Dáil debates

Wednesday, 7 December 2016

1:45 pm

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

1. To ask the Taoiseach if Prime Minister May mentioned her intention to reduce the UK corporation tax rate when they were speaking last. [37350/16]

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

2. To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on the meeting of the British-Irish Council which he attended on 25 November 2016. [38639/16]

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

3. To ask the Taoiseach when he last spoke to the British Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May; and if he raised with her potential issues relating to the Good Friday Agreement arising from Brexit. [38777/16]

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

4. To ask the Taoiseach if he has held discussions on Brexit with the governments of Gibraltar and the Isle of Man; and, if not, his plans to do so. [38621/16]

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 to 4, inclusive, together.

I attended the British-Irish Council which was hosted by the Welsh Government in Cardiff on 25 November. The Council continued our discussions on the emerging impacts of Brexit for member administrations. The themes raised included the implications for the economy and trade, the common travel area and relations with the European Union. I gave an overview of the Government’s preparations for Brexit, the all-island civic dialogue and the outcomes of the North-South Ministerial Council.

The summit also provided an opportunity for Ministers with particular responsibility for early years policy to consider a collaborative paper prepared by the Council’s early years' work sector on the importance of creating strong foundations for children and families to thrive. The Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, Deputy Katherine Zappone, attended the Council on this occasion and gave the Government’s perspective in this regard.

I also had a scheduled bilateral meeting in Cardiff with the First Minister of Scotland, Ms Nicola Sturgeon.

The Isle of Man was represented at the British-Irish Council by its newly appointed Chief Minister, Mr. Howard Quayle. Brexit and its implications for all member administrations were discussed at both the most recent summit and the previous extraordinary summit which also took place in Wales. On these occasions the Chief Minister, Mr. Quayle, and his predecessor, Mr, Allan Bell, set out quite clearly the impacts on the Isle of Man of the UK withdrawal from the European Union. I have no immediate plans to meet the Government of Gibraltar. The relationship of the Crown dependencies and overseas territories such as Gibraltar with the United Kingdom and the European Union is a matter to be handled by these administrations, in consultation with the UK Government or Brussels, as appropriate.

I last saw the Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, at the October meeting of the European Council. While I did not have formal bilateral meetings with her on that occasion, I did talk informally to my counterparts, including the Prime Minister, during the course of discussions and on the margins of the meeting. When I met the Prime Minister in London in July, we agreed to work together to build on the continuing strength and closeness of the UK-Ireland relationship. A key priority is to ensure the peace process, including the Good Friday Agreement and the various successor Agreements, is protected in any future arrangement that might emerge from negotiations. The Government will continue to work closely with the UK Government and the Northern Ireland Executive, as required, to protect the peace process.

The Prime Minister has not mentioned any proposal regarding the UK corporation tax rate to me, although I am aware of such proposals being considered. Our discussions focused largely on common priorities in the context of the withdrawal of the United Kingdom from the European Union.

Photo of Seán Ó FearghaílSeán Ó Fearghaíl (Kildare South, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

There are three Deputies who wish to contribute. If they take three minutes each, we will have an opportunity to go back to the Taoiseach.

Photo of Micheál MartinMicheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

In his reply to my question the Taoiseach says the Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, did not mention the corporation tax issue to him. Did he discuss the matter with her in any shape or form? With other elements, Ireland's corporation tax rate has been an important and significant element of our industrial policy for more than 30 years in attracting inward investment. It is something Ireland has sought to protect in international agreements. It was, for example, attached to the protocol to the Lisbon treaty when the issue was raised during the referendum. In the first referendum many people who were against the Lisbon treaty and the European Union actually insisted that the corporation tax rate was in jeopardy and that our tax sovereignty could be eroded.

The second time around we negotiated and attached a protocol to the Lisbon treaty, ensuring the corporation tax rate was a matter for Ireland.

We now face significant competition in this regard. Northern Ireland is anxious to reduce its corporation tax rate, and had been prior to the Brexit vote. The United Kingdom is now indicating it could head to 16% or 15%. The United States, under the new President, is also indicating this. Does the Government have any plans with regard to these decisions being made by others, which they are entitled to make, and our industrial model for the next ten to 20 years? Has the Government commissioned any work or research on developing a new enterprise strategy or a new approach, given the fairly fundamental changes that are occurring, not least the Brexit decision itself which represents a fundamental structural change with regard to our economic model? It will change dramatically the model we have experienced for almost 50 years, since we joined the European Union. There is a need for fresh thinking in this regard. I would appreciate if the Taoiseach indicated whether the Government has seriously considered developing a new radical approach to enterprise and a strategic approach in this regard?

1:55 pm

Photo of Gerry AdamsGerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The meeting of the British Irish Council was the first which the British Prime Minister had the opportunity to attend since she was elevated to the office, and the first since the Brexit referendum, but she did not show up and neither did the senior British Minister put in charge of Brexit, David Davis. My colleague, the deputy First Minister, Martin McGuinness, rightly in my view criticised Prime Minister May for this, as did the Scottish First Minister, Nicola Sturgeon. Does the Taoiseach think it is acceptable for the British Prime Minister to miss a meeting of one of the most important forums that exists between all the Governments on the islands? This was an opportunity, and the Taoiseach is a very regular attender at all these forums, to engage with all the other administrations.

If possible, I would like the Dáil to be given an update on the bilateral meeting the Taoiseach had with First Minister Sturgeon. The Taoiseach knows the British Government is holding a vote in its Parliament today on triggering Article 50. Last night, it agreed to publish its plan for leaving the EU before the end of March. Has the Taoiseach or his officials had any discussions with the British Government in recent days? I understand the Minister, Deputy Flanagan, is in London today to meet British politicians, but I am more concerned to find out the state of play between the senior officials on both sides. As far as the visit of the Minister, Deputy Flanagan, is concerned, will the Taoiseach assure us he will press the case for the Government in London to recognise the rights of citizens in the North who voted to remain? A very particular conundrum will arise. If the British pull the North out of the European Union, those of us with Irish passports will still have European citizenship. How do we get the guarantees and the other safeguards that go with this if we are outside the European Union?

