. We are monitoring the situation week by week. Dublin Bus has done a remarkable job, not only in putting on additional buses but also in terms of its workers coming in to do earlier shifts to cope with the morning peak in demand. I have been talking to both Dublin Bus and the NTA about this and they are very aware of the difficulties. The tradition and attitude in Dublin Bus is that one does not leave a child at a bus stop. Drivers have a huge responsibility in this area and it is not easy. That is the culture in the company and I hope it helps to alleviate the current difficulties.

Gary Gannon (Dublin Central, Social Democrats)
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I am afraid it does not alleviate them. When the Minister came off script at the end of his reply, he was a bit more honest about what is happening. I fully appreciate that the culture of Dublin Bus is not to leave any child at a bus stop. The drivers make a remarkable contribution to our city. They are generally friendly and reliable. However, at this time of level 5 restrictions, there is a very serious difficulty in that there are simply not enough buses to operate at 25% capacity. As a result, children are being left at bus stops in the morning, afternoon and evening. They are being left to walk in the rain and cold. We are facing into another three weeks of level 5 lockdown, which means another three weeks of this problem continuing.

The Minister talked about monitoring the situation but there is not really time to do so. We have been told throughout the pandemic that it is important to act swiftly. I am not sure what that looks like in terms of devising more of a Dunkirk strategy that would see as many buses as possible, private or otherwise, reallocated to come into service. The current situation is simply untenable. In a few weeks we will be coming out of a lockdown that was shorter than the first one and we hope to see an increase in capacity. The problem, however, is that we could be back to level 5 in January. The current situation is causing untold hardship in schools every morning, with children coming in late and wet from the rain. The same thing is happening on their journey home. I do not doubt for a second that the Minister is taking this issue very seriously but the outcome needs to be a lot better. The situation that is arising at bus stops throughout the city, from Monday to Friday, is not tenable and it is not fair. We can do better by our students.

Eamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party)
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The difficulty we have is that we are constrained by the public health advice, which is based on the assessment of the need to reduce the amount of contact among the population. Under the level 5 restrictions, bus services are reduced to 25% capacity. That is the real difficulty. We are reviewing the situation on an ongoing basis but any change must be agreed by the public health officials and they do not want to change the rules and standards in the middle of a period of restrictions at a particular level.

As I said, there was a particular problem with bus services in the first few days of the level 5 restrictions when the numbers of buses in operation reduced. The numbers have been rising again in recent days. The Deputy is relating what people are experiencing as they go about their daily lives. Drivers have a certain amount of discretion as to whom they allow to board their buses but we do not want to put the whole of that huge responsibility on them. They have to make a call and we will back up the drivers in whatever approach they take. We have discussed other options with the NTA and other ways of making this very difficult situation better. There is no easy solution other than possibly going back to NPHET and agreeing a different public health approach. That is not an easy thing to do at this time. We will look at the bus transport situation as part of the ongoing review of level 5 restrictions. There may be an opportunity at the interim review to change things.

There is a further issue to consider when we come out of level 5, when even the 50% capacity limit will present real difficulties as we start to return to normal. We are a slight outlier in Europe in that we probably have more restrictive measures in place than is the case in other countries. A lot of the safety issues surrounding public transport are to do with the level of mask-wearing. Compliance in this regard is pretty universal in our case. Another factor is how passengers behave and manage their own safety. Again, most people in this country are very conscious of the issues and are acting in a way that is very sensible. The review we are doing will be concerned not just with what we are doing at the current level of restrictions, which in the case of public transport involve a 25% capacity limit, but what we can do when we get back to levels 2 and 3, where we will probably find that the 50% limit is causing difficulties.

We do not want people to leave public transport completely. At the same time, we want to do the right thing in public health safety terms. That is the difficult balance we have to get right.