Kathleen Funchion (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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19. To ask the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs the measures she is implementing as part of the new affordable childcare scheme to tackle the issue of poor working conditions of the early years sector; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [15277/17]

Kathleen Funchion (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I am sure the Minister is aware that working conditions for the early years sector are getting worse and while there are positive steps such as the introduction of the affordable childcare scheme and a welcome focus on improved standards to be introduced, I am concerned that there has not been sufficient consideration of the implications for the work force, that is, the increased administrative pressures and costs which are only set to grow. I am also very concerned that the voices and concerns of workers are not being heard throughout this whole process of change. What measures is the Minister implementing as part of the new affordable childcare scheme to tackle the problem of poor working conditions in the early years sector and the high turnover rate of staff and the acute staffing shortages?

Katherine Zappone (Dublin South West, Independent)
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I accept that wages in the early years sector are unacceptably low and that working conditions are poor. This affects the quality of service offered to children. Addressing these issues is a priority concern for me as Minister for Children and Youth Affairs. As my Department is not the employer, however, I have no direct control over wages or working conditions.

Fundamentally, the problem relates to the historically low level of public investment in early years services. In last year’s budget, I secured an increase of 35% in funding for the early years sector and I shall keep pushing for further investment. The total level of investment is well below the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development, OECD, average of 0.8% of gross domestic product, GDP, and still further behind the United Nations International Children's Emergency Fund, UNICEF, recommendation of 1% of GDP to secure an early years system that is high quality, affordable and accessible for all.

Within my Department several changes have been implemented to support the professionalisation of the early years sector. For example, within the early childhood care and education, ECCE, programme, the higher capitation grant provides additional financial support where the preschool leader is qualified to national framework of qualifications, NFQ, level 7 or above. It is a measure that supports the employment of more highly qualified staff, though it cannot guarantee higher wages. To support higher qualifications, we have also recently awarded a learner fund bursary to assist attainment of level 7 and it is hoped to repeat this process for those graduating in time for the 2018 intake of children into those services.

The affordable childcare scheme will significantly increase the level of public investment in the sector and it will create a framework for further future investment.

To help support the future development of the affordable childcare scheme, as well as the ECCE programme, officials within the Department have commenced work on scoping the requirements to inform a tender process for the independent review of the cost of quality child care.

Kathleen Funchion (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I thank the Minister for her answer and welcome her acknowledgement that wages in the sector are quite low. The Oireachtas Joint Committee on Children and Youth Affairs is preparing a report and I am its rapporteur. We have been speaking to workers throughout the country. The wages do not reflect the qualifications and expectations of those working in the sector. I understand there has been an increase in capitation rates but it is not enough. There are many young people coming through the system who want to stay in the child care profession but cannot because they are either on or under the minimum wage. Many are signing on during the summer months and some people are caught in an anomaly because they are considered self-employed but do not enjoy any of the benefits of being self-employed. There are many different angles on this. One of the key points workers in the sector make is that they do not want their voices to be forgotten in this affordable childcare scheme.

Katherine Zappone (Dublin South West, Independent)
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It is great that the committee is doing this work because it provides another opportunity to hear those voices. I look forward to receiving the report because I know how committed the Deputy and her colleagues are in this regard.

I have also met with a range of representative bodies from the sector regarding the issue of wages and working conditions, including representatives from the Irish Municipal, Public and Civil Trade Union, IMPACT, and the Services, Industrial, Professional and Technical Union, SIPTU.

I have established the National Collaborative Forum for the Early Years Care and Education Sector, the early years forum, to allow issues of relevance to be discussed with key stakeholders. The forum has enabled consultation and engagement between me, key Department of Children and Youth Affairs officials, and key representatives of the sector. I have personally chaired the three meetings of the forum. At its second meeting, I requested that a section of the group's members meet up, outside the context of the forum, to discuss issues relating to wages, working conditions and the professionalisation of the sector and I look forward to hearing from them in that regard.

Kathleen Funchion (Carlow-Kilkenny, Sinn Fein)
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I welcome the fact that the Minister met the unions on this issue. As she acknowledges, underinvestment is the elephant in the room. Capitation rates are not high enough to subsidise an increase in pay for fair wages. What is the Minister's view of the introduction of a fair pay scale or a living wage? Would she and the Department support that? Government should advocate that all contracts costed by the State should provide at least for a living wage and this should begin with the affordable childcare scheme. Built into this should be a requirement that it is passed on to the workforce employed to deliver the service. A part of the concern is that the increase in capitation rates will not be passed on as wages because many services are not even ticking over and cannot afford to pass on that increase. We propose that it would be passed on to the workforce.

Katherine Zappone (Dublin South West, Independent)
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I am aware of the low wages in the sector. I am aware that the average wage is only just above the minimum wage and is below the living wage. I have done a lot of work in my political life to encourage us to move towards the living wage and would love to see the early years and education and care sector become an example of that, especially when 18% of staff are now qualified to level 7 or above on the national framework of qualifications yet they are generally receiving payments of €11 per hour for room leaders, €10.56 for educators and assistants and €13.87 for managers. I am not, however, directly responsible because I am not their employer but we have found very innovative ways of trying to provide investment in the people who are working there, as well as thinking of ways to ensure that somehow these can be passed on and supported by the people who are working. There is much farther to go in that regard.