James Lawless (Kildare North, Fianna Fail)
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I raise the critical issue of commuter services, particularly to my constituency of Kildare North, although the problem is clearly pertinent to the whole country. According to census figures and from what I have seen living in and commuting from north Kildare for the past 15 years, the area has the largest percentage of its population commuting to work in Dublin of any area. Numerous problems have been caused by what I understand to be industrial relations difficulties at Irish Rail and Bus Éireann, with the possibility of further difficulties arising in related companies in the transport sector. Buses have failed to turn up at Kilcock, Clane and Prosperous. The routes involved are the 115 route, which services Kilcock, Enfield and Mullingar, and the 120 route, which services Clane, Prosperous and Edenderry. The 126 route to Naas is also starting to be impacted, with people being left at the side of the road unable to get to work.

8 o’clock

We are well aware of six planned service interruptions - six planned strike days - coming up over the next six weeks, many of which are at very critical times. Not only are these service interruptions becoming the norm, planned improvements that had been long sought and campaigned for and that were finally being arranged, such as the ten-minute DART, which, believe it or not, improves the Kildare timetable, and additional services through the Phoenix Park tunnel into the city centre are being affected. The Phoenix Park tunnel is a wonderful initiative but its popularity greatly exceeds the supply. It had been agreed with Irish Rail and the National Transport Authority, NTA, that extra services would be put on that route. People are struggling to fit into the carriages or to board in the morning. Extra services, carriages, rolling stock and times were to be added to that route. All of this is on hold with no end date because of what I understand to be industrial unrest across the unions. I am not sure if it is official. It may be in the case of Irish Rail but it may not be so with Dublin Bus, but things like timetable disruptions are not part of any official dispute as far as I am aware, yet management seems unable to roll out these improvements while these issues persist.

I have been asking this question for some time in the House, including yesterday on the Order of Business, so I wonder whether the Minister has gone out on strike himself in solidarity with the unions because I have not seen him being active about it. I imagine he will tell me that he is not going to get involved, so maybe that is a gesture of solidarity with the unions. Maybe the Minister is going on a go-slow himself. Will he clarify that for us?

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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It is astonishing that we again face a national transport strike during the Minister's tenure. We went through this previously with Dublin Bus and Bus Éireann. Eventually, a settlement was reached. The very hard-working staff with their five trade unions - Unite, SIPTU, the Transport Salaried Staffs Association, the Technical Engineering and Electrical Union, TEEU, and the National Bus and Rail Union, NBRU, took a very mature and responsible line at the Workplace Relations Commission, WRC. They seemed to be inching towards a settlement of around 2.5%, which is a little bit over the general public service rise which has already been agreed. Suddenly, there was a debacle and it was stopped. Many people think this was stopped on the Minister's orders because he was not prepared to give the normal pay rise in the public sector to workers in this area.

During the years of the two austerity Governments before this Government, public service obligation, PSO, funding was slashed. Back in 2007, the company received a PSO of almost €190 million down through 2008 when it received €181 million, 2009 when it received €170 million, 2010 when it received €155 million, 2011 when it received €148 million, 2012 when it received €166 million, 2013 when it received €127 million, 2014 when it received €117 million and 2015 when it received €117 million. PSO funding has been slashed while at the same time successful rail companies across Europe, like Deutsche Bahn, receive very significant subsidies from their governments that very often are up to two thirds of their turnover. We need a good public transport system.

One of the worst features of this is that the document that Iarnród Éireann apparently presented at the Labour Court set out that four important lines, namely, Limerick to Ballybrophy, Limerick Junction to Waterford, Ennis to Athenry and Gorey to Rosslare, would be closed. What on earth could be the logic or rationale for this given that we only funded the Ennis to Athenry line in recent times and the Gorey to Rosslare line is vital in the context of Brexit? The Minister needs to sort this out.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I thank the Deputies for raising this question which is, obviously, important to the travelling public in the coming weeks, whatever the outcome. I wish to comment on what Deputy Broughan said. The idea that I somehow intervened in any industrial discussions in any form recently is completely untrue. I want to put that on the record. For Deputy Broughan to say that I somehow stopped it, which is what he said, is absolute nonsense. I had no involvement whatsoever in those talks. I would like to make that absolutely clear. When the Deputy says those things, I am sure they are said with good intent and no doubt he has heard them from people who may well have been involved in some way or interested in those talks, but I can tell the Deputy categorically that this was not the case.

I share both Deputies' disappointment that the WRC-led discussions between unions and larnród Éireann ended without agreement. I have responsibility for policy and overall funding in relation to public transport. I am not, however, involved in the day-to-day operations of public transport. Industrial relations and pay are a matter for the company and its employees, not for me. Pay disputes must be solved by engagement between an employer and its staff. The State can assist through the normal industrial relations machinery available in these circumstances, and the Labour Court and WRC are the appropriate fora for these discussions. That is where a resolution was achieved in the disputes we already witnessed in the past year. I have made it clear time and again, and I will repeat it to make it absolutely clear, that I will not intervene in areas where it is not appropriate for a Minister to intervene. I will not dictate to management and unions an agreement that only they can craft because it relates to issues that only they have an insight into. The WRC and the Labour Court are ready and able to assist both parties in coming to that agreement. I am disappointed that despite the intensive efforts by the parties facilitated by the WRC and previously the Labour Court, it looks like Irish Rail commuters will face disruption in the coming weeks.

