Mick Wallace (Wexford, Independent)
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28. To ask the Minister for Finance further to Parliamentary Question No. 138 of 3 May 2017, if the debtor involved in Project Shift was one of the seven advised by a person (details supplied) as reported in the Comptroller and Auditor General's report on Project Eagle; the reason Project Shift was not discussed at any NAMA Northern Ireland advisory committee meetings; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [31470/17]

Mick Wallace (Wexford, Independent)
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This question deals with Project Shift, which relates to the sale by NAMA of the loans of a Northern Ireland debtor associated with German shopping centres and Cerberus, the same Cerberus that bought Project Eagle.

Until some months ago, little was known about Project Shift. However, from two previous replies to parliamentary questions we have established that it was not discussed at any NAMA Northern Ireland advisory committee meetings. NAMA cannot tell us whether Frank Cushnahan advised the debtor. NAMA will not answer any more questions and the agency has started to hide behind the commission of investigation. I hope the Minister can answer something about it.

Paschal Donohoe (Dublin Central, Fine Gael)
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As outlined to the Deputy in my written response to Parliamentary Question No. 107 on 29 June 2017, I am advised by NAMA that while Project Shift began as an asset sale it ultimately transacted as a loan sale.

While Project Shift and Project Eagle were two separate transactions and were completed as such, given that the same purchaser ultimately was involved in both transactions, it made sense to complete both sales as loan sales. As a result, the Project Shift transaction, which begun as an asset sale, was ultimately transacted as a loan sale. By doing so, NAMA was able to ensure the consistent and efficient completion of the disposal of all of the debtor's loans to Cerberus across both transactions.

The Deputy will be also aware that the previous Taoiseach signed SI 267 of 2017 on 13 June 2017 establishing a commission of investigation into Project Eagle. I am advised by NAMA that is likely that the commission of investigation, the terms of reference of which have been approved by Members of the Oireachtas, will consider that Project Shift falls within those terms of reference. On that basis, I am advised by NAMA that it considers it sensible not to comment further on these matters, but that the agency will co-operate fully with the work of the commission and, in the course of that work, NAMA will provide the commission with materials in respect of Project Shift and will answer any questions the commission may have relating to that project.

However, as was previously pointed out to the Deputy in Parliamentary Questions Nos. 15 and 31 of 18 May 2017, NAMA has advised that Project Shift was not discussed at meetings of the NAMA Northern Ireland advisory committee.

More generally, the Deputy will be aware that the former Minister for Finance and my Department are subject to one of the terms of reference of the commission. It would not be advisable for me to comment on any specific matters relating the commission's work now that it has been established and is operational. The Deputy will be aware that Mr. Justice John Cooke has been appointed to lead the commission of investigation. I am sure he will examine all relevant matters within the terms of reference.

Declan Breathnach (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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Deputy Wallace, if you could conclude with one supplementary, then we could get Deputy Burton in for a question.

Mick Wallace (Wexford, Independent)
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Okay, but it will be a long supplementary.

I have spoken to Brian Rowntree several times lately. He said to me that he had never heard of Project Shift. He said that he was led to believe by NAMA, via the chairman, Frank Daly, and Ronnie Hanna, that Project Eagle was the first sale of any element of the Northern Ireland portfolio to a third party loan acquisition group. This is a matter of concern. I cannot understand why NAMA will not tell us whether Frank Cushnahan did or did not advise the debtor. We have recently found out who the debtor is - he is a pretty serious player. Can the Minister get an answer to that?

Although little is known about Project Shift we have found out from an internal e-mail that Ron Bolger represented Cerberus on the deal. This is the same Ron Bolger that arranged a meeting between the former Minister, Deputy Noonan, and Cerberus the day before Project Eagle.

Declan Breathnach (Louth, Fianna Fail)
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Please refrain from using names.

Mick Wallace (Wexford, Independent)
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Sorry. We have been in contact with Mr. Justice Cooke about Project Shift among other things. He has asked us to preserve any evidence relating to Project Shift. However, I cannot understand why the Minister might not be interested in getting answers to the questions around NAMA in this area.

I welcome the Minister to his new portfolio and I hope he gets on well in it. By the end of his days there I was unhappy with the former Minister's manner of refusing to deal openly with the workings of NAMA. I look forward to the current Minster having a more open approach and being a little more straight with us.

Paschal Donohoe (Dublin Central, Fine Gael)
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I will always be straight with Deputy Wallace but I fear he might be disappointed with the answers I can give him on this matter. I will always try to give him the fullest information I can as a Member of the Oireachtas. Many Deputies called for the establishment of a commission of investigation in the aftermath of the Committee of Public Accounts work on aspects of Project Eagle. I cannot publicly provide in the Dáil information in regard to a transaction that may well be subject to inquiry by this commission. It is good to hear that Deputy Wallace has preserved evidence in regard to his concerns around this transaction. I hope he will be in a position to share that with the commission. That body and Justice Kirk are best placed to deal with any issues of public concern in regard to Project Eagle or, if turns out to be the case, Project Shift as well.