Thomas Byrne (Meath East, Fianna Fail)
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26. To ask the Minister for Education and Skills the progress being made in his plans to double the number of apprenticeships by 2020; and his views on the barriers to expanding recruitment in the apprenticeship sector. [35412/16]

Thomas Byrne (Meath East, Fianna Fail)
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This question seeks to ask the Minister to outline the progress he is making to double the number of apprenticeships by 2020 and if he would describe to the House the barriers there to expanding recruitment in the apprenticeship sector. Will he comment on the gender divide in apprenticeships as well? It is a feature about which people are concerned.

Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)
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I thank the Deputy for his question. I share with him and most of the House the belief that we have undervalued apprenticeships, and particularly during the crash they were totally undermined. We have committed to doubling the number of registered apprentices, providing 50,000 apprenticeship and traineeship places up to 2020. In the coming weeks, I will publish a detailed three-year plan setting out how we plan to deliver on this commitment. The plan will include details of our approach to managing the pipeline of new apprenticeships identified through the 2015 call for proposals and will set out the timing of a new call for proposals. The plan will set out specific annual targets, as well as bringing forward a range of specific actions to enable, support and streamline the development of new apprenticeships and traineeships.

In recent months, we have seen the first of the new apprenticeships with the new insurance practitioner apprenticeship launching and the industrial electrical engineer apprenticeship getting under way. Further new apprenticeships are due to launch in the coming months in various sectors, including medical devices, polymer processing and financial services. As well as developments in new apprenticeships, registrations in the traditional 27 craft trades are rising. In 2015 there were 3,153 registrations, which represents a significant recovery since the crash. SOLAS has recently projected that by 2020, the figure will grow to 5,587.

There are potential barriers to the delivery of these targets but by taking a planned approach, it will allow us to identify potential bottlenecks systematically and overcome them. There is a clear roadmap for the delivery of a new apprenticeship, including an industry-led consortium identifying a skills need and developing an occupational profile, collaboration with a training partner to develop a suitable curriculum for validation and quality assurance. It is a demanding process but we must follow it to ensure this is a quality stream.

I acknowledge the Deputy's statement that we have a problem with gender. We probably have a problem in selling the benefit of such an approach to employers, parents and others who make decisions. I am very keen to promote this vigorously with both the consumer and employer side.

Thomas Byrne (Meath East, Fianna Fail)
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The Minister is holding the fort for the Minister of State, Deputy Halligan, with these questions. I will not complain about a senior Minister doing so but Deputy Halligan was absent during jobs questions as well. I know he is doing important business for the State around the world. That is crucial and we welcome that.

The programme for Government's ambition is to double the number of apprenticeships to provide a total of 31,000 places. I hope it is more than a simple ambition and more of a target that can be disposed of. The last Government had a similar ambition but there was very little policy driving it. I look forward to the comprehensive policy in that regard. We need more than simply ambitions and targets and we need to change the entire mindset. There are highly developed countries like Switzerland where one might be picked for an apprenticeship or academia at a very early age. I am not saying that is the way to go but it shows a level of faith in apprenticeships in that they are considered of equal value to academic life. It is something we could look at. We want to see what is happening and get a wider range of apprenticeships. There is a traditional view of apprenticeships and that perception must be changed. It will involve all of us.

Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)
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I agree with Deputy Byrne. The ambition is to have 73 new areas for apprenticeships, meaning we got from the current 27 areas to 100 areas. As the Deputy knows, the employer takes on an employment contract and pays people from day one. It is slightly different from the State rolling out a programme and the employer must buy into it. This must be done by the assembling of consortia. It is a genuine partnership between the State and employers and we must grow momentum.

I agree that we and our employers have undervalued this area. It is a new culture of thinking within enterprise and we have just spoken about funding for institutes of technologies. This is an important avenue and role for institutes of technology and we must drive this to deliver it together. The regional skills fora will be a big element in how we get the rubber to hit the road, as they say, on apprenticeships.

Thomas Byrne (Meath East, Fianna Fail)
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Will incentives be put in place for companies to become involved with new apprenticeship schemes? It must be widened not just through demand and new categories of apprenticeships. Companies will have to come on board to provide these. What incentives could be proposed?

Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)
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The Apprenticeship Council of Ireland examined this and introduced the concept of a much shorter apprenticeship. The traditional model was a four-year apprenticeship with considerable periods. It has been shortened, with a shorter period in which the employer would pay. At this stage we have not considered employer incentives. The employers recognise that such positions must be regarded as employment posts and they must meet national minimum wage and other criteria. The State would provide the training element. The biggest contribution we can make is to streamline the concept of a new apprenticeship to get it through the various curricular developments, quality assurance, approvals and support the employers in providing an environment in which an apprenticeship can be delivered and apprentices can get through. That is instead of a financial incentive. I am open to discussing this. We have not set aside money for providing incentives. This should be a quality programme and, like other countries, employers should support this approach.

Thomas Byrne (Meath East, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister and perhaps I will come forward with some ideas for incentivisation as this needs to happen and we need to broaden our horizons as a nation. We must get companies used to this, as apprenticeships are traditionally viewed as something that happen in the construction sector. That is important and there are issues there as well but there is potential for this process if it is rolled out in a proper way and the mindset can be changed. If companies are on board with the new categories of apprenticeships, there can be change, although there may need to be some effort to persuade companies to take on apprentices in certain cases. There could be some kind of incentive scheme.

I think some sort of incentive scheme should be put in place to incentivise and encourage companies to get involved. It does not necessarily have to cost money and I am not asking for money to be put aside for it. There could be an advertising campaign to try to highlight what is going on. I do not think the apprenticeship idea has seeped into the public imagination yet. The Government has an obligation to make sure that happens.

Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)
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If we are looking at incentives, I do not think there should be a subsidy. When things went wrong in the construction sector after the crash came, the number of apprenticeships decreased from approximately 9,000 to approximately 1,000. The whole thing was wiped out overnight. We need to build a robust system in support of employers in order that they can continue to recruit apprentices, even in bad times. As we seek to build that infrastructure, perhaps we should look at how we can support capability and capacity-building within employers who participate in apprenticeship programmes. I do not think offering a subsidy is the route we should take in this regard. I think we should approach the issue raised by the Deputy by investing in a structure that will sustain us into the long term.