Regarding funding of our public transport services, I recognise that subvention levels were reduced during the recession. Most areas of public expenditure were. However, the PSO subvention increased last year and again this year and will increase yet further next year. Over the three years, the PSO subvention will have increased by 35% in total. In 2018, €285 million of Exchequer, or taxpayer, funds will be allocated to support the delivery of these socially necessary but financially unviable services throughout the country. As is normal, the precise allocations to the individual transport companies will be decided by the NTA in exercise of its statutory mandate and in accordance with the various contract arrangements it has in place with PSO service providers.

I will address the issues raised by Deputy Lawless. The Deputy is quite right that a number of services were impacted during the early stages of the changes to rosters. Bus Éireann has advised that it is continuing to implement measures to improve service levels further and that recently there have only been a very small number of cancellations. So far this week, the company has confirmed that there have been no cancellations due to driver unavailability. Regular updates were issued by the company with regard to delays and cancellations, and additional measures were introduced by the company to regularise operations and minimise impacts. It is understood that agreement was reached at the WRC on Tuesday last, 24 October 2017, to ensure all aspects of the Labour Court recommendation, including new rosters, will be rolled out by 12 November.

James Lawless (Kildare North, Fianna Fail)
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Unfortunately, the fact that the Minister cannot or will not get involved is cold comfort to the commuters literally left waiting in the rain at the side of the road. In respect of the figures the Minister mentioned relating to Bus Éireann, I met its chief executive this week and also discussed this with him. He was available to have the conversation, for which I credit him. Out of some 300-odd services, only seven were affected. Unfortunately, those seven services involved the same bus every day for a week, so the people who were trying to get to work at 7 a.m. and who were at the side of the road in Kilcock, Clane or Prosperous had the same experience every day.

In addition to service disruptions, we are effectively going backwards. The rail network had progressed to an extent where it was becoming competitive and attractive as a mode of transport in terms of price, comfort and convenience. Improvements such as the Phoenix Park tunnel, which are welcome and needed, are now being hindered by the fact one cannot use the services because the rolling stock is inadequate. New timetable improvements to introduce off-peak services and additional carriages are being curtailed. I do not think this is part of the official industrial action. It is probably a knock-on effect of poor relations in the management structures and the unions. It is not part of the official action but has been allowed to continue unchecked for several months. Surely, the Minister could direct on that point alone. There are issues such as the ten-minute DART and additional Phoenix Park services, which do not fall within the parameters of the current dispute, yet are being hindered for the same reason.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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The Minister has a huge responsibility to the travelling public, the company and workforce to ensure rolling strikes on 1 November, 7 November, 14 November, 23 November and 8 December do not go ahead. He needs to take action to ensure it is stopped. The public wants it settled quickly. The Minister has said he has no influence on the CEO's veto, which happened when unions and management were very close to a settlement. The Minister and Government have set the parameters on public sector pay. There are five trade unions which acted in good faith. They are willing to discuss productivity. The Minister mentioned the Labour Court report. They want the national railway company to be dynamic and successful. It has a huge future role in the context of climate change and increased population. That is against a background where this and the previous Government cut well over €100 million from the public service obligation, PSO, and now the Government is threatening to cut another four lines of our very basic rail network. We should be talking about expanding our rail network, building a Luas system in Cork and Galway and so on, not this kind of very negative, penny-pinching talk that the Minister has always engaged in with regard to public services.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I do not think Deputy Broughan was listening to what I said but never mind. If he wishes to turn deaf ears to what I say that is absolutely fine; I cannot do anything about it. I have not cut the PSO subvention. I have quoted it to the Deputy already. Perhaps he was not listening to what I said.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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The people with whom the Minister is in government cut it.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I have not cut PSO.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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They cut it by over €100 million.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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Somebody else may have cut it. The Deputy should not tell me that I cut it.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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The Minister is serving with them.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I never cut PSO.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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They are beside the Minister in Cabinet.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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PSO subvention, as I explained to the Deputy at the beginning, has gone up and will go up this year. It is not just an ambition; it is a fact. As long as I am Minister, it will continue to go up. I understand the Deputy's point of view perfectly and sympathise with much of what he says but he should not quote things to me that are factually incorrect.

I have not threatened anything in the rail network. I have not threatened to cut four lines, five lines or six lines.

Tommy Broughan (Dublin Bay North, Independent)
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It is in a report.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I have not threatened and Deputy Broughan should not say it. There may be a report but I did not write the report. The position on rail is quite simple. We believe in rail. We subsidise it very heavily because we believe in it. The rail review has come up with certain suggestions and an overview of certain alternatives. They will be decided in due course after the national planning framework has been discussed and decided on. We believe in rail. It does not mean we always believe in promoting non-economic rail lines but no decisions of any sort have been taken. I have made it absolutely clear since I came in that scare stories about massive cuts in the rail network are just not true. They are the sort of scare stories that are run from the Opposition benches because it is convenient. I have repeatedly said to colleagues of the Deputy that there is no privatisation agenda on rail on this side of the House. It is the opposite; we are continuing to increase the subvention to run an efficient well-run railway.

James Lawless (Kildare North, Fianna Fail)
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Before the clock runs down, can we deal with the substantive issue?

John Lahart (Dublin South West, Fianna Fail)
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I will give the Minister another 30 seconds to address the issue raised in the Topical Issue matter.

Shane Ross (Dublin Rathdown, Independent)
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I will address the specific issues raised by Deputy Lawless. I will refer the issues back to my Department and give the Deputy a reply afterwards because I do not know the answers. When the Deputy asks a question about a specific line, it is an operational matter. It is fair enough for me to refer it back to the Department and get the Deputy an answer. It is an operational matter. It is not up to me to micro-manage Iarnród Éireann or any part of public transport but I will ask them specifically to answer any queries the Deputy has.