Dáil debates

Tuesday, 23 May 2017

5:35 pm

Photo of Ruth CoppingerRuth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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46. To ask the Tánaiste and Minister for Justice and Equality if she will remove the €130 minimum contribution for civil legal aid and €30 minimum contribution for legal advice, in view of the fact this is a barrier to access for vulnerable persons such as victims of domestic violence; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [24389/17]

Photo of Ruth CoppingerRuth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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Will the Minister remove the €130 fee for legal aid, which applies to people seeking barring orders to flee from domestic violence? It is undoubtedly a huge barrier to women seeking help. It was increased by the last Government from €50 to €130 in 2013. It is very difficult, particularly since women often experience financial abuse, as well as physical abuse.

Photo of Frances FitzgeraldFrances Fitzgerald (Dublin Mid West, Fine Gael)
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The Legal Aid Board provides civil legal aid and advice to people who cannot afford to pay for a solicitor from their own resources. Applicants are required to meet both the merits test and the financial eligibility criteria. The vast majority of applicants granted legal aid and advice are required to pay some contribution. The majority of applicants for legal aid in connection with domestic violence relief pay the minimum contribution. There is quite a lot of discretion in place in terms of guidelines for the Legal Aid Board's decision makers with regard to applications for a waiver of contributions. The guidelines provide for a sympathetic approach to be taken to applications for a waiver in cases where the application is in connection with a domestic violence matter and the person’s sole source of income is social welfare. This discretion enables the board to ensure that vulnerable persons seeking civil legal aid are in a position to access it. In 2016, fees totalling €38,700 were waived in respect of domestic violence cases.

The board has a policy role in the provision of civil legal aid and it has recently brought proposals to me on financial eligibility and other criteria. I have received that submission. In the submission, the board recommends some changes, including waiving fees for vulnerable applicants. I am very inclined to follow its advice on that because we have seen some horrific examples of domestic violence in our media in recent times. It is an horrific crime, which continues in this country. I want to ensure there are no financial barriers to women in that situation accessing legal aid. I will be examining those proposals shortly. There are other recommendations which I will have to consider but the board makes a proposal to waive the fees in those circumstances. That is also my position.

Photo of Ruth CoppingerRuth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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The Minister touched on the issue. An article by Justine McCarthy hinted at it on Sunday. There is collusion by society and the Dáil in the epidemic of violence against women. More women have been murdered in the past number of months than were murdered in the whole of last year. I particularly want to raise an issue about the Sonia Blount case in which the jury found the defendant guilty yesterday. What was most distressing is she was a young woman, a mother of a toddler, who had already escaped a serious, abusive relationship. She made the unfortunate mistake of having a few dates with somebody at work and ended up being stalked and harassed, incredibly, by this person and ultimately murdered. Will the Minister take action about a HSE-employed psychiatrist, Dr. Seán Ó Domhnaill, who testified in the case and went on a tirade of victim-blaming on behalf of the defendant? He actually wondered in court whether a residual part of Ms Blount actually liked Mr. Locke and knew she was going to meet him in that hotel room. It was an absolutely disgusting display of somebody who is getting paid by the State colluding in an epidemic of male violence against women and blaming the victim.

Photo of Frances FitzgeraldFrances Fitzgerald (Dublin Mid West, Fine Gael)
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I am very reluctant to discuss individual court details and evidence given by professionals in courts on the floor of the Dáil.

I have not seen any collusion in the approach to domestic violence taken in this House. I recently launched the second strategy on domestic violence and considerable work is being done by all the stakeholders and front-line services involved in this area. The Government is providing increasing support. I accept, however, that there will always be requests for more support and I am open to examining these requests. Tusla provides funding for refuges.

I have, in the Domestic Violence Bill, taken on board the vast majority of the recommendations made to me by the various stakeholders. The Bill is on Committee Stage and I hope to progress it quickly to ensure we have much stronger law which provides stronger penalties for perpetrators and more supports for victims of domestic violence. We have also implemented a campaign targeted at bystanders to highlight the importance of greater societal awareness, one of the issues raised by Deputy Coppinger.

We have seen extraordinary, horrible and upsetting examples of domestic violence which have led to the deaths of young women. Many other women are suffering domestic violence, sometimes in silence, and we must do everything possible to break the cycle and ensure they can escape.

5:45 pm

Photo of Pat GallagherPat Gallagher (Donegal, Fianna Fail)
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I ask Deputy Coppinger to focus on the content of the question.

Photo of Ruth CoppingerRuth Coppinger (Dublin West, Solidarity)
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I do not doubt that the Minister has introduced measures and will introduce further measures. However, the point the journalist in question was making is that Deputies jump up and down in the Dáil, quite rightly, about violence against the elderly in rural areas and so forth but do not jump up and down to the same extent about the epidemic of women being targeted and murdered. We must call out the toxic masculinity that is bred and reinforced by society, whereby men are encouraged to think they should be dominant, aggressive and seek to control women.

Alongside the measures to which the Minister referred, we need a criminal law that makes an offence of domestic violence. We also need emergency out of hours barring orders and legislation against stalking, which should be a ground for seeking a protection order. As we saw in the case to which I referred, stalking is an indication of more serious danger. In addition, protection orders should be served by the Garda rather than victims, the right of a possible perpetrator to interrogate a victim must be removed and child contact centres must be established. A slew of measures is required.

Photo of Frances FitzgeraldFrances Fitzgerald (Dublin Mid West, Fine Gael)
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Domestic violence is a very serious issue. I can only agree with the Deputy that the more people talk about it, the better. A large number of men are working very hard to change current attitudes which result in an extraordinary level of violence against women. I had thought and hoped domestic violence would decrease but unfortunately that is not the case.

Domestic violence is often linked to alcohol and drug abuse and we must tackle those issues. Members must be clear in their attitudes to alcohol, which will be an important part of dealing with this domestic violence.

Many of the measures to which Deputy Coppinger referred are included in the new Domestic Violence Bill. For example, the legislation provides better law and stronger provisions on harassment, revenge porn and stalking. I have been advised that it would be difficult to capture an exact definition of domestic violence in the Bill and it would not be the best way to protect victims. If I am convinced it is the best way to protect victims, I will act, but my advice is that existing law and the changes I am introducing in the Domestic Violence Bill will provide a stronger provision than trying to provide such an exact definition. The Bill is on Committee Stage and we will have an opportunity to discuss it again.