I was in Stormont on Monday, and in my constituency and in Belfast there is still quite a lot of concern as the debate goes on. Even though it is not in the news every day it does not mean people are not concerned about it. This is the case in Louth, all the Border counties and Belfast. Many people are justifiably concerned about job losses and the other difficulties which will arise. Deputy Martin Kenny has told me the only surviving shop in Blacklion, County Cavan, which is the post office, is in danger of closing. The owners say this is due to the impact of Brexit and the loss of custom. Here we see a way of life as well as a livelihood being broken down in all this. Will the Taoiseach give us an update on these matters, and his opinion on the state of play since last we discussed this issue?

Photo of Brendan HowlinBrendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I asked the Taoiseach whether he had met the Government of Gibraltar, which might seem like a left-field question. The Taoiseach's response was that as a Crown dependency he did not meet it and is not contemplating it. The Chief Minister of Gibraltar, Fabian Picardo, is seeking a special status for Gibraltar, where 96% of the people voted to remain. He says there is an existential threat to its survival. It is in favour of the four freedoms, including the free movement of people, because to operate it is dependent on 12,000 people moving in every day. I understand its official position is to seek a special status to be included in the scope of the European Union treaties without formally being a member. It is citing the deal and arrangement for Andorra, Lichtenstein and San Marino in this regard. It would be useful for the Irish Government at least to explore what options in the British negotiating positions are been discussed for Gibraltar and whether they have any relevance with regard to the situation on the island of Ireland, as referenced by Deputy Adams.

Photo of Enda KennyEnda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

In the course of the meeting with Prime Minister May we did not discuss the British corporation tax rate. I have made it clear on many occasions we are supportive of the devolution of authority to the Northern Ireland Executive Assembly to be able to determine itself the question of a reduction in its corporation tax rate, which would approach ours here. It would make it easier in many ways to be able to speak about the island economy of Ireland. The First Minister and deputy First Minister are either in China or returning from China. On these occasions we have always made our diplomatic services available to the First Minister and deputy First Minister for Northern Ireland, in respect of attracting industry and job opportunities. I may have referred to this in my conversation, but we did not discuss the British Government's intentions or discussions about reducing its tax rates.

As Deputy Martin is well aware, tax policy at European level is a matter of unanimity but each country has it enshrined in the treaties that it has individual competence in respect of the rate of tax, where ours is at 20%. The Deputy made a valid point on where we are looking to five, ten or 15 years out. This is what the essential focus of the European Union should be. If it becomes obsessed with the question of what might happen to the United Kingdom or what facilities will eventually be negotiated, then Europe itself needs to look to its own laurels and how it should become more competitive than it is that present. We have always tried at European level to be as competitive as the United States, but we have never been able to measure up to it.

We cannot have a situation where some countries have a youth unemployment rate of between 30% and 50%. It is a recipe for disaster and leads to frustration, cynicism, anger and extremism. This is a question of politics and European leaders, countries and Governments must decide politically where they want to be. When Britain leaves the Union we will still have a Union of 450 million people, a Single Market and a well-developed region that needs to focus on giving these young people opportunities and inspiration. This can only happen by investment, through political decisions in these areas. It is a valid point and European leaders need to focus not just on the now but on the time to come so these decisions can be made.

The Deputy will have noted the comments from Mr. Barnier and from the German chamber of commerce. I have explained our country's position to Chancellor Merkel, President Hollande, President Tusk, President Juncker and all the other leaders. This is reflected in many of their comments, in that they understand there is a peace process here, that it is supported by Europe and is something we must continue to support, and that Ireland as a country stands to be the most impacted by the Brexit decision, particularly if it is a hard Brexit which might mean withdrawal from the Single Market and-or from the customs union.

These are issues for discussion and negotiation, which will have to take place. I do not have any control over the Prime Minister's schedule. I have attended all of the British-Irish Council meetings of the past few years and the deputy First Minister is now the longest-serving member, having been there for many years. I made the point that it would add status and importance to the British-Irish Council were the previous Prime Minister, David Cameron, to attend. He attended one or more of the first meetings but did not go subsequently. It is an important entity in its own right, along with the crown dependencies. The Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Charles Flanagan, is in London today and I confirm to Deputy Adams that our officials, under the direction of a section in the Department of the Taoiseach, are in constant negotiation with Northern Ireland officials and with officials in London, as well as in Brussels.

The common travel area was brought up. When I met with Prime Minister May we agreed that nobody should lose any benefits from the common travel area and that citizens, and everybody here who has passports when Brexit happens, will be entitled to Irish citizenship and to travel up and down and over and back, not just for social occasions but also for work. The common travel area has existed since the 1920s and we do not expect or intend to lose it. When the negotiations are concluded I want to see co-guarantorship, on a continuing basis, of the Good Friday Agreement and its successor agreements.

Deputy Howlin asked about Gibraltar but I do not want to put the two things together. It is an overseas dependency and there is a special circumstance in Ireland, with a land border and a peace process involving direct funds such as peace funds. We have made the case very strongly at European level and we have to build on that for the future. We keep in contact with Brussels and are well aware of what is happening with Gibraltar. We have two people on the task force, set up by Mr. Barnier who is conducting the discussions and will be leading the negotiations when Article 50 is triggered. We will have an accurate and consistent flow of information which we will bring to the attention of the House at all